If by "bog standard fine" you mean Penalty Fare of £50/100 plus the fare due - no. A Penalty Fare cannot be retrospectively issued.
You'll need to come back on here for advice as sugggested - but possibly not the bog standard Penalty Fare no (but they MIGHT ask for a similar sum eg £100 ish, but no £50 prompt payment discount), this is why refusing the Penalty Fare almost always ends up costing more if things dealt with after the event - but head back here if you hear from them.
Will do. Thank you
We don't know
This is where there has been a massive miscommunication…this was never explained to me in the moment, despite me asking multiple questions about why this was the case and what my options were. She asked if I was willing to provide more details and I said no because I still don’t understand the issue… and like I said she walked off … I just don’t understand why this information isn’t more accessible for people or can be shared there and then, just as it would be with any other fine
It seems unlikely that the inspector told you nothing at all about why your Advance ticket was invalid. If you refuse to pay the Penalty Fare and claim ignorance, and also fail to provide your details, you commit an offence anyway; you are legally required to give your name and address to an authorised person on the railway. It seems most likley the staff member thought, rightly or wrongly, that you were being difficult, and hence has submitted your ticket details to the revenue protection team to follow up.
It's your responsibility to make sure you have the correct ticket before boarding a train. Although some apps and webaites could be clearer when displaying restrictions the information would've been visible at the time you purchased your ticket.
I don’t believe I could have been seen as being ‘difficult’ in any way, shape or form. Nothing ‘difficult’ about politely asking a few questions to gain some understanding.
What I still don’t understand is why she couldn’t have said ‘if you don’t provide your details now … x,y&z will be the outcome’. At what point was I supposed to know that her asking if I am willing to provide details and me saying not really because I don’t know what I’m giving them for is a criminal offence…THESE are the things I am referring to not being shared correctly or at all for that matter
Attached are the views given when purchasing a ticket on trainline, not a pop up or warning as such but a brief description under advance single of what the ticket allows.
Very helpful, thank you.
Failing to give your details when asked is being difficult.
I was asked if I was willing to give them and I simply said I didn’t understand why I was being asked that … clearly we have very different views on being difficult.
Unfortunately for you the Railway Byelaws which you broke by not providing your details don't say that you are entitled to an explanation. Had the police been called you could have been arrested.
Guess that's the end of that then.... sorry you don't like, or agree with the advice given to you
Arrested?!! For buying a wrong ticket … what has the world come to?!
I have been very thankful to yourself and the others who have offered useful advice. It has been much appreciated
www.northernrailway.co.uk
Thank you for your insight.
You wouldn't have been arrested over the wrong ticket. You would have been arrested for failure to supply your details. You may want to look at Byelaw 23.
Byelaw 23.2 states that the nature of the offence has to be given in general terms. A statement that that the ticket held by the passenger is invalid would seem to meet that requirement.
Byelaw 23.2 states that the nature of the offence has to be given in general terms. A statement that that the ticket held by the passenger is invalid would seem to meet that requirement.
Like I said, I was unaware of any of this at the time and can’t seem to understand why this wouldn’t have been explained if this is as serious as I am being told
Hard to know obviously, but to have a guess I suspect she just gets fed up with dealing with the numerous people who for one reason or another (many deliberate, but I don't mean you) who just refuse to answer questions / dodge fares deliberately etc etc, and has better things to do with other tickets to check and duties on the train. If she thinks she has the info needed from the ticket scan data that will just go to the back office and she can let the staff there deal with it. Or she may have just thought 'I'll just forget this one' and may do nothing further and you may not hear any more about this.
That’s really helpful. Thank you
Can I bet you don’t either?
The problem to my mind is they sell these Advance tickets with heavy discounts but in exchange for that you loose all flexibility - I never buy them unless I get a decent discount off the normal fare as I do not want to sacrifice flexibility unless I'm getting enough money off to make that worthwhile. But this is often not made abundantly clear when buying your ticket - where the headline cheapest price is designed to make that ticket choice look attractive, when it has downsides of being worthless on any other train service apart from the one specified on the ticket.
Mistakes happen unfortunately, they’re learning curves.
Absolutely agree. Like I said, having done this on occasion before and not having a problem with it I never realised the issue. At least now I do!
Hard to be sure - cases on here people usually hear between a few weeks or a couple of months - but the reason people say up to 6 months is because they can't prosecute the offence of fare evasion after 6 months from the date IIRC - but you do need to thus keep an eye on hard copy post during this period at the address that would be linked to your bank account payment method I guess. Keep an eye out for e-mails and check spam folders too to be sure.
That’s really helpful. Thank you very much!
