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hello,
i purposefully purchased a child ticket from london paddington to reading on sunday, and want to pay my penalty fare.
i’ve tried to find the penalty website but nothing shows up, and when i try to find my case it says it’s not in the system. i want to pay this before the 21-day period so i can pay the lowest fare possible. what can i do?
hello,
i purposefully purchased a child ticket from london paddington to reading on sunday, and want to pay my penalty fare.
i’ve tried to find the penalty website but nothing shows up, and when i try to find my case it says it’s not in the system. i want to pay this before the 21-day period so i can pay the lowest fare possible. what can i do?
Are you certain you have actually had a penalty fare?
Sometimes people see the posters at stations about penalty fares but don’t realise there are other sanctions like being reported for investigation which is the start of the pathway to prosecution.
If you had a penalty fare you would or should have been issued with appropriate paperwork at the time. Usually slip of paper.
Please upload a copy of whatever you were given. Remove identifying information on it. Name reference number etc.
Are you certain you have actually had a penalty fare?
Sometimes people see the posters at stations about penalty fares but don’t realise there are other sanctions like being reported for investigation which is the start of the pathway to prosecution.
If you had a penalty fare you would or should have been issued with appropriate paperwork at the time. Usually slip of paper.
Please upload a copy of whatever you were given. Remove identifying information on it. Name reference number etc.
Thanks. Yes. I agree wait a few days for it to get on their system. But be mindful of the prompt payment deadline or indeed the appeal deadline.
If you have bought child tickets when over 16 before I’m not sure I would draw attention to myself by appealing this however. Though some may disagree.
You should consider getting a Railcard. Check the different railcards to see which is the best one for your circumstances.
Well you should appeal on the grounds that it was not issued in accordance with the regulations. They can't even get the statement saying what regulations it was issued under correct let alone fully comply with them! There is really no excuse for this. How hard is it to follow a mandatory checklist when designing such a template?
Appeal under 16(3)(a) after deciding what parts of 5 have been disregarded:
Regarding (h), the information that is presented is incomplete and thus incorrect and is anyway not presented in the clear form of "a statement" as required;
Regarding (i), you say you did what it says and it didn't work so the information presented appears to be wrong and therefore not compliant.
And what of the highly significant (2A)(a)(ii), which represents part of the outcome of a significant public consultation? Does GWR feel entitled to ignore this?
Worse, not only is that requirement disregarded, incorrect information is given as it states prominently "You must pay amount owing by 14/September/2025" with no caveats which is just plain wrong, contradicting both (h) and (2A)(a)(ii).
Following an appeal, I'd suggest you take this up with the authorities (Transport Focus, MP, ORR, DfT, the press) and put pressure on them to determine how many other GWR Penalty Fares were issued using this non-compliant template and should have been deemed unenforceable and cancelled and to try to see that people who paid get refunded with interest and compensation. The status of any court proceedings following non-payment may also need looking into i.e. whether information presented to a court may now be found to have been misleading and whether or not any cases may need to be reopened.
== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==
It's arguable too that the section saying what an appeal should include is also not compliant as it does not conform to what the regulations say an appeal must include. Ref 16(2)(b)
Anyone who doesn't actually read the wrongly-referenced regulations may have been tricked into making an appeal that doesn't actually count as one, or deterred from making an appeal by not realising there are additional grounds available that are simply not mentioned.
(I think the next iteration of these regulations need to be tightened to explicitly stamp out these things, not that the train companies seem to care about complying and the authorities seem toothless at enforcing them. Maybe it's time for criminal sanctions for negligent non-compliance...)
I doubt the OP will have the appetite to challenge the PF on the grounds put forward, and would rather just pay and move on with their lives lesson learnt (after all that is what they have come to ask about - how can I pay?).
I would note that there are other options for paying, being a phone number or visiting a GWR station, so suggest if they still can’t do it online in a couple of days that they pursue one of those options.
Thanks. Yes. I agree wait a few days for it to get on their system. But be mindful of the prompt payment deadline or indeed the appeal deadline.
If you have bought child tickets when over 16 before I’m not sure I would draw attention to myself by appealing this however. Though some may disagree.
You should consider getting a Railcard. Check the different railcards to see which is the best one for your circumstances.
thank you for your advice. i indeed do not want to draw any attention and just pay the fare, lesson learnt move on and have already looked into a railcard. i also have no reason to appeal - i made the mistake, i got caught, i pay the PF - my mistake!
== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==
Well you should appeal on the grounds that it was not issued in accordance with the regulations. They can't even get the statement saying what regulations it was issued under correct let alone fully comply with them! There is really no excuse for this. How hard is it to follow a mandatory checklist when designing such a template?
Appeal under 16(3)(a) after deciding what parts of 5 have been disregarded:
Regarding (h), the information that is presented is incomplete and thus incorrect and is anyway not presented in the clear form of "a statement" as required;
Regarding (i), you say you did what it says and it didn't work so the information presented appears to be wrong and therefore not compliant.
And what of the highly significant (2A)(a)(ii), which represents part of the outcome of a significant public consultation? Does GWR feel entitled to ignore this?
Worse, not only is that requirement disregarded, incorrect information is given as it states prominently "You must pay amount owing by 14/September/2025" with no caveats which is just plain wrong, contradicting both (h) and (2A)(a)(ii).
Following an appeal, I'd suggest you take this up with the authorities (Transport Focus, MP, ORR, DfT, the press) and put pressure on them to determine how many other GWR Penalty Fares were issued using this non-compliant template and should have been deemed unenforceable and cancelled and to try to see that people who paid get refunded with interest and compensation. The status of any court proceedings following non-payment may also need looking into i.e. whether information presented to a court may now be found to have been misleading and whether or not any cases may need to be reopened.
== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==
It's arguable too that the section saying what an appeal should include is also not compliant as it does not conform to what the regulations say an appeal must include. Ref 16(2)(b)
Anyone who doesn't actually read the wrongly-referenced regulations may have been tricked into making an appeal that doesn't actually count as one, or deterred from making an appeal by not realising there are additional grounds available that are simply not mentioned.
(I think the next iteration of these regulations need to be tightened to explicitly stamp out these things, not that the train companies seem to care about complying and the authorities seem toothless at enforcing them. Maybe it's time for criminal sanctions for negligent non-compliance...)
this may be because i had two incorrect child tickets on my phone? one was for me to use and the other for my friend, not sure if that would change what the notice says
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