Passengers bail from train near Wimbledon 2/10

[HarleyDavidson]

Really? No we still have a laugh, best move depot

And no this country isn’t pathetic, a bloody pain some times and easy to believe some of the ****e said by others but still a great place to live.

It's an ASLEF thing. You have to watch what you say.

Basically you have to be pathetically "PC".

TBQH, if you don't think you're going to like criticism or be on the end of some mickey taking, then go crawl back under the sheets. Because it's a big bad world out there!

 

[61653 HTAFC]

It's an ASLEF thing. You have to watch what you say.

Basically you have to be pathetically "PC".

TBQH, if you don't think you're going to like criticism or be on the end of some mickey taking, then go crawl back under the sheets. Because it's a big bad world out there!

If we lived in a world where people didn't occasionally do genuinely hateful things, we'd all be a lot freer to joke about whatever we wanted... but until that world exists, an "un-PC" remark can sometimes be a sign of something more sinister.

I personally feel though that if someone is genuinely hateful and planning to act on that hatred they WON'T joke about the group they hate because they don't want to draw attention. Instead they'll sit on the fence when the subject comes up.

 

[al78]

It's an ASLEF thing. You have to watch what you say.

Basically you have to be pathetically "PC".

TBQH, if you don't think you're going to like criticism or be on the end of some mickey taking, then go crawl back under the sheets. Because it's a big bad world out there!

And if you are going to deliberately make antagonistic comments with no consideration for others, then don't throw a PC whinge fest when you are on the receiving end of the retaliation. Actions have consequences, sometimes undesirable actions have undesirable consequences. Deal with it or keep your mouth shut until you learn some social skills .

 

[HarleyDavidson]

And if you are going to deliberately make antagonistic comments with no consideration for others, then don't throw a PC whinge fest when you are on the receiving end of the retaliation. Actions have consequences, sometimes undesirable actions have undesirable consequences. Deal with it or keep your mouth shut until you learn some social skills .

Oh dear it seems that someone is thin skinned and has thrown his toys out of his pram. :roll:

All water of a ducks back to me. I'm the regular victim of pranks, wind ups, barbed comments and other's jokes, it really doesn't bother me one jot, because I know that patience is a virtue and revenge is a dessert best served cold.

When you bide your time to get your own back for practical jokes and sharp comments, the revenge tastes even better, especially when you can do it in a room full of work colleagues, who can be in on it and share the laugh.

And if the world was run by people like you, we'd all be in trouble, because it would be an even sadder and worse place than it is now.

Why do I get the impression that you rang the Samaritans and they hung up!

 

[Bromley boy]

I don’t think he’s showed himself up, let’s face it the conatation of loon is someone who is mad and has done for many years. I’m sure a few would consider the more detrimental meaning rather than “silly or foolish person”.

Like many on here I’ve seen some bad things due to mental health both personally and working life so I get where Elecman is coming from. It’s not nice to hear a close family member called nuts in a derogatory term, both for them or me.

Sorry to sound off.

What irritated me about that poster was that he made no contribution to the discussion other than to find offence and start making ridiculous “holier than thou” comments.

We all know words like “loon” and “nutter” are in common usage, are generallly considered not to be offensive and are well within the accepted vocabulary for a discussion forum such as this. If people find innocuous terms like this offensive they need to grow a thicker skin, and grow up a bit, quite frankly!

If people are offended can I suggest they simply report the posts in question and let the moderators decide what is acceptable, or better yet simply ignore the posts they don’t like.

EDIT: I’ve also seen first hand the effects of mental health problems, I know they are not something to trivialise but I simply disagree that the terms we are discussing, based on their accepted dictionary meaning, are offensive in this respect.

 

[HarleyDavidson]

What irritated me about that poster was that he made no contribution to the discussion other than to find offence and start making ridiculous “holier than thou” comments.

We all know words like “loon” and “nutter” are in common usage, are generallly considered not to be offensive and are well within the accepted vocabulary for a discussion forum such as this. If people find innocuous terms like this offensive they need to grow a thicker skin, and grow up a bit, quite frankly!

If people are offended can I suggest they simply report the posts in question and let the moderators decide what is acceptable, or better yet simply ignore the posts they don’t like.

EDIT: I’ve also seen first hand the effects of mental health problems, I know they are not something to trivialise but I simply disagree that the terms we are discussing, based on their accepted dictionary meaning, are offensive in this respect.

I'm regularly told that I'm nuts and look into things too deeply at work, especially timings and stuff like that.

The response is "Ah, but this nutter hasn't got a SPAD or [insert incident here] on their record have they" you have. At which point the vitriol usually stops and they go away. If they keep on I just ignore them and they get bored because I'm not rising the bait and cat calls.

If you can't take the odd bit of verbal, then I think you need to take a close look at yourself. And most certainly don't join the railway "family", because some of the rapier wit on there is just plain wicked.

 

[theageofthetra]

Still think its odd that we we still haven't seen a single picture or clip filmed on a phone of this 'preacher'

 

[HarleyDavidson]

Still think its odd that we we still haven't seen a single picture or clip filmed on a phone of this 'preacher'

That's what the BTP are investigating apparently. The onboard CCTV should be able to get a good picture of him/them.

 

[Bromley boy]

If you can't take the odd bit of verbal, then I think you need to take a close look at yourself. And most certainly don't join the railway "family", because some of the rapier wit on there is just plain wicked.

Yep railway banter is something else. It probably does go too far at times but generally people are quite robust, take things in the spirit intended and give as good as they get.

It's one of the few sections of society left which isn't full of people who fall over themselves to find hidden meanings and offence in every little comment.

 

[theageofthetra]

That's what the BTP are investigating apparently. The onboard CCTV should be able to get a good picture of him/them.

Yes but normally in these cases there are clips plastered all over social media or rubbish rags like Metro/Standard. Its almost like they have been ordered not to show them.

 

[HarleyDavidson]

Yes but normally in these cases there are clips plastered all over social media or rubbish rags like Metro/Standard. Its almost like they have been ordered not to show them.

Unless they're deliberately hiding something. Maybe there wasn't a preacher, in which case the brown stuff with hit the rotating air moving device for some city high flyers.

 

[TEW]

Still think its odd that we we still haven't seen a single picture or clip filmed on a phone of this 'preacher'

https://twitter.com/cyclingbetting/status/914763557467770880

Apparently that is him, from a guy who was on the train.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

I'm regularly told that I'm nuts and look into things too deeply at work, especially timings and stuff like that.

The response is "Ah, but this nutter hasn't got a SPAD or [insert incident here] on their record have they" you have. At which point the vitriol usually stops and they go away. If they keep on I just ignore them and they get bored because I'm not rising the bait and cat calls.

If you can't take the odd bit of verbal, then I think you need to take a close look at yourself. And most certainly don't join the railway "family", because some of the rapier wit on there is just plain wicked.

I can understand someone in your line of work being less sympathetic, after all when someone decides to end it all it could well be you who has to deal with it. I can also understand that there might be an element of "gallows humour" when dealing with that sort of thing within the railway family. I even think that Elecman's reaction was a bit much, but it's very easy to say "get over it" when you've offended someone without meaning to.

Let's have a bit more understanding and a bit more love and not get into silly squabbles over the odd poorly chosen word, eh?

 

[Bromley boy]

I can understand someone in your line of work being less sympathetic, after all when someone decides to end it all it could well be you who has to deal with it. I can also understand that there might be an element of "gallows humour" when dealing with that sort of thing within the railway family. I even think that Elecman's reaction was a bit much, but it's very easy to say "get over it" when you've offended someone without meaning to.

Let's have a bit more understanding and a bit more love and not get into silly squabbles over the odd poorly chosen word, eh?

But being offended is a completely subjective concept. Why should one person’s right not to be (subjectively) offended trump someone else’s right to express their opinion in commonly used language? That strikes me as a very dangerous road to go down.

If I told you I was offended by your reasonable post above (of course I’m not) would that entitle me to require you to delete it/apologise?

 

[61653 HTAFC]

https://twitter.com/cyclingbetting/status/914763557467770880

Apparently that is him, from a guy who was on the train.

I'm not sure circulating the guy's photo is the best laid plan... shouting religious nonsense is silly, but there's no way the guy was doing it with the intention of causing panic.The overreaction of those that evacuated themselves (and then got off the train!) onto a very busy electrified railway are at least equally as stupid as the "manic train preacher". Have you ever heard of a Christian suicide bomber? That's not to say it couldn't happen, of course it COULD, but you're more likely to be killed by going onto the track than by some bloke spouting bible verses.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

But being offended is a completely subjective concept. Why should one person’s right not to be (subjectively) offended trump someone else’s right to express their opinion in commonly used language? That strikes me as a very dangerous road to go down.

If I told you I was offended by your reasonable post above (of course I’m not) would that entitle me to require you to delete it/apologise?

If someone was offended by a post of mine, I'd want to know what offended them and why. Then I'd look at what I posted to see if they had a point... I'd then decide whether they did or not. If they did, I'd apologise and perhaps rephrase my point in a more diplomatic way. If they didn't, I'd try to explain why I felt their offence was unjustified.

At least that's what I'd hope I'd do. In reality I might throw a hissy-fit or simply fall silent out of shame because human beings are flawed and I'm more flawed than many!

 

[theageofthetra]

Unless they're deliberately hiding something. Maybe there wasn't a preacher, in which case the brown stuff with hit the rotating air moving device for some city high flyers.

Yes it is like there is something they don't want us to know.

 

[Joe Paxton]

Yes it is like there is something they don't want us to know.

A conspiracy theory created out of thin air... ah, isn't the web a thing of wonder!

 

[randyrippley]

So what would you suggest under the circumstances? Grapple with something who might have a bomb that they could detonate at any moment?

Stupidity? Oh the irony:roll:

In a nutshell, yes I would. If he's got a bomb, the only way of stopping him is to disable him. I'd prefer to die trying to stop him than die doing nothing....and who knows, I might be able to stop him.

 

[Antman]

In a nutshell, yes I would. If he's got a bomb, the only way of stopping him is to disable him. I'd prefer to die trying to stop him than die doing nothing....and who knows, I might be able to stop him.

But only if you were wearing your superman cape at the time.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

Yes it is like there is something they don't want us to know.

Or perhaps the man in question didn't actually break any laws (even bylaws) and a bunch of others overreacted and DID break laws, so plastering his picture all over the press would achieve nothing.

 

[Busaholic]

The locality of this incident may well have influenced the reaction on the train, given that it is very probable that the Parsons Green bomber changed from a SW service to the District at Wimbledon only about a month earlier. How any of us would have reacted in this situation is hypothetical and, I suspect, many (including myself) might not have been so wise/brave in real life as we'd like to imagine we would have been.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

The locality of this incident may well have influenced the reaction on the train, given that it is very probable that the Parsons Green bomber changed from a SW service to the District at Wimbledon only about a month earlier. How any of us would have reacted in this situation is hypothetical and, I suspect, many (including myself) might not have been so wise/brave in real life as we'd like to imagine we would have been.

That's true, it's easy for me to say that I'd have stayed calm when I wasn't there... though I think if there was a bloke reading bible verses out loud on my train I'd have just thought "this guy..." and tried to get as far away as possible by moving down the train, but to avoid being annoyed rather than to avoid being blown to bits!

Of course maybe once the doors had been forced, the "follower instinct" would kick in but I'd like to think I'd know better than to get out of a train on what I know to be an extremely busy section of line until I'd been given the go-ahead by a member of staff.

 

[Bertie the bus]

Or perhaps the man in question didn't actually break any laws (even bylaws) and a bunch of others overreacted and DID break laws, so plastering his picture all over the press would achieve nothing.

Evacuating onto the tracks in an emergency isn’t a crime. Some people on here, who weren’t there, have suggested they overreacted. One of these people has also suggested it is all a conspiracy and the gentleman in question didn’t even exist, but the people who matter – the TOC and the police - certainly haven’t criticised the actions of the passengers that I’m aware of.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

Evacuating onto the tracks in an emergency isn’t a crime. Some people on here, who weren’t there, have suggested they overreacted. One of these people has also suggested it is all a conspiracy and the gentleman in question didn’t even exist, but the people who matter – the TOC and the police - certainly haven’t criticised the actions of the passengers that I’m aware of.

The key issues there are (a) Was it a genuine emergency? Clearly with hindsight it wasn't... and (b) was it reasonable to assume it was an emergency? That part is more contentious, but if (and I stress, IF) a file was to be handed to the CPS over whether to charge those who de-trained, I'd hope that the "public interest" test would result in no charges being brought.

 

[Bertie the bus]

What is it with people on this forum and prosecuting people? Now we've had on this thread questions about prosecuting both the "preacher" and the passengers. Lucky the guard got praise or people would be after prosecuting him as well.

 

[jon0844]

Still think its odd that we we still haven't seen a single picture or clip filmed on a phone of this 'preacher'

I have to say, if this preacher was on my train I'd probably get off quick smart...

(Image from AMC showing Jesse from Preacher TV series)

 

[61653 HTAFC]

What is it with people on this forum and prosecuting people? Now we've had on this thread questions about prosecuting both the "preacher" and the passengers. Lucky the guard got praise or people would be after prosecuting him as well.

Nobody has said "Person X/Y should be prosecuted"- some have posed the question as to whether they could be prosecuted. Keep your hair on!

 

[Antman]

Nobody has said "Person X/Y should be prosecuted"- some have posed the question as to whether they could be prosecuted. Keep your hair on!

Clearly there are no grounds for prosecuting anybody other than possibly 'the preacher' depending on exactly what he said and did.

 

[HarleyDavidson]

On what grounds can you prosecute the preacher?

Reading the Bible? I'd like to see that stand up in court.

What do you do if someone wants to read the Koran or any other religious book?
Where do you stop?