Passengers And Parcels

[30907]

Just to add to the pile of info already posted

- not everything ran at dead of night.

Pre 1964 an Up South Western milk/van trains was advertised to passengers Yeovil-Semley (where the coaches - 3-set? - were detached to form a morning train to Salisbury, and more milk tanks attached) and the afternoon milk empties from Clapham Jn carried passengers from Yeovil to Chard Jn connecting off the 7pm from Waterloo (a BSK?). Doubt if the latter did much business but it was a marginal cost. I am sure there are many other examples across the country

There were plenty of other trains that were passenger trains officially, but really ran for non-passenger traffic. I recall a trip on the lunchtime Parkeston-Peterborough in the 70s, which had more vans than coaches and certainly more parcels than passengers. Or (before my time in the area) the afternoon Bradford-Carlisle slow (remember Grattans Catalogues?)

- by no means all parcels trains carried passenger accommodation though.

One fast one that didnt was the 2.30am Waterloo-Weymouth news, which was followed by the much slower 2.45am passenger and parcels

 

[RichmondCommu]

All the trains were normally well loaded with passengers and in those BR days guards allowed you to sit on top of a pile of newspapers if the passenger coach was really full.

Well you'd certainly have a warm backside sitting on top of hot newspapers! Not mention what kind of state your clothes would be in! Still, as I stated before it was certainly better than nothing! Was the passenger coach basically included for braking purposes?

 

[ainsworth74]

The trains were running anyway so BR could make a quick buck by making them available for passengers (no lease or access charges back then). I see no reason why they'd be added for brake force (but I'm willing to be corrected).

 

[RichmondCommu]

The trains were running anyway so BR could make a quick buck by making them available for passengers (no lease or access charges back then). I see no reason why they'd be added for brake force (but I'm willing to be corrected).

I only ask because I've seen BSK''s mentioned a few times on this thread and assumed that they were included for brake force. In that case a few fare paying passngers was a Brucey bonus. However this is only an assumption!

 

[eastwestdivide]

Plenty of non-passenger-carrying parcels trains ran with just vans, and no "brake" coaches.
I'd have thought the brake coaches were accommodation for the guards, so that they would be with the passengers instead of in the back cab of the loco.
And in any case, doesn't the designation "brake" on a coach type mean those with guard's accommodation + a guard's handbrake (i.e. parking brake), not being about braking force. All the parcels/newspaper vans by that period were continuously braked (vacuum or later air/dual).

 

[ChiefPlanner]

Not unknown for station staff to allow genuine (usually non inebriated) passengers to ride on a parcels service (say in the Guards compartment , or an empty one) to get them home from say Crewe to Shrewsbury in the event of missed connections. All down to the individual train crew and the Control would be advised so that a parcels train became a "passenger train" for signalling purposes - a class 1 or 2 vice a 3. Saved on expensive cab fares or a long cold night waiting for the first passenger train.

As a youth , I sometimes got the 0055 Paddington - Swansea mail / parcels / passenger and there were often many free newspapers available from the quota given by the printers to rail staff. Temple Meads at 0300 used to be quite a hub for passenger / mail interchange with a functioning buffet to cater for the nocturnal needs of the GPO / BR staff and overnight passengers / "nighthawks".

 

[MarkyT]

I remember catching an advertised late night local train from Bristol towards Southampton in the 1980s and was surprised to find it consisted of mostly parcels vans and a single passenger coach.

I also recall regularly catching the first up train from Paignton to Exeter St. Davids in the early mornings around this time; at Exeter a newspaper van left behind by the overnight train from London was attached to the 3-car DMU for its onward journey to Barnstaple.

 

[D1009]

Going back a bit earlier I remember 4A13 Penzance to Paddington perishables, a good one for a Western if the last passenger train was worked by a class 50. Passenger accommodation was always included for staff travelling pass, and enthusiasts (as long as they behaved properly) were sometimes welcome!