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Paper timetable availability

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WesternLancer

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Nice to be able to pick EMR paper timetables up from a rack today - not seen any of them for a fair while since early on during lock down.

Makes me wonder what the general availability of paper timetables is from TOCs in people's experience?
 
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AlbertBeale

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Nice to be able to pick EMR paper timetables up from a rack today - not seen any of them for a fair while since early on during lock down.

Makes me wonder what the general availability of paper timetables is from TOCs in people's experience?

The problem with the Brighton Line (and adjacent routes) timetables, if needing them when in Brighton, is not that the timetables don't exist, but that they refuse to display them; so you have to queue for 15 minutes behind people enquiring about obscure future journeys, or simply needing to buy any ticket from a human rather than a machine (at the well-hidden combined ticket and enquiry office), in order to ask for one. Grrrr!!
 

WesternLancer

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The problem with the Brighton Line (and adjacent routes) timetables, if needing them when in Brighton, is not that the timetables don't exist, but that they refuse to display them; so you have to queue for 15 minutes behind people enquiring about obscure future journeys, or simply needing to buy any ticket from a human rather than a machine (at the well-hidden combined ticket and enquiry office), in order to ask for one. Grrrr!!
Yes, I've had that problem at several Southern stations from well before Covid - for last 3+ years etc. Really annoying. I suspected it was part of an effort by the TOC to do much reduced print runs or the phasing out of paper TT's. Platform racks at East Croydon used to be a good source in the past.
 

marty1977

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Paper timetables are a waste of money and paper. It is ridiculously easy to access the information needed online or via a phone. And sorry I don't have any sympathy for the argument of not being able to use online services.
 

Bletchleyite

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Good - imo they are a waste of money. Download and print at home is the answer if you must have a paper timetable. You may disagree.

I certainly disagree - most people who would want a paper timetable don't have tech, because if they did they'd have already done that. The need for them is certainly reduced, and perhaps as a result what they should do is design them to output on A4 rather than as booklets (easing home printing), and just have booking offices print them off on demand if needed. (If they knew particular ones were in high demand, they could run a load off and put on a rack, of course).
 

WesternLancer

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Good - imo they are a waste of money. Download and print at home is the answer if you must have a paper timetable. You may disagree.
Well, personally I haven't got a printer, and of course there will be many people (several of them no further away than my own direct relatives) who would not even be able to find them on the internet etc. And I don't have the sort of mobile phone that allows them to be read or looked up on the move. But of course I accept that for many people they are redundant (a bit like railways themselves perhaps...)

However, I was hoping this thread would not divert into a debate into the need / desirability of paper timetables...

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

Paper timetables are a waste of money and paper. It is ridiculously easy to access the information needed online or via a phone. And sorry I don't have any sympathy for the argument of not being able to use online services.
And I trust you have little sympathy for any other sorts of skills deficiencies too? There's lots of reasons why you have to provide info in a range of way for a range of users if you are running a public service, funded by taxpayers some of whom may not be able to access certain methods of information but are not permitted to 'opt out' of the taxation that funds the service. This is different from say, the budget airline model where you can, if you wish, move to say a web only model of information / booking on the basis that you do not want the business from the potential customers who are unable to engage with the way you have chosen to offer your product.
 
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route101

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There hasnt been any Rail Timetables in Scotland for months, i believe they stopped them before covid hit. I never any down south either. I think Northern had some in Hull.

I do prefer a paper timetable if im out and about, i can read it easier, gives me the bigger picture and quicker than using my phone.

Im not a fan of these journey specific planners that dont give the bigger picture. Rail or Bus.
 

Driver2B

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Southeastern have had them available on racks throughout the covid-19 crisis at Waterloo East station.
 

Mcr Warrior

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Paper timetables also allow you to check for the possibility, if you are lucky, of tightly timed change of train interchanges, which might not otherwise be shown on automated journey planners due to minimum connection times.
 

PeterC

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Paper timetables also allow you to check for the possibility, if you are lucky, of tightly timed change of train interchanges, which might not otherwise be shown on automated journey planners due to minimum connection times.
A timetable gives you am immediate view of issues like frequency while a journey planner requires you to search deeper to see what happens if you miss your connection. Are you sitting in the middle of knowhere having missed the one connection of the day or is there another coming along in 10 minutes?

Hardcopy is still an important publicity material as long as you use it properly. Who is going to search the web for something they don't even realise exists?
 

WesternLancer

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I don't use paper timetables.
I do pick up every one I come across to put in a neatly-ordered box in the loft...
well, that's putting it to good use IMHO - lots of posts on here that ask for times from various past eras after all (a query ref 1924 services from Liverpool to York has recently been responded to on another thread). If no one keeps such things it will be harder in 80+ plus years to answer such a question.

And who knows if info kept digitally will be easily accessible in decades to come. An archivist pointed out to me that data compiled many centuries ago is still capable of being interpreted by the human eye quite easily.
 

ABB125

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well, that's putting it to good use IMHO - lots of posts on here that ask for times from various past eras after all (a query ref 1924 services from Liverpool to York has recently been responded to on another thread). If no one keeps such things it will be harder in 80+ plus years to answer such a question.

And who knows if info kept digitally will be easily accessible in decades to come. An archivist pointed out to me that data compiled many centuries ago is still capable of being interpreted by the human eye quite easily.
Indeed. I haven't actually used my collection for anything yet though, and it's hardly complete! Unfortunately (to return to the original topic) I haven't seen any since March on my (infrequent!) travels.
 

739678

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There hasnt been any Rail Timetables in Scotland for months, i believe they stopped them before covid hit. I never any down south either. I think Northern had some in Hull.

I do prefer a paper timetable if im out and about, i can read it easier, gives me the bigger picture and quicker than using my phone.

Im not a fan of these journey specific planners that dont give the bigger picture. Rail or Bus.

There was a survey sent out by Scotrail last year asking if there was still a need for hardcopy timetable leaflets and indeed timetable posters at stations, so the Covid crisis has probably been used as a handy excuse to ditch them all.
It's not just Scotrail of course; Stagecoach East Scotland have also informed people on Facebook that they are not printing bus timetables at the moment either. As has been said, not great for the older generation or anyone less technologically minded...
 

Busaholic

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Paper timetables are a waste of money and paper. It is ridiculously easy to access the information needed online or via a phone. And sorry I don't have any sympathy for the argument of not being able to use online services.
It is ridiculously easy except when the technology fails, which, alas, is all too often, or is presented online in such a way that it takes a ridiculous amount of research to get correct and up-to-date information. TOCs are well aware of this, of course, and cynically exploit it with the most complicated fares structure in the world, one in which they of course hold the whip hand. The situation is even worse in the bus world, where finding both times and fares for any given bus route outside the major urban areas could take you all day with, even then, a good chance you don't have up-to-date info. Any decent, honest, responsible public transport operator will continue to offer information by paper print, whether it is provided at no cost to the customer or not.
 

WesternLancer

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There was a survey sent out by Scotrail last year asking if there was still a need for hardcopy timetable leaflets and indeed timetable posters at stations, so the Covid crisis has probably been used as a handy excuse to ditch them all.
It's not just Scotrail of course; Stagecoach East Scotland have also informed people on Facebook that they are not printing bus timetables at the moment either. As has been said, not great for the older generation or anyone less technologically minded...
I recall Barry Doe, (post above reminded me), complaining about Scotrail's policy not to have printed ones sometime before covid / lock down. Maybe last year IIRC.
 

Non Multi

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It is ridiculously easy except when the technology fails, which, alas, is all too often, or is presented online in such a way that it takes a ridiculous amount of research to get correct and up-to-date information. TOCs are well aware of this, of course, and cynically exploit it with the most complicated fares structure in the world, one in which they of course hold the whip hand. The situation is even worse in the bus world, where finding both times and fares for any given bus route outside the major urban areas could take you all day with, even then, a good chance you don't have up-to-date info. Any decent, honest, responsible public transport operator will continue to offer information by paper print, whether it is provided at no cost to the customer or not.
Sadly not even Transport for London bother with printed timetables. For example, if you wanted to see a printed timetable for the TfL Rail services between Reading and Paddington you had to pick up a GWR T10 timetable booklet.

I have zero sympathy for operators and regional transport bodies who can't be bothered with printing timetables, fares info or maps. They absolutely deserve their declining passenger numbers.
 
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