Oxford ticket validity

[sammyg901]

Paddington-Oxford on the 1658 non stop. one day travelcard & a BZ6-Oxford Off peak day single (network railcard discounted) . Code W1 valid after 0930.

Valid for that train or not ? Refused at the barrier "as that is a peak train"

 

[signed]

"as that is a peak train"

There doesn't exist peak trains, it's the normal experience at Paddington sadly, they love to make stuff up it seems

 

[LA50041]

Paddington gate line staff still making up thier own rules! Been going on for 10+ years but unfortunately the management don’t want to deal with the problem

 

[Mcr Warrior]

@sammyg901. Were you allowed to board the 1658 departure? If not, how did you actually get to Oxford instead, and when was it that you got there (i.e. how long were you effectively delayed)? If so, is there potentially a valid claim for 30+ mins 'Delay Repay'?

 

[Watershed]

Absolutely valid, there is no such thing as a blanket peak/off-peak train. It all depends on the restriction code of the ticket you hold. Your ticket had restriction code W1 which as you say, is simply valid on any train after 09:30 so the 16:58 would be a perfectly valid option (in combination with your Travelcard).

Complain to GWR; doing so every time is the only way you can get any recourse or have any hope of changing the unacceptable current staff attitudes.

 

[sammyg901]

It was my other half, we had plans so he paid for a single ticket as the barrier worker was insisting that was the only way to get through. I shall enjoy writing a letter getting that back! Just wanted to check I was correct

 

[LA50041]

And if they were delayed by buying a new ticket make sure delay repay is claimed as well

 

[jfollows]

See https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/gwr-evening-peak-advance-fares.160332/#post-3324708 from 2018, and Barry Doe wrote about it in RAIL, but it still continues.

 

[sammyg901]

See https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/gwr-evening-peak-advance-fares.160332/#post-3324708 from 2018, and Barry Doe wrote about it in RAIL, but it still continues.

Interesting read, thanks. Seems like things are right back to how they were before with staff not understanding ticket validity (W1 being as simple as they get) and just refusing any off peak ticket on a "peak" train. Sigh. Will report back response to my complaint

 

[yorkie]

If you bought the Travelcard and/or BZ6 ticket from our ticketing site, let me know if you do not get a good response from GWR and I will chase it for you.

I also had to argue my way through the gateline at Paddington a few months ago; they initially tried to make me wait for about 4 hours for my ticket to be valid, but relented when I insisted it was valid.

The training, knowledge, attitude, and behaviour of some staff members at Paddington is a disgrace. It has been for decades, with no end in sight.

 

[sammyg901]

I did not - I couldn't figure out buying the boundary zone 6 ticket ? A google threw up a posting in the forum that Avanti sells them so I just used that as was short of time !

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 13 Aug 2025 ==

Though I've just now realised I needed to tick the box saying I have a Travelcard presumably. Next time !

 

[sammyg901]

So I had a reply

As you have stated, the W1 restriction code informs you that "Outward Travel is not valid on trains timed to depart after 04:29 and before 09:30 and return Travel is not valid on trains timed to depart after 04:29 and before 09:30."
Although I can see that you had a Off-Peak day single ticket, this has it's own restrictions; you can only travel on Off-peak services going out of London towards Oxford (this is something also stated on the Nation Rail website when searching the restriction code "Some tickets may require you to travel at specific times of the day, days of the week or on a specific route"). This can be found through the link below:
https://www.nationalrail.co.uk/ticket-types/validity/w1/
This means, as the 16:58 service was not an Off-peak train, I would not be able to look into reimbursement for the new ticket you purchased. However, I can understand the confusion when purchasing these tickets, so after reviewing them, I can see that they were purchased with Chiltern Railways, due to this I will pass over your information and claim to them to look further into this.
Please note that this claim can take up to 28 days for Chiltern Railways to receive and then review; I have provided their contact details below as this may resolution in a quicker resolution for you.

Well where to start with this!! Of course I've replied back but this really needs flagging up to senior people at GWR if anyone has any contacts

 

[Watershed]

So I had a reply



Well where to start with this!! Of course I've replied back but this really needs flagging up to senior people at GWR if anyone has any contacts

What a terrible response. They literally quote the applicable restriction but then add on their own nonsense about it being a "peak" train, which is simply not how it works at all.

I would be sending them a Letter Before Claim giving them 14 days to pay before you bring a Court claim. They wouldn't be showing you any mercy if you misunderstood the rules - I'd suggest that works both ways.

 

[sammyg901]

That is a good suggestion, I will structure my reply as a formal letter

 

[redreni]

I would be sending them a Letter Before Claim giving them 14 days to pay before you bring a Court claim. They wouldn't be showing you any mercy if you misunderstood the rules - I'd suggest that works both ways.

If only the provisions for redress and deterrence were more even-handed.

Fundamentally, it's assumed that passengers who get it wrong are doing so dishonestly whereas with TOCs, we should never put down to conspiracy what can be explained by mere incompetence. And sure enough, the people on the front line are incompetent rather than anything worse.

But what is the likelihood that senior management at GWR don't understand, condone and encourage the rejection of valid off-peak tickets at Paddington between 4pm and 7pm? With all the stress, inconvenience, delay, frustration, embarrassment and financial loss that causes people?

 

[lnerazuma]

Thanks for this thread now my friend could make his Bristol - London commute slightly less unaffordable travelling on an off peak train to London and a peak train back to Bristol.

Itinerary:
09:00 Bristol TM to Paddington (off peak direct train)

Potential multiple legs of tubes & bus connections throughout the day

18:01 Paddington to Bristol TM (peak direct train)

With tickets:
Bristol to Oxford off peak day return £22.35
Oxford to West Drayton off peak day return £16.75
Zone 1-6 off peak day travelcard £11

Total £50.1/day, with Railcard discount applied

 

[yorkie]

So I had a reply



Well where to start with this!! Of course I've replied back but this really needs flagging up to senior people at GWR if anyone has any contacts

Unfortunately, GWR don't have many people with much knowledge about the validity of tickets; this appalling response is in line with what I'd expect from a company of GWR's reputation and history for poor interactions with customers.

I suggest you try to escalate it; eventually it may reach one of the very few people who actually do understand ticket validities, but you may have to go to the Rail Ombudsman.

 

[Watershed]

Thanks for this thread now my friend could make his Bristol - London commute slightly less unaffordable travelling on an off peak train to London and a peak train back to Bristol.

Itinerary:
09:00 Bristol TM to Paddington (off peak direct train)

Potential multiple legs of tubes & bus connections throughout the day

18:01 Paddington to Bristol TM (peak direct train)

With tickets:
Bristol to Oxford off peak day return £22.35
Oxford to West Drayton off peak day return £16.75
Zone 1-6 off peak day travelcard £11

Total £50.1/day, with Railcard discount applied

A great find as the restrictions codes on those tickets to/from Oxford are less onerous than the equivalent ones to/from Didcot.

I'd replace the Oxford to West Drayton ticket with one to Boundary Zone 6, as it demonstrates more clearly that it's intended to be valid as a non-stop split. But the unfortunate thing is that there's a good chance GWR will change the restriction code(s) once your friend has their first problematic on-train or gateline encounter and complains to Customer Services.

 

[Nicholas43]

Have I understood correctly that, departing from Paddington with a TfL zones 1 to 6 travelcard, and boundary zone 6 to (for example) Oxford ticket, I should try the travelcard in the gate? And should it work? If it does not, how does the conversation go? GWR ogre: the only train(s) this barrier leads to aren't going to stop in zones 1 to 6. Me: No, but I've got an onward from boundary zone 6 ticket which is none of your business? ... ?

 

[Benjwri]

Have I understood correctly that, departing from Paddington with a TfL zones 1 to 6 travelcard, and boundary zone 6 to (for example) Oxford ticket, I should try the travelcard in the gate? And should it work? If it does not, how does the conversation go? GWR ogre: the only train(s) this barrier leads to aren't going to stop in zones 1 to 6. Me: No, but I've got an onward from boundary zone 6 ticket which is none of your business? ... ?

You're correct until you tell them it's none of their business. I don't agree with the practices on the Paddington gateline, but your boundary zone ticket is a part of the ticket you are using to travel, and without it your travelcard is not valid to board that train. It is entirely within the gateline's jurisdiction to ask to see that ticket.

 

[LA50041]

Have I understood correctly that, departing from Paddington with a TfL zones 1 to 6 travelcard, and boundary zone 6 to (for example) Oxford ticket, I should try the travelcard in the gate? And should it work? If it does not, how does the conversation go? GWR ogre: the only train(s) this barrier leads to aren't going to stop in zones 1 to 6. Me: No, but I've got an onward from boundary zone 6 ticket which is none of your business? ... ?

The barrier will reject the travel card.
The conversation will go along the lines of these are all peak trains and you have an off peak ticket and they will not let you through and threaten calling the police

 

[Nicholas43]

You're correct until you tell them it's none of their business. I don't agree with the practices on the Paddington gateline, but your boundary zone ticket is a part of the ticket you are using to travel, and without it your travelcard is not valid to board that train. It is entirely within the gateline's jurisdiction to ask to see that ticket.

The barrier will reject the travel card.
The conversation will go along the lines of these are all peak trains and you have an off peak ticket and they will not let you through and threaten calling the police

Ah, thanks. And the gatelines are (now?) programmed not to accept TfL Travelcards, because (latterly, and in normal circumstances) no trains from Paddington which depart from the surface platforms call at Ealing Broadway or Hayes & Harlington?

 

[LA50041]

I think at Paddington travel cards seem to be rejected as a matter of course so they can be interrogated. Even travel card season tickets which are not restricted are rejected at Paddington

 

[redreni]

Ah, thanks. And the gatelines are (now?) programmed not to accept TfL Travelcards, because (latterly, and in normal circumstances) no trains from Paddington which depart from the surface platforms call at Ealing Broadway or Hayes & Harlington?

I think at Paddington travel cards seem to be rejected as a matter of course so they can be interrogated. Even travel card season tickets which are not restricted are rejected at Paddington

I use off-peak Travelcards on those gatelines often and they are always accepted. But I only pass through those gatelines at what GWR regards as off-peak times.

If you try to use any off-peak ticket whatsoever - even if it is valid - at the high-level gatelines at Paddington between 4pm and 7pm on a weekday, it will be rejected. It doesn't matter if it's a Travelcard or not.

If your tickets are valid then feel free to try, keep a careful note of what happens, claim delay repay for any delay suffered and pursue them for any additional fares demanded.

Also worth noting not every platform at Paddington is protected by a gateline.

 

[Watershed]

Ah, thanks. And the gatelines are (now?) programmed not to accept TfL Travelcards, because (latterly, and in normal circumstances) no trains from Paddington which depart from the surface platforms call at Ealing Broadway or Hayes & Harlington?

Yes, I think so. I don't know whether any of the barriers are programmed differently when Elizabeth line services terminate and start at the street-level platforms, or for the handful of overnight GWR stopping services. I imagine the barriers might not be in use for the latter, anyway.

Either way the key thing is that you have to look at the restriction code applicable to the ticket you hold to determine its validity - i.e. W1 for your Boundary Zone 6 ticket, and B1 if you have a simple Zones 1-6 Travelcard. Trains aren't blanket 'peak' or 'off-peak' in the way that train companies like to pretend. Those designations may be correct for tickets to or from London Terminals, but that's not the ticket you hold and so the restrictions are different.

As I say, I'd expect to have a difficult time getting through the barriers if you get anyone who actually takes a proper look at the ticket you're showing them.

 

[MotCO]

Can you get an itinerary printed for your ticket combination? If so, the gateline staff should accept it.

none of your business?

Although tempted to say that, it is probably best to remain calm and not be rude.

 

[redreni]

Yes, I think so.

No, the high-level barriers definitely accept Travelcards. I use a paper day Travelcard in conjunction with a Boundary Zone 6 ticket to board trains at Paddington high-level on a regular basis. The barriers always accept the Travelcard (unless it's demagnetised, of course). Doesn't matter which platform.

When the Elizabeth Line first opened, in the initial phase before we had through-running between the western section and the core, I imagine even GWR would have recognised that it would have caused problems if the barriers had not accepted Travelcards. It seems not to have changed since then.

Years ago, it used to be the case the Travelcards would work the barriers to the high-numbered platforms used by local services but not the barriers to the low-numbered platforms used by trains running fast to Slough or Reading. I used to encounter problems fairly regularly when asking to be let through with a Travelcard / Boundary Zone 6 combination. Thankfully those days are gone.

 

[yorkie]

Can you get an itinerary printed for your ticket combination? If so, the gateline staff should accept it

Yes; the forum ticketing site will issue an itinerary on the 1658 with a BZ6 to Oxford CDR.

 

[MarlowDonkey]

If you try to use any off-peak ticket whatsoever - even if it is valid - at the high-level gatelines at Paddington between 4pm and 7pm on a weekday, it will be rejected. It doesn't matter if it's a Travelcard or not.

Rejection of valid off peak tickets seems to have been an issue at Paddington for several years. Is it the senior management who don't understand that some off peak tickets can be valid on what they deem "peak" trains? Or is it a lack of training and communication from management to gateline staff?

 

[Sonic1234]

Is it the senior management who don't understand that some off peak tickets can be valid on what they deem "peak" trains?

Almost certainly yes. If it was the odd misinformed member of staff, it wouldn't be so common. It's the problem of partial knowledge, managers know that off-peak London Terminals tickets aren't valid at a certain time and don't consider the wider picture.

Knowing a little is dangerous. You either want this forum staffing the gates, or you want the type of staff you get on the South London metro who will let you through with anything that is the approximate shade of orange, while being slightly annoyed you interrupted their TikTok.