How does an open access operator at Newark help people in Lincoln if LNER isn't reliable? Given LNER also wants to extend beyond Lincon to Grimsby/Cleethorpes I think reliability is in their interest.
The LNER service at Newark is not objectively worse there than at the other stations south of Doncaster. Indeed, it could be argued it is better in many ways with the call in the Edinburgh service.
And where do these people you’ve spoken to want to go? Surely you would have asked them because the ideal destination seems to change every time you answer. Were any wearing red and white scarves by any chance?
I return to my first question which you didn’t answer, do they want an OAO or do they just want reliability? Now the later I think is perfectly reasonable request. I just can’t help but feel their ‘desire for an OAO’ could probably be solved by a reliable LNER service. If you champion a new service, I can’t help but feel they’d be a bit let down when it’s 4/5 tpd extra. Also, I don’t use LNER for anything other than occasional leisure travel so I don’t know if this reliability claim is accurate or not.
A ticket tomorrow (Monday 27 November) at 7:30 am from the following stations to London King's Cross for 1 adult with no railcard is as follows:
York has an hourly service to Newark as part of the semi-fast service to London. I can see the Bradford service working better than the Sunderland service. To answer your original question, they want reliability and cheaper prices.
They want to go to London. One person I know gets National Express from Lincoln into London as they said that LNER was too expensive and quite unreliable.
Sorry, what is this supposed to prove?
Is that a problem? Why shouldn't they go by coach if they are happier with the cheaper fare and longer journey time?
The previous poster is suggesting that the absence of an open access operator means that travelling from Newark to London at 0730 is higher than it would be if there was such an operator.
Replying to:
Because they prefer the train.
So they don’t want an OAO. But like most passengers they want faster trains and cheaper prices. I mean, I think that’s what every passenger would like, non stop services from their station to their destination at a £1 a go. Sadly, not gonna happen.
I understand that, but I don't see how picking random fares on the next day of travel at peak time is a particularly good metric. At least one of those is a First Class Advance.
So all this wanting to go to Sunderland, Howden, Bradford etc is just a load of rubbish?
I never said they wanted to go to either. I especially said that they wouldn't want to go to Howden. My point about Bradford and Sunderland is where said service could start from.
All of those were Standard Class fares.
They said they wanted an OAO as they think that it can provide needed competition to LNER. I was suggesting Bradford and Sunderland as starting points for said service. If you want LNER to operate an additional service, it would make much more sense to start it from Doncaster, York or Leeds than Newark due to passenger demand, staffing and turning around trains.
Well they could be potential markets. I personally think that Lumo would make the most sense to stop at Newark, then GC, then Hull Trains.
I don’t think there needs to be an additional service at all. But, I’m just countering your point as I don’t think the vast majority of the public have any idea what an OAO is and what they actually want is a reliable service and they’d probably all be satisfied if that came from LNER.
Again I refer you to post number 3:-
So what do you mean by ‘potential market’ if you aren’t looking at a potential market?
You said "Retford: £85".
Bradford could be a potential market from Newark, so could Sunderland.
Sorry, need to edit, accidentally typed £85 instead of £80.
All fellow rail enthusiasts...
I think that is the key phrase there. The public don't care who operates their train. They just want reliability and good value fares. Most people wouldn't have a clue what the difference is between GC and LNER. Enthusiasts on the other hand want to see something interesting/different/get the chance to clear another fleet.
You don't need to tell me about GC reliability and don't even get me started on comfort. I avoid them at all costs.
So, you are arguing against Open Access Operators because they don't actually operate comfortable or reliable trains? GC, as a limited operation, have to cope with less resources than LNER. You could argue that people get a slightly cheaper fare as compensation for the risks this leads to regarding reliability.
I’ve only used them three times, all for leisure purposes so don’t have to rely on them for business or time constrained visits, but I thought the 180 was perfect. Very comfy, decent table, good views. But from what I understand, people don’t have a problem with the train ambience as such, just the awful reliability and the habit of setting itself on fire.
These 2 posts are 19 minutes apart. If you’re making suggestions could you please be more decisive. This whole thread is so confused.
I am not arguing again OAOs, I just personally avoid GC because I don't enjoy traveling with them.
I was suggesting Bradford and Sunderland as starting points for said services as they could be potential markets.
People in Lincoln can get EMR to Newark.
So they are now both a starting point AND a potential market! Moving goalposts again!
So Newark has slightly cheaper fares per mile than Grantham, Doncaster or York.
Why Lumo? Newark already has a perfectly satisfactory service to Edinburgh and Newcastle, and I highly doubt that there is great demand between Newark and Morpeth, or indeed Lincoln and Morpeth.
Before the bi-modes came in, what I believe are now the Lincoln Central services terminated in Platform 3 at North Gate.
So people from Newark might want to go there after all?
