Offer of settlement unless prosecution

[kayode1212]

Hello, i got charged on a train with a with an invalid train ticket, my railcard had expired two months ago and I honestly didn’t know. I kept buying my usual fare to my destination all that time. A letter was sent by post of an intent to prosecution. After sending train receipts and railcard. They got back to me with an offer for me to pay £739 with 14days as the sum includes the unpaid fare(s) and the full costs involved with the administration of this case incurred in its recovery. They said the amount is non-negotiable as it is entirely in my favour. I made 8 trips within the time of expiry of the actual cost of an off-peak open return ticket costing £35 to my destination. I don’t understand how it’s in my favour, it feels very harsh. Please any advice on how I could resolve this with reasonable terms, because I don’t have kind of money within the days I’m required to pay. Please help !!

 

[AlterEgo]

Hello, i got charged on a train with a with an invalid train ticket, my railcard had expired two months ago and I honestly didn’t know. I kept buying my usual fare to my destination all that time. A letter was sent by post of an intent to prosecution. After sending train receipts and railcard. They got back to me with an offer for me to pay £739 with 14days as the sum includes the unpaid fare(s) and the full costs involved with the administration of this case incurred in its recovery. They said the amount is non-negotiable as it is entirely in my favour. I made 8 trips within the time of expiry of the actual cost of an off-peak open return ticket costing £35 to my destination. I don’t understand how it’s in my favour, it feels very harsh. Please any advice on how I could resolve this with reasonable terms, because I don’t have kind of money within the days I’m required to pay. Please help !!

Which train company are you dealing with? Which journeys did you make?

The amount is likely to be non-negotiable - outstanding fares are calculated at the Anytime rate and this is in your favour as the alternative is being prosecute for the offence in the magistrates court, where you will need not only to pay the fares due, but also be punished with a fine, as well as obtaining a criminal conviction.

You can ask the company for a little time to pay, but they do not need to agree to this, as they have a six month time limit to prosecute you from the time you committed the offence/s.

 

[kayode1212]

I made the journey using Chiltern railways and the journey was from Bicester north to London Marylebone. How could I proceed with this ?

 

[chrisjo]

Anytime day single x 16 = £622.48 at current prices. So that plus £117 = £739 approx.

 

[kayode1212]

ok.. i would like to probably appeal. Please let me know if this is okay.

Dear Economic Crime & Fraud Unit,
Thank you for taking the time to assess my case and for offering me the opportunity to resolve this matter without prosecution. I deeply regret my mistake and sincerely apologize for the oversight.
As a recent immigrant to the UK pursuing my studies, I am still adapting to many aspects of life here, including managing railcards and understanding the nuances of the system. When I first enrolled in school, I obtained a railcard but unfortunately was unaware it had expired. Back in my home country, there is no comparable system requiring renewal of travel discounts, and this was my first experience managing a railcard.
I had genuinely believed that if my railcard expired, I would not be able to use the discount and would need to purchase a new one. It was only after this incident that I realized my misunderstanding. Since then, I have corrected this mistake by purchasing a new railcard and have made it a priority to ensure I am fully compliant with travel regulations.
The trips in question were primarily made to celebrate my graduation, where my family came to join me. I paid for the tickets in good faith, assuming I was using the railcard properly. I understand now that it was my responsibility to confirm its validity beforehand, and I sincerely apologize for this error.
Unfortunately, since graduating, I have faced significant financial challenges and am currently struggling to find permanent employment. The total sum of £738.70 is overwhelming for me, especially in light of my current circumstances. While I am grateful for the opportunity to resolve this administratively, I kindly request if there is any possibility to reduce the amount or arrange a manageable payment plan.
Please be assured that I have learned from this mistake and will take every precaution to ensure that it does not happen again. I deeply regret the oversight and the inconvenience caused, and I humbly ask for your understanding and leniency.
Thank you for considering my appeal. I hope we can resolve this matter amicably.
Yours sincerely,

 

[alholmes]

The Settlement offer is only for 14 days from the date of their letter. If it’s not paid then they are likely to start the process for prosecuting you in court. Do you really want to risk that happening? A criminal conviction may have significantly more impact on you as you state that you are an immigrant to the UK.

If they were to offer a payment plan (which is extremely unlikely), it would only spread the payment over a very short period (just 2-3 months), would that be manageable anyway? However we rarely see payment plans offered - I don’t recall seeing Chiltern ever offering a payment plan, based on cases on this forum. Is there any way you can borrow money from family or friends in the short term?

 

[Haywain]

The trips in question were primarily made to celebrate my graduation, where my family came to join me.

8 trips to celebrate your graduation?

I paid for the tickets in good faith, assuming I was using the railcard properly.

Good faith counts for nothing if you are not paying the correct fare.

Thank you for considering my appeal. I hope we can resolve this matter amicably.

I would expect the response to be that you can pay £739 or be prosecuted. You only have a slim possibility of getting a payment plan and if you want a chance of that you need to set out how soon you would complete the payments.

 

[kayode1212]

The Settlement offer is only for 14 days from the date of their letter. If it’s not paid then they are likely to start the process for prosecuting you in court. Do you really want to risk that happening? A criminal conviction may have significantly more impact on you as you state that you are an immigrant to the UK.

If they were to offer a payment plan (which is extremely unlikely), it would only spread the payment over a very short period (just 2-3 months), would that be manageable anyway? However we rarely see payment plans offered - I don’t recall seeing Chiltern ever offering a payment plan, based on cases on this forum. Is there any way you can borrow money from family or friends in the short term?

Thank you for the advice

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 12 Jan 2025 ==

8 trips to celebrate your graduation?

Good faith counts for nothing if you are not paying the correct fare.

I would expect the response to be that you can pay £739 or be prosecuted. You only have a slim possibility of getting a payment plan and if you want a chance of that you need to set out how soon you would complete the payments.

Thank you for the reply

 

[AndroidBango]

ok

The trips in question were primarily made to celebrate my graduation, where my family came to join me. I paid for the tickets in good faith, assuming I was using the railcard properly.

Did you use the railcard to buy tickets for your family to travel at the same time? If so, really don't mention this.

 

[kayode1212]

Did you use the railcard to buy tickets for your family to travel at the same time? If so, really don't mention this.

No I didn’t

 

[ikcdab]

You also clearly don't understand the nature of an appeal. An appeal is only possible if there was an error in the process or you have new, relevant information. As your appeal didn't covet either of those, then you should expect it to be rejected.

 

[Fawkes Cat]

You also clearly don't understand the nature of an appeal. An appeal is only possible if there was an error in the process or you have new, relevant information. As your appeal didn't covet either of those, then you should expect it to be rejected.

Although this has already been mentioned, it's more to the point that the railway has no obligation to reconsider the amount they're prepared to accept to settle a matter out of court. If you don't like the offer you have been made, then you can face being taken to court and see what the magistrates have to say - which experience tells us will be that you will be found guilty and have to pay a fine, costs and so on.

I know this isn't what the OP wants to hear, but the choice is between finding the £739 that the railway require them to pay, or paying what may be more in a fine to the court, and having a criminal record which may have to be declared. My advice would be to find the £739 by any legitimate means (overdraft, credit card, family, if OP is still a student their institution might have a hardship fund which could help) and pay it.

 

[WesternLancer]

ok.. i would like to probably appeal. Please let me know if this is okay.

Dear Economic Crime & Fraud Unit,
Thank you for taking the time to assess my case and for offering me the opportunity to resolve this matter without prosecution. I deeply regret my mistake and sincerely apologize for the oversight.
As a recent immigrant to the UK pursuing my studies, I am still adapting to many aspects of life here, including managing railcards and understanding the nuances of the system. When I first enrolled in school, I obtained a railcard but unfortunately was unaware it had expired. Back in my home country, there is no comparable system requiring renewal of travel discounts, and this was my first experience managing a railcard.
I had genuinely believed that if my railcard expired, I would not be able to use the discount and would need to purchase a new one. It was only after this incident that I realized my misunderstanding. Since then, I have corrected this mistake by purchasing a new railcard and have made it a priority to ensure I am fully compliant with travel regulations.
The trips in question were primarily made to celebrate my graduation, where my family came to join me. I paid for the tickets in good faith, assuming I was using the railcard properly. I understand now that it was my responsibility to confirm its validity beforehand, and I sincerely apologize for this error.
Unfortunately, since graduating, I have faced significant financial challenges and am currently struggling to find permanent employment. The total sum of £738.70 is overwhelming for me, especially in light of my current circumstances. While I am grateful for the opportunity to resolve this administratively, I kindly request if there is any possibility to reduce the amount or arrange a manageable payment plan.
Please be assured that I have learned from this mistake and will take every precaution to ensure that it does not happen again. I deeply regret the oversight and the inconvenience caused, and I humbly ask for your understanding and leniency.
Thank you for considering my appeal. I hope we can resolve this matter amicably.
Yours sincerely,

There is no ability to Appeal. It’s pay this or go to court. I suppose you could politely ask if they would accept some payment by instalments but they don’t usually do this. I would suggest seeing if you can borrow the money from family member and then pay them back in instalments.

Sorry this isn’t more helpful advice but the railway regards it as your responsibility to check your railcard is in date. I’m not sure if you would have eventually done that or just kept on claiming the discount blissfully unaware you were no longer entitled to it.

 

[spotify95]

Just to point out, if this did go to court, then would it be possible to persuade the court that the actual losses incurred by Chiltern would amount to 8x Off Peak Returns, and not 16x Anytime Singles, which is what the customer would have paid for in a normal circumstance (obviously no railcard discount as not entitled to it). Therefore the amount of money payable to Chiltern, would be significantly reduced from the ~£700 they are asking?

Obviously the total due would still be significant due to the court costs, fine etc, but at least a court would be willing to set up a payment plan, something a TOC won't accept due to the 6 month prosecution limit?

 

[SuspectUsual]

Just to point out, if this did go to court, then would it be possible to persuade the court that the actual losses incurred by Chiltern would amount to 8x Off Peak Returns, and not 16x Anytime Singles, which is what the customer would have paid for in a normal circumstance (obviously no railcard discount as not entitled to it). Therefore the amount of money payable to Chiltern, would be significantly reduced from the ~£700 they are asking?

Obviously the total due would still be significant due to the court costs, fine etc, but at least a court would be willing to set up a payment plan, something a TOC won't accept due to the 6 month prosecution limit?

Possibly, but by no means guaranteed, and the chances of success will be greater if legal representation is engaged and paid for. And given the costs we’ve seen quoted for solicitors, any reduction in fares due would be more than offset.

And the OP would still have a criminal conviction

 

[Haywain]

Just to point out, if this did go to court, then would it be possible to persuade the court that the actual losses incurred by Chiltern would amount to 8x Off Peak Returns, and not 16x Anytime Singles, which is what the customer would have paid for in a normal circumstance (obviously no railcard discount as not entitled to it). Therefore the amount of money payable to Chiltern, would be significantly reduced from the ~£700 they are asking?

Obviously the total due would still be significant due to the court costs, fine etc, but at least a court would be willing to set up a payment plan, something a TOC won't accept due to the 6 month prosecution limit?

You appear to be overlooking how keen most people are to avoid conviction and a criminal record.

 

[island]

Just to point out, if this did go to court, then would it be possible to persuade the court that the actual losses incurred by Chiltern would amount to 8x Off Peak Returns, and not 16x Anytime Singles, which is what the customer would have paid for in a normal circumstance (obviously no railcard discount as not entitled to it). Therefore the amount of money payable to Chiltern, would be significantly reduced from the ~£700 they are asking?

Obviously the total due would still be significant due to the court costs, fine etc, but at least a court would be willing to set up a payment plan, something a TOC won't accept due to the 6 month prosecution limit?

You are correct, but naturally the downside is that a criminal record would also be incurred.

 

[AlterEgo]

ok.. i would like to probably appeal.

You do not have a formal right of appeal. You have committed a criminal offence for which you are to be prosecuted, and the company has detected that other offences have been committed, even if you do not realise this. So, don't use the word "appeal" - although you are still free to ask for them to consider a payment plan or to settle for a lower amount. Bear in mind they are under no obligation to accept this and they may instead simply prosecute you, and if they do, you will still have to pay the fare/s back, and be fined as punishment, and have to pay a surcharge. And, you will have a criminal record.

 

[Hadders]

If the case ends up in court then realistically Chiltern could only prosecute you for the offence on the day when you were caught. You would be found guilty by the court and have to pay:

- A fine based upon your income, normally discounted by a third if you plead guilty at the earliest opportunity
- A surcharge of 40% of the value of the fine
- Compensation for the fare avoided ont he day you were caught
- Contribution towards Chiltern's costs

This is all likely to total somewhere between £500 and £1,000. In addition you would have a criminal record.

As an alternative, Chiltern are offering you the opportunity to keep the matter out of court but to do so will cost you £739. If you accept CHoltern's offer that will be the end of the matter, no criminal record either.

 

[AlterEgo]

If the case ends up in court then realistically Chiltern could only prosecute you for the offence on the day when you were caught.

They can also ask the defendant if they would like other offences to be taken into consideration, without prosecuting for them separately. This would entitle them to the outstanding fares for the multiple other occasions too.