Odd LNER cancellations

[D1537]

This morning, the first northbound LNER northern shuttle (1L41 Doncaster-Newcastle) and the first southbound (1K41 Newcastle-York) are cancelled, both because of a "track circuit defect (IC)". I'm wondering how a track circuit issue could have cancelled two trains starting over 100 miles apart from each other, especially as there are no other LNER cancellations as far as I can see. Also, the second northbound shuttle (1L42 York-Newcastle) is also cancelled, so passengers at Northallerton have a 90 minute wait for the next train to Darlington, Durham and Newcastle. This isn't the first time there have been issues with the shuttle recently, and it causes particular issues for Northallerton passengers, especially northbound.

 

[800001]

This morning, the first northbound LNER northern shuttle (1L41 Doncaster-Newcastle) and the first southbound (1K41 Newcastle-York) are cancelled, both because of a "track circuit defect (IC)". I'm wondering how a track circuit issue could have cancelled two trains starting over 100 miles apart from each other, especially as there are no other LNER cancellations as far as I can see. Also, the second northbound shuttle (1L42 York-Newcastle) is also cancelled, so passengers at Northallerton have a 90 minute wait for the next train to Darlington, Durham and Newcastle. This isn't the first time there have been issues with the shuttle recently, and it causes particular issues for Northallerton passengers, especially northbound.

Track circuit failure is just south of Newcastle station according to tweets from LNER.
The cancellation will most likely been to thin out service at Newcastle, as the length of time the fault would be active would be h known.

 

[D1537]

Track circuit failure is just south of Newcastle station according to tweets from LNER.
The cancellation will most likely been to thin out service at Newcastle, as the length of time the fault would be active would be h known.

It seems that LNER always hit the shuttles (1K42 and 1L43 have now been cancelled as well, so that's the whole morning's service), especially given that the shuttles were provided to partly compensate Northallerton for the removal of their Liverpool-Newcastle hourly services.

 

[800001]

It seems that LNER always hit the shuttles (1K42 and 1L43 have now been cancelled as well, so that's the whole morning's service), especially given that the shuttles were provided to partly compensate Northallerton for the removal of their Liverpool-Newcastle hourly services.

Have there been no SSO (special stop orders) places on any other services to compensate?

It may be NWR who asked for those shuttles to initially be cancelled.

As we all know once one service is cancelled, is there a driver to then get the sets off the depot.

If they didn’t cancel the shuttle what would they cancel? Only options are long distance services, carrying far more passengers.

 

[LA50041]

It seems that LNER always hit the shuttles (1K42 and 1L43 have now been cancelled as well, so that's the whole morning's service), especially given that the shuttles were provided to partly compensate Northallerton for the removal of their Liverpool-Newcastle hourly services.

As has been said, the service needed to be thinned out due to the track circuit failure.
if 1L41 is cancelled, 1K42 will also be cancelled as they are the same unit which is not there, same as 1K41 forms 1L42 so no unit to form 1L42

 

[D1537]

As has been said, the service needed to be thinned out due to the track circuit failure.
if 1L41 is cancelled, 1K42 will also be cancelled as they are the same unit which is not there, same as 1K41 forms 1L42 so no unit to form 1L42

Well, not necessarily; if L41 and K41 are cancelled, the unit that would have done K41 will still be at Newcastle, so could do K42 (etc).

Have there been no SSO (special stop orders) places on any other services to compensate?

It may be NWR who asked for those shuttles to initially be cancelled.

As we all know once one service is cancelled, is there a driver to then get the sets off the depot.

If they didn’t cancel the shuttle what would they cancel? Only options are long distance services, carrying far more passengers.

Nothing appears to have been stopped additionally (as they weren't when shuttles have been cancelled before). In my thinking the logical thing would be to terminate a few Liverpool-Newcastle TPE (and v/v) at York, but I am not a planner and obviously that may not be possible.

 

[LA50041]

Well, not necessarily; if L41 and K41 are cancelled, the unit that would have done K41 will still be at Newcastle, so could do K42 (etc).

if 2 down trains are cancelled, and only 1 up train is cancelled there will be a stock imbalance

 

[43094]

1S06 stopped additionally at Northallerton, to cover the cancelled 1L42.

Cause is indeed the requirement for a thinned out service, due to the track circuit failure.

 

[D1537]

1S06 stopped additionally at Northallerton, to cover the cancelled 1L42.

Cause is indeed the requirement for a thinned out service, due to the track circuit failure.

1S06 only dropped 2 minutes at NTR, so it must have been a quick stop! Can't see that anything stopped in lieu of 1L43 (but could be wrong). The southbounds don't matter so much at there's a TPE 20 minutes after them.

The first 3 down trains were cancelled but it appears 1L44 is running.
The first 3 up trains were cancelled but 1K44 is cancelled, 1K45 will presumably be the first one running.

You would have thought there was a unit at Newcastle for 1K44, but looking at RTT the 5-car that should have started the shuttle from Newcastle this morning was sent to Carlisle on the 0936 route-learner instead...

 

[800001]

Well, not necessarily; if L41 and K41 are cancelled, the unit that would have done K41 will still be at Newcastle, so could do K42 (etc).


Nothing appears to have been stopped additionally (as they weren't when shuttles have been cancelled before). In my thinking the logical thing would be to terminate a few Liverpool-Newcastle TPE (and v/v) at York, but I am not a planner and obviously that may not be possible.

You can’t just use the units to do other service.

One is a 5 car bimode, one is a 5 car electric.

Putting them on the services on the wrong diagram puts the units ending at wrong depot.

That will then potentially cause a traction imbalance the following day.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 13 May 2025 ==

1S06 only dropped 2 minutes at NTR, so it must have been a quick stop! Can't see that anything stopped in lieu of 1L43 (but could be wrong). The southbounds don't matter so much at there's a TPE 20 minutes after them.

The first 3 down trains were cancelled but it appears 1L44 is running.
The first 3 up trains were cancelled but 1K44 is cancelled, 1K45 will presumably be the first one running.

You would have thought there was a unit at Newcastle for 1K44, but looking at RTT the 5-car that should have started the shuttle from Newcastle this morning was sent to Carlisle on the 0936 route-learner instead...

As for the route learner…is there not a specific unit there already for it? I’m sure there is!!

They don’t just run route learner when a train is cancelled, there is a specific requirement for Tyne route learners.

@43094 will be able to confirm if the Tyne route learner unit is completely independent of passenger diagrams .

 

[43094]

As above, that balances the traction and enables the route learner to.run, which contains the disruption to customers to this morning only (and not in to this afternoon / tomorrow).

One is an electric and one a bi-mode, which would need factoring in for tonight into tomorrow, in the event that they were to swap over.

Edit to the above: it looks like the route learner was designed to inter-work originally, but is now stand-alone today, due to the disruption

 

[800Travel]

Newcastle to York has been crazy today. 2 signalling outages, and now a line side fire between Durham and Newcastle.

A line-side fire between Durham and Newcastle means all lines are currently closed. As a result, trains may be cancelled, delayed by up to 45 minutes or revised.

https://www.nationalrail.co.uk/service-disruptions/chester-le-street-20250513/

A Tyne and Wear Fire and Rescue Service spokesperson said: "We can confirm that five fire appliances – including an Aerial Ladder Platform and a High Volume Pump – are in attendance of an ongoing fire at an industrial unit in Birtley

https://www.thenorthernecho.co.uk/news/25160060.chester-le-street-fire-live-smoke-seen-across-town/

 

[800001]

Newcastle to York has been crazy today. 2 signalling outages, and now a line side fire between Durham and Newcastle.



https://www.nationalrail.co.uk/service-disruptions/chester-le-street-20250513/



https://www.thenorthernecho.co.uk/news/25160060.chester-le-street-fire-live-smoke-seen-across-town/

Looks like Southbound services are using the slow line past Tyne Yard, running wrong line from Ouston Junction then crossing back over onto Up Main at Ouston Cross overs.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 13 May 2025 ==

Link below to Newcastle Chronicle, shows a video of the fire, which is right next to Birtley Football club.

Updates as firefighters battle ongoing fire at Birtley industrial unit

What appears to be a major fire has broken out in an area of Gateshead

www.chroniclelive.co.uk

 

[800Travel]

Looks like Southbound services are using the slow line past Tyne Yard, running wrong line from Ouston Junction then crossing back over onto Up Main at Ouston Cross overs.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 13 May 2025 ==

Link below to Newcastle Chronicle, shows a video of the fire, which is right next to Birtley Football club.

Yeah - I saw 1E21 sitting on the Tyne Yard Reversible line on signal maps at a red at one point. Guessing that at some point they deemed the up main too close to the fire, but the others ok.

(Mods - No source as this was hours ago and I didn't take a screenshot)

 

[800001]

Yeah - I saw 1E21 sitting on the Tyne Yard Reversible line on signal maps at a red at one point. Guessing that at some point they deemed the up main too close to the fire, but the others ok.

(Mods - No source as this was hours ago and I didn't take a screenshot)

Tbf I’m surprised the line was reopened in some way so quick. The videos I’ve seen off fire showed some serious flames and smoke.
Credit to the fire service for getting it under control so quickly.

 

[800Travel]

Tbf I’m surprised the line was reopened in some way so quick. The videos I’ve seen off fire showed so serious flames and smoke.
Credit to the fire service for getting it under control so quickly.

100% very impressive - can't remember where, but there was another industrial estate fire elsewhere recently that took ages to put out, so this was lucky comparatively. I think it also significantly helped that it wasn't a fire on the railway itself - thinking electricity box shorting out or something catching light with the heat etc. That could cause much longer disruption too.

 

[Jonny]

What is worse is that while there was no service for a large part of the day stopping st Chester-le-Street, freight and OAO services seemed to be passing through. At minimum that makes the railway look bad. The contingency plans do need to be reviewed to maintain services to all future-GBR stations when the railway is still open.