Not paying full travel ticket?

[Merami]

A friend of mine traveled from an unmanned station to a manned station, with several stations in between, there was no conductor to buy a ticket from on the train. At her destination station, she asked for a ticket from her most recent stop, but that one was a manned station and she was asked to step aside and speak to a revenue inspector who asked her to sign a paper that would caution her.
She said the inspector asked her why she asked for the most recent stop. Her answer was because she thought she'd only have to pay for her last stop if there was no chance for her to buy a ticket until her destination station.

She is scared about what will happen now. Will she prosecuted for this?
She gave her real name and her parents address (letters don't get misdelivered there, whereas with her own flat, letters get lost) is this a problem? Bare in mind, she told me the inspector spoke on the phone to someone and told her that she wasn't registered there, and she told the inspector her mother lived there, after which the said it was okay and continued questioning her.

What will happen now?
(By the way, what would have happened if she gave a completely wrong address here and the inspector found out?!)

Thanks in advance!

 

[Clip]

There are numerous threads about these sorts of incidents on this forum and its amazing what people will do to save a few quid but then brick it when they get caught. Search for Northern, in the advanced search function and if that doesnt work go to google and type in 'Northern Rail fine site:railforums.co.uk'


Its very hard to say what Northern will do from here on in , there are a few options open for them. However, there isnt much solid advice to give until she recieves the letter from them telling her what their next actions are.

 

[island]

There are numerous threads about these sorts of incidents on this forum and its amazing what people will do to save a few quid but then brick it when they get caught. Search for Northern, in the advanced search function and if that doesnt work go to google and type in 'Northern Rail fine site:railforums.co.uk'


Its very hard to say what Northern will do from here on in , there are a few options open for them. However, there isnt much solid advice to give until she recieves the letter from them telling her what their next actions are.

Nobody said it was Northern...

 

[Merami]

Thanks for the replies so far.
It was not northern. The incident was in Wales.


I would appreciate your thoughts on this matter.

 

[Clip]

Nobody said it was Northern...

Good point, im just so used to it being them that I went into auto mode.

 

[island]

Thanks for the replies so far.
It was not northern. The incident was in Wales.


I would appreciate your thoughts on this matter.

When your friend (or was it you?) chose to lie about the start of her journey in order to evade part of the fare, this constituted a criminal offence under section 5 of the Regulation of Railways Act 1889. On conviction this offence carries a maximum fine of £1,000 and a criminal record.

Arrive Trains Wales is cracking down on fare evasion lately due to the increasing cost of running the railway network. In cases like these, the alleged offender is usually sent a letter within about 6 weeks asking for a statement or explanation on the matter. The outcome then broadly fits into one of three categories: either no further action is taken; the train operating company offers to dispose of the matter out of court on receipt of a payment in respect of the fare avoided plus the administrative costs incurred in dealing with the matter; or the information is laid before a magistrates court for prosecution.

It is not straightforward to predict the particular outcome for any given case, but historical indications suggest that a prompt and apologetic letter in reply to the above-mentioned request for explanation, devoid of accusations of impropriety on the part of anyone but the alleged offender, and inclusive of an enquiry as to the amount which the train operating company might accept in return for letting the matter go no further will result in the second-mentioned outcome in my previous paragraph. The chance of this is lessened if the alleged offender has come to the notice of the train operating company before in similar circumstances. Amounts frequently mentioned tend to be below but close to £100.

I hope this provides the details you need.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
One further thing: having given an address other than her own, it would be wise for the alleged offender to ensure that the occupants at that address promptly bring to her attention any mail received as failing to respond to correspondence almost inevitably leads to prosecution.

 

[bb21]

As long as she can be contacted at that address and it is accepted, the address is not a problem.

Well, the excuse she gave was a bit daft isn't it? How the hell she thought that she did not have to pay for the journey she made is beyond me. In fact, it may well be argued that this action demonstrated clear intent to avoid paying the correct fare, ie. fare evasion, should this matter proceed to court under the Regulation of Railways Act, with a criminal record on conviction. So she is right to be scared.

What does she want to do now? Does she want to try and settle the matter out of court with ATW (who I assume are the train company concerned), or does she want to fight it in court, or does she want to go down some other avenue?

Furthermore, as to your other question, if she gave a completely wrong address and got caught, that is also a Regulation of Railways Act offence, with the associated criminal record on conviction as I stated above. There are of course fines, compensation and victim surcharge she will have to pay in the event of conviction.

 

[northwichcat]

Bare in mind, she told me the inspector spoke on the phone to someone and told her that she wasn't registered there, and she told the inspector her mother lived there, after which the said it was okay and continued questioning her.

How would he find that out? If he was using voter's list then it would only be the edited version which you can 'opt-out' off. While they shouldn't use a credit reference agency (who would have everyone's details) without your consent.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

The incident was in Wales.

This is probably applicable then: http://www.arrivatrainswales.co.uk/RevenueEnforcementPolicy/

 

[Deerfold]

How would he find that out? If he was using voter's list then it would only be the edited version which you can 'opt-out' off.

Would it? Government departments certainly have access to the full version. Do TOCs?

 

[Merami]

Thanks for all the advice.
Our biggest fear is prosecution. She is willing to pay any fees and any other costs that are demanded of her.
What are the chances of her being prosecuted?
And when the letter arrives I think it would be a good idea to share some of the details here so that we make sure we make it clear she wants to cooperate and is willing to do anything she can to help the company gain back whatever they lost as a result of this case.

Your help and advice has been amazing so far!

 

[bb21]

Thanks for all the advice.
Our biggest fear is prosecution. She is willing to pay any fees and any other costs that are demanded of her.
What are the chances of her being prosecuted?

Low, assuming that it is a first offence, and that she shows genuine remorse and the right attitude, but not impossible.

When you receive the letter, do come back so we can discuss how to proceed depending on what she wants to do. Any chance of telling us the journey concerned? I assume that it is a local journey?

 

[Merami]

I am not sure she'd be okay with me sharing that. However her full fare cost would have been £12.30.
Will this make a difference?
I am glad that prosecution is less likely if you are a first offender!

 

[Merami]

I will ask her if she is willing to share the journey .

 

[bb21]

Don't worry about the details. I asked the question so that we could see the magnitude of the fare evaded. That information on the fare due is quite sufficient to me.

 

[Merami]

Thank you!
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
After speaking with her yesterday, she wanted to know that in the case that she does get prosecuted, should she wait for a letter from the court to arrive at her parents address or should she wait for it at her own address?

 

[island]

As I said above, any letter would come to the address the alleged offender gave.

 

[455driver]

As I said above, any letter would come to the address the alleged offender gave.

hence all the threads on here about people being prosecuted in their absence, not knowing anything about it etc, simply because they gave a false address in the beginning.

 

[Merami]

Incredible advice all around here. Comforting.
What is easier for the TOC? To prosecute someone or have them admit their wrong and demonstrate that they are willing to help the TOC to resolve the situation before prosecution occurs?

I assume it is easier to do the latter as it resolves the matter faster for the TOC.

Thanks again everyone. Will update you when the letter arrives or if there are any more questions!

 

[DelayRepay]

Incredible advice all around here. Comforting.
What is easier for the TOC? To prosecute someone or have them admit their wrong and demonstrate that they are willing to help the TOC to resolve the situation before prosecution occurs?

I assume it is easier to do the latter as it resolves the matter faster for the TOC.

I think TOCs would prefer an out of court settlement because they get the money. If they successfully prosecute, they get the fare and probably get their costs paid but the fine goes to the court. There will be cases where they prosecute regardless though because they judge the offence to be very serious, e.g. a repeat offender.