• Our new ticketing site is now live! Using either this or the original site (both powered by TrainSplit) helps support the running of the forum with every ticket purchase! Find out more and ask any questions/give us feedback in this thread!

Northumberland Line reopening: progress updates

Status
Not open for further replies.
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R

RailUK Forums

Kite159

Veteran Member
Joined
27 Jan 2014
Messages
22,755
Location
West of Andover

ainsworth74

Forum Staff
Staff Member
Global Moderator
Joined
16 Nov 2009
Messages
31,089
Location
Redcar
he line is a great success and needs the extra funding which, in the grand scheme of things, is a rounding error, to make it complete.
Yes but the HM Treasury have this spreadsheet which says that the only thing that matters is the in year spending and if the in year spending goes to high that makes the spreadsheet sad. So we can't possibly just accept spending a bit more now (and we should look at why it's cost exceeded budget of course but still) on the basis that it would be money well spent over the next hundred years of the assets life.

Damn, I think I let feelings expressed in my Forum Signature loose again :lol:
 

Railwaysceptic

Established Member
Joined
6 Nov 2017
Messages
1,736
Of course not.

The line is a great success and needs the extra funding which, in the grand scheme of things, is a rounding error, to make it complete.
The mooted £37.9 million is not a mere rounding error in the scheme of this project. It's a huge increase.
 

stevieinselby

Established Member
Joined
6 Jan 2013
Messages
1,689
Location
Selby
The notion of folk from Ashington going to the theatre made me chuckle.
They're known more for their appreciation of fine art.
This amateur art group was founded in 1934 by local miners. With great enthusiasm and no little talent, they were able to illustrate their thoughts and feelings far more effectively through art than they could ever put into words. From its early days, as an art appreciation class, the Ashington Group created an important historical record. Visit Woodhorn Museum, browse the gallery so that you too may appreciate their art and their lives.
 

GuyGibsonVC

Member
Joined
29 Nov 2019
Messages
232
Location
Up North
The mooted £37.9 million is not a mere rounding error in the scheme of this project. It's a huge increase.

The ‘grand scheme’ was in relation to other infrastructure projects such as HS2, Crossrail, TransPennine Route Upgrade, East Coast Digital Railway, Midland Maiine Electrification and others.

The cost of looking at and deciding not to dual the A1 north of Morpeth was £70 million.
 

yorkie

Forum Staff
Staff Member
Administrator
Joined
6 Jun 2005
Messages
78,311
Location
Yorkshire
Whatever the minutiae of how anyone wants to word it, it's difficult to argue that it's not a lot of money for an overrun.
 

Snex

Member
Joined
20 Jun 2018
Messages
449
I might have misread it somewhere but wasn't the original cost meant to be around £150m and it was already way over budget without this extra £30m on top?
 

Baxenden Bank

Established Member
Joined
23 Oct 2013
Messages
4,744
I might have misread it somewhere but wasn't the original cost meant to be around £150m and it was already way over budget without this extra £30m on top?
£167m in 2019 prices. As per the Transport & Works Act Funding Statement.
The total anticipated costs of reintroducing passenger services between Ashington and Newcastle (known as the Northumberland Line project) are estimated to be £167m in 2019 prices. This includes the cost of carrying out the works and implementing the other matters provided for in the proposed Order.
 

Snex

Member
Joined
20 Jun 2018
Messages
449
£167m in 2019 prices. As per the Transport & Works Act Funding Statement.

Thanks for confirming, knew it was something like that. So anywhere upto £215m, accounting for inflation upto 2025. Knew it wasn't anywhere near £300m originally.

That's been generous aswell, since it was meant to be open a year ago and I'd assume a fair chunk of the money would've been spent before this year aswell so it should really be much higher since it was bought in 2019's or whatever prices so the £300m should really be converted into 2025 prices aswell depending on what was spent each year.
 
Last edited:

NorthOxonian

Established Member
Associate Staff
Buses & Coaches
Joined
5 Jul 2018
Messages
1,670
Location
Oxford/Newcastle
Then again, it's worth noting it has beaten projected demand by a significant margin (much more than 12%). Sadly the treasury won't look at that side of the balance sheet and I suspect this'll not get properly completed.
 

GuyGibsonVC

Member
Joined
29 Nov 2019
Messages
232
Location
Up North
Then again, it's worth noting it has beaten projected demand by a significant margin (much more than 12%). Sadly the treasury won't look at that side of the balance sheet and I suspect this'll not get properly completed.

Agreed. It has had over 500,000 journeys in 8 months with three stations yet to open. That is far beyond what they had forecast and is being reported up to five times more than predicted.
 

zwk500

Veteran Member
Joined
20 Jan 2020
Messages
18,522
Location
Northampton
Agreed. It has had over 500,000 journeys in 8 months with three stations yet to open. That is far beyond what they had forecast and is being reported up to five times more than predicted.
Do you have the original forecasts (or any reporter's workings out) to confirm that?
 

swt_passenger

Veteran Member
Joined
7 Apr 2010
Messages
34,269
Then again, it's worth noting it has beaten projected demand by a significant margin (much more than 12%). Sadly the treasury won't look at that side of the balance sheet and I suspect this'll not get properly completed.
Yes, there are 3 stations to open, but they're all well beyond the point of no return. What is it you’re assuming won’t get ‘properly completed’, given that Bebside is about 95% complete?
 

Snex

Member
Joined
20 Jun 2018
Messages
449
Then again, it's worth noting it has beaten projected demand by a significant margin (much more than 12%). Sadly the treasury won't look at that side of the balance sheet and I suspect this'll not get properly completed.

To be fair if it the treasury won't fund it, I'd imagine NECA (North East Combined Authority) would just come in with their pot instead. I believe they're doing a share of it anyway.

It would be an embarrassment on a local level if it didn't get complete with the A1 being cancelled, at the same time.

Labour got demolished in the local council elections, as it is, it's not like they're riding high locally.
 

GuyGibsonVC

Member
Joined
29 Nov 2019
Messages
232
Location
Up North
Do you have the original forecasts (or any reporter's workings out) to confirm that?


This states the council was predicting 50,000 when it had already hit 250,000 in April.

Not an exact science but I’m sure the passenger modelling data will be somewhere.
 

williamn

Established Member
Joined
22 May 2008
Messages
1,663

zwk500

Veteran Member
Joined
20 Jan 2020
Messages
18,522
Location
Northampton

This states the council was predicting 50,000 when it had already hit 250,000 in April.

Not an exact science but I’m sure the passenger modelling data will be somewhere.
From a 2018 Outline Business Case, the 2025 Annual Demand for Option T2 (2tph Serving all 6 stations) was 564,000. Now not all the stations are open, and 250,000 in 5 months will still beat that, but it's not 5 times is it? I don't know the source of the 50,000 number, would be interesting to know.

(would post a screenshot but for some reason can't paste images in to the box at the moment).

https://gat04-live-1517c8a4486c4160...p40_-_outline_business_case_november_2019.pdf (page 97 of the file, Table 4-2).

I do find it funny that when bad reporting is critical of the railway it is taken apart on these forums, yet positive reporting is accepted without questions.
 

deltic

Established Member
Joined
8 Feb 2010
Messages
3,715
From a 2018 Outline Business Case, the 2025 Annual Demand for Option T2 (2tph Serving all 6 stations) was 564,000. Now not all the stations are open, and 250,000 in 5 months will still beat that, but it's not 5 times is it? I don't know the source of the 50,000 number, would be interesting to know.

(would post a screenshot but for some reason can't paste images in to the box at the moment).

https://gat04-live-1517c8a4486c4160...p40_-_outline_business_case_november_2019.pdf (page 97 of the file, Table 4-2).

I do find it funny that when bad reporting is critical of the railway it is taken apart on these forums, yet positive reporting is accepted without questions.
The report notes that the 564k is the number of return journeys, does that mean the forecast was in fact for 1.28m trips on the line, the revenue number at £5.1m seems high given the present low fares on the route.
 

GuyGibsonVC

Member
Joined
29 Nov 2019
Messages
232
Location
Up North
From a 2018 Outline Business Case, the 2025 Annual Demand for Option T2 (2tph Serving all 6 stations) was 564,000. Now not all the stations are open, and 250,000 in 5 months will still beat that, but it's not 5 times is it? I don't know the source of the 50,000 number, would be interesting to know.

(would post a screenshot but for some reason can't paste images in to the box at the moment).

https://gat04-live-1517c8a4486c4160...p40_-_outline_business_case_november_2019.pdf (page 97 of the file, Table 4-2).

I do find it funny that when bad reporting is critical of the railway it is taken apart on these forums, yet positive reporting is accepted without questions.

Do those forecasts take into account delayed opening of the line?

Anyway, the crux of the matter is that the line is a success and should be completed. It has been fantastic for the local area.
 

zwk500

Veteran Member
Joined
20 Jan 2020
Messages
18,522
Location
Northampton
Do those forecasts take into account delayed opening of the line?
It's the Outline Business Case so I don't believe so, although there are probably revised numbers somewhere that do.

Anyway, the crux of the matter is that the line is a success and should be completed. It has been fantastic for the local area.
Indeed. It was always a sensible proposal.

But it is important to understand for other projects if the line is actually meeting the demand forecasts or smashing them by 5. Especially as even industry media like Green Signals are running with the 5 times number.
 

nerdowell

Member
Joined
24 Apr 2024
Messages
53
Location
Bebside
Key reasons behind the increase include the final cost of mining remediation work, particularly at Northumberland Park, which was always one of the project’s biggest risks due to the unknown number of mine workings that needed to be treated. - Northumberland Gazette

This isn't a surprise, Northumberland Park had a tendancy to start sinking and having to have remedial work done with the Metro. Hopefully it's been completed to a decent standard and won't need Rail Replacement buses like the Metro did.
 

CdBrux

Member
Joined
4 Mar 2014
Messages
923
Location
Munich
The report notes that the 564k is the number of return journeys, does that mean the forecast was in fact for 1.28m trips on the line, the revenue number at £5.1m seems high given the present low fares on the route.
meaning, when comparing outcome vs forecast it is important not just to measure the journeys but also the revenue (or the price paid per journey). Only that gives the full picture
 

nerdowell

Member
Joined
24 Apr 2024
Messages
53
Location
Bebside
Work on Northumberland Park Station is progressing well following the completion of mining remediation and works to reprofile the site to provide space for the new platform...

Blyth Bebside
We are progressing with platform and station footbridge installation, as well as construction of the footpath to the new A189 foot and cycle bridge. This will require some overnight closures on the A189.

Works are nearing completion on Front Street and Errington Street to provide access to the new station and the car park. This requires temporary traffic lights on Front Street and the closure of part of Furnace Road...

Bedlington
We are continuing to construct the two new station platforms, along with the construction of the station car park. Over the school summer holidays, we have undertaken essential works on the roads surrounding the station to reconfigure the highway and footways, and to upgrade the drainage system...

August 2025 Newsletter/Round up of what's happened/planned. Notice there's a bit about the regulatory process of getting a new station online after construction is completed, probably hoping to educate and reduce the Facebook Whingers who complain about "It's built why isn't it open?!"
 
Last edited by a moderator:

swt_passenger

Veteran Member
Joined
7 Apr 2010
Messages
34,269
IS THERE ANY FURTHER UPDATES ON BEBSIDE OPENING
It won’t be in September, firstly because today’s news item is about outstanding work on the access junction traffic lights that start 16th and run for two weeks until late September. Secondly, the August newsletter (linked a few days ago), mentions that Bebside station car park is planned to open in October. You’d expect the carpark and station to open together?

We are sharing that there will be additional highways and footway work on Front Street, which is now anticipated to finish in late September 2025 due to additional sockets required for the new traffic light system.

As such the final stage of the highway works will now take place from Tuesday 16 September 2025 for up to two weeks following the overnight four-night full road closure on Front Street (between Kids Town & Errington Street) taking place from Friday 12 September and finishing on Monday 15 September. Works will be ongoing between 8am – 6pm each day during this period.

In order to carry out these works safely, lane closures will be in place with temporary traffic lights as well as a footway diversion. Please see below image for exact location. Please note that during these works Furnace Road entrance will remain open.

 
Last edited:
Status
Not open for further replies.

Top