Northern Unit Refurbishments and depot allocations.

[Adam0984]

Does anyone know when 333015 is due back?

At the weekend

 

[Harvey B]

At the weekend

Thanks

 

[_toommm_]

This has probably been said already, so if it has, i apologise:

What seats are they using for the refurb 158s, like on 158904? They look incredibly similar to the IEP seats. Following on from that, are they all going to get the new style seats, or are some remaining as the older cushy chairs, as they're the most comfortable seats IMO with lots of padding on the bottom.

 

[Harvey B]

This has probably been said already, so if it has, i apologise:

What seats are they using for the refurb 158s, like on 158904? They look incredibly similar to the IEP seats. Following on from that, are they all going to get the new style seats, or are some remaining as the older cushy chairs, as they're the most comfortable seats IMO with lots of padding on the bottom.

They're using 'Ironing boards' but apparently they're more comfortable than the ones used on Thameslink trains (I don't know what either are like)

 

[Mathew S]

They're using 'Ironing boards' but apparently they're more comfortable than the ones used on Thameslink trains (I don't know what either are like)

They are a lot more comfortable than the 700s; in a different league altogether in fact. I don't know quite how they've managed it, but they're as comfortable (in my opinion, at least) as any other train I've ever travelled on and easily better than anything else in the Northern fleet.

 

[Harvey B]

They are a lot more comfortable than the 700s; in a different league altogether in fact. I don't know quite how they've managed it, but they're as comfortable (in my opinion, at least) as any other train I've ever travelled on and easily better than anything else in the Northern fleet.

I take your word for it. From what I've heard, they are better than other 'Ironing Board' seats. I hope to ride a 158 (or a 331 or 195 when they come into service) to try the ironing boards out.

 

[_toommm_]

I take your word for it. From what I've heard, they are better than other 'Ironing Board' seats. I hope to ride a 158 (or a 331 or 195 when they come into service) to try the ironing boards out.

158904 is regularly seen on the Leeds to Manchester Vic. via Bradford Interchange runs - cheap advances are available even 15 minutes before departure for around £7 for the full 1.5hr journey.

 

[Bletchleyite]

They are a lot more comfortable than the 700s; in a different league altogether in fact. I don't know quite how they've managed it, but they're as comfortable (in my opinion, at least) as any other train I've ever travelled on and easily better than anything else in the Northern fleet.

It's just a different base. ScotRail did that first. There isn't a fundamental problem with the "ironing board" seats other than the base being a bit hard and lacking underthigh support, really.

 

[Mathew S]

It's just a different base. ScotRail did that first. There isn't a fundamental problem with the "ironing board" seats other than the base being a bit hard and lacking underthigh support, really.

I think there's also more legroom, though it's a while since I travelled on a 700. It also felt slightly less upright than a 700, but again I could be mistaken. Either way, I was, as you'll have gathered, very, very impressed.

 

[Mathew S]

I'm currently on a refurbished 156 (not sure which) with the new moquette style refurbed seats. Not a fan. The flat cloth, whilst more difficult to keep clean, looks and feels much better in my view. The pattern on the moquette is blurry rather than crisp and clear, and the feel of the seats themselves is very 1980s Ford Mondeo...
Surely an easily washable flat cloth would have been available rather than taking this backward step?

 

[Bantamzen]

I'm currently on a refurbished 156 (not sure which) with the new moquette style refurbed seats. Not a fan. The flat cloth, whilst more difficult to keep clean, looks and feels much better in my view. The pattern on the moquette is blurry rather than crisp and clear, and the feel of the seats themselves is very 1980s Ford Mondeo...
Surely an easily washable flat cloth would have been available rather than taking this backward step?
View attachment 62106 View attachment 62107 View attachment 62108

Uh oh! Can open, worms everywhere....

 

[Andrew Holland]

I'm currently on a refurbished 156 (not sure which) with the new moquette style refurbed seats. Not a fan. The flat cloth, whilst more difficult to keep clean, looks and feels much better in my view. The pattern on the moquette is blurry rather than crisp and clear, and the feel of the seats themselves is very 1980s Ford Mondeo...
Surely an easily washable flat cloth would have been available rather than taking this backward step?
View attachment 62106 View attachment 62107 View attachment 62108

Looks quite nice to me, but am I alone here in thinking of all the things that should be changed during a refurb (but are not, least not so far) one of the most important is the lighting? Nothing says "old tarted-up 1980s train on a budget" more than leaving exposed, harsh fluorescent tubes in place. Crikey this is 21st century now, at least fully diffuse the lighting if you can't rip it out and replace it with uplighting!

 

[dave87016]

that reminds me - need to get a pair of sunglasses

 

[LOL The Irony]

Surely an easily washable flat cloth would have been available rather than taking this backward step?

Uhhhhhh what?

 

[33109]

Yh the lighting has always been a bit harsh with the fluorescent tubes in place, overall the finish on the 156s isnt't too bad & I personally quite like the new moquette.

 

[Paul_10]

Looks quite nice to me, but am I alone here in thinking of all the things that should be changed during a refurb (but are not, least not so far) one of the most important is the lighting? Nothing says "old tarted-up 1980s train on a budget" more than leaving exposed, harsh fluorescent tubes in place. Crikey this is 21st century now, at least fully diffuse the lighting if you can't rip it out and replace it with uplighting!

I agree, i think it looks cheap and quite poor in my view of not have lighting diffusers fitted in on the refurbished 150/1 and Porterbrook 156s. Even Pacers have lighting diffusers from when they first started so why did the Sprinters did not?

 

[Matt_pool]

I agree, i think it looks cheap and quite poor in my view of not have lighting diffusers fitted in on the refurbished 150/1 and Porterbrook 156s. Even Pacers have lighting diffusers from when they first started so why did the Sprinters did not?

Whoever designed the interiors of these refurbished trains obviously never travels by train after dark, especially on a Friday or Saturday evening when you've had a few pints and you catch the train home at 8 or 9pm.

You want the lighting on the train to be relaxing, but instead you've got what feel like 1000w search lights shining in your eyes!

 

[43096]

They are a lot more comfortable than the 700s; in a different league altogether in fact. I don't know quite how they've managed it, but they're as comfortable (in my opinion, at least) as any other train I've ever travelled on and easily better than anything else in the Northern fleet.

I had 158845 yesterday from Chesterfield to Leeds with the new seats, so a good road test. Much better than the 700s, I would agree, but predictably less comfortable than the original 158 seats.

 

[323 Class]

This is 155345 that I rode 17/04/19 from Leeds to Knottingley.
The lighting is diffused and looks to be the same type as used on the class 142's.
I've been on a couple of Northern 150's that have these seats and some also have the LED tubes which works well with the lighter coloured seats.
I got on a Leeds to Morecombe train on the same day 150128 which had the red doors and LED tube lights. It hadn't been refurbished and it was a very dark dingy interior.

 

[Mathew S]

I had 158845 yesterday from Chesterfield to Leeds with the new seats, so a good road test. Much better than the 700s, I would agree, but predictably less comfortable than the original 158 seats.

Yeah, I think that's the one I've had. I disagree about the original 158 seats though. Backs too low, no head/neck support, and too soft - like sitting on a pillow, eugh.

 

[Bletchleyite]

View attachment 62117

This is 155345 that I rode 17/04/19 from Leeds to Knottingley.
The lighting is diffused and looks to be the same type as used on the class 142's.
I've been on a couple of Northern 150's that have these seats and some also have the LED tubes which works well with the lighter coloured seats.
I got on a Leeds to Morecombe train on the same day 150128 which had the red doors and LED tube lights. It hadn't been refurbished and it was a very dark dingy interior.

The 155s aren't a bad job, but there appears to be a very bright light shining into the saloon from the cab end which is highly unpleasant and ruins the ambiance.

 

[323 Class]

The 155s aren't a bad job, but there appears to be a very bright light shining into the saloon from the cab end which is highly unpleasant and ruins the ambiance.

There is another car connected beyond the toilet. I agree that the lights above the door entrance and gangway are somewhat glary but I was pleased that some TLC had improved the ambience.

 

[Malay States]

I was on 156440 yesterday with the newer (presumably mocquette) seats with the slightly darker shade of light blue. They were OK, and better than the cloth seats, if only for the darker shade.
To me, it is the light blue sides to the base that is the problem, particularly on facing seats which people put their feet on. Those on 319s look a right mess now, whereas the ones still with First or Thameslink seat bases look worn but not dirty, at a quick glance. I think the best solution is to have the seat base entirely dark blue.

In contrast to some views, I prefer low (as in the Scot Rail 156s) to high back seats. Also I have no problem with the lighting, although I usually travel in daylight.

 

[trainmananthon]

Heard a rumour today that Northern are now keeping their 153s and are PRM modding them. Unknown yet what will happen with the toilet, but it is likely that it’ll be removed and semi-permanently coupled to a unit with a toilet.

And apparently the 331s are being moved to Longtown for storage as they are being delivered faster than Northern can accept them into service!

 

[Harvey B]

Heard a rumour today that Northern are now keeping their 153s and are PRM modding them. Unknown yet what will happen with the toilet, but it is likely that it’ll be removed and semi-permanently coupled to a unit with a toilet.

And apparently the 331s are being moved to Longtown for storage as they are being delivered faster than Northern can accept them into service!

I'm not believing it until it is confirmed by Northern (or someone at Northern)

 

[Andrew Holland]

View attachment 62117

This is 155345 that I rode 17/04/19 from Leeds to Knottingley.
The lighting is diffused and looks to be the same type as used on the class 142's.
I've been on a couple of Northern 150's that have these seats and some also have the LED tubes which works well with the lighter coloured seats.
I got on a Leeds to Morecombe train on the same day 150128 which had the red doors and LED tube lights. It hadn't been refurbished and it was a very dark dingy interior.

Yup indeed, the 155s were fitted with diffused lighting from the start, but the 150s were not. Compare the overall look and feel of that 155 with a similarly refurbished 150, the 155 instantly looks a lot less old and cheap due solely to the lighting IMHO:

 

[Killingworth]

Yup indeed, the 155s were fitted with diffused lighting from the start, but the 150s were not. Compare the overall look and feel of that 155 with a similarly refurbished 150, the 155 instantly looks a lot less old and cheap due solely to the lighting IMHO:

But the test will be in 5 years time. Compare those with diffusers, by then filled with flies and wandering wires shading tubes of blue, white and yellow with the plain tubes, probably also in mismatched colours!

 

[Andrew Holland]

But the test will be in 5 years time. Compare those with diffusers, by then filled with flies and wandering wires shading tubes of blue, white and yellow with the plain tubes, probably also in mismatched colours!

5 years? I think you're being quite optimistic! I guess this is the usual standard of maintenance though eh, do you think it's worse under Arriva than with the previous TOC? Can't say I've ever been impressed with Arriva's standards wrt buses, haven't got much experience of their train operations however. OT but reminds me of the bus service in Malta (I did 3 years in Malta from 2015), very common there to see light fittings with wires hanging out, dead bugs in them, random other things broken due to lack of care and attention (of course the service was Arriva operated initially from 2011 to 2013 so the rot set in very early on!), new owner who took over in 2015 had a LOT of work to do to put right Arriva's mistakes...

But coming back to the lighting, your comment clearly highlights why refurbs should include uplighting! Bugs and stray wires etc. less of a problem with it!

 

[joshy.fre_2003]

333015 I assume? Thanks. http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/K97196/2019/04/27/advanced

 

[Harvey B]

333015 I assume? Thanks. http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/K97196/2019/04/27/advanced

It will be