Northern Rail overturn back track

[Sunflower11]

Hello,

I’m hoping for some advice.

I received a fine in 2019 for fair evasion. The machine wasn’t working and I jumped on the train and thinking I’d buy a ticket from the inspector. There was no inspector and I got a fine. There was bunch of us in the same situation.

I explained the situation and appealed. They acknowledged my appeal and said they would get back to me. While waiting for them to come back to me I was taken to court and charged. I didn’t even know about it until I received an enforcement letter. I had to pay half of the fine, to keep them away and I appealed again.

I didn’t hear anything until I got another enforcement letter in Autumn last year. I called again and was told that I fell under the unlawful convictions for train fare evasion, due to them using SJP. I was told that someone would be in contact and I’d get a refund. I was told it would take some time and that my account would remain on hold and someone wound eventually be in contact.

I have heard nothing, until last week when I received another enforcement letter. So I sent them an email, to enquire what was happening and I’ve now been told I don’t fall under the SJP rail project. No explanation.

I have replied and asked for more information as this who process has been confusing and I’ve been given conflicting information.

Does anyone have any advice? Or has been through the same situation.

Thank you

 

[AlterEgo]

What offence were you charged with *exactly*?

 

[Sunflower11]

What offence were you charged with *exactly*?

Fare evasion.

 

[WesternLancer]

Hello,

I’m hoping for some advice.

I received a fine in 2019 for fair evasion. The machine wasn’t working and I jumped on the train and thinking I’d buy a ticket from the inspector. There was no inspector and I got a fine. There was bunch of us in the same situation.

I explained the situation and appealed. They acknowledged my appeal and said they would get back to me. While waiting for them to come back to me I was taken to court and charged. I didn’t even know about it until I received an enforcement letter. I had to pay half of the fine, to keep them away and I appealed again.

I didn’t hear anything until I got another enforcement letter in Autumn last year. I called again and was told that I fell under the unlawful convictions for train fare evasion, due to them using SJP. I was told that someone would be in contact and I’d get a refund. I was told it would take some time and that my account would remain on hold and someone wound eventually be in contact.

I have heard nothing, until last week when I received another enforcement letter. So I sent them an email, to enquire what was happening and I’ve now been told I don’t fall under the SJP rail project. No explanation.

I have replied and asked for more information as this who process has been confusing and I’ve been given conflicting information.

Does anyone have any advice? Or has been through the same situation.

Thank you

Welcome

Its still quite confusing for people here who might have knowledge to help you - but if can upload any copies you still have of all (or as many as you have) of the letters you have been sent over that time, and copies of anything you have written to them I suspect it would help people here give you any relevant information they can to assist.

Go back through everything, assemble all the correspondence / e-mails etc etc - blank out your personal details and any ref numbers that could identify you - then upload it all here for people with expertise on the forum to see first hand what exactly has happened.

Then you will get some clarity about the situation, your options, who to contact about this etc

 

[AlterEgo]

Fare evasion.

There is no such offence. It should say on your court paperwork what you were convicted of. There are about a dozen offences it could be, from Railway Bylaw 18 to the Regulation of Railways Act 1889.

The SJP reversals were for offences which could not have been laid using the SJP procedure as they theoretically carry a maximum sentence of imprisonment.

This is the first think you need to do. Find out exactly what you were convicted of.

 

[Sunflower11]

Welcome

Its still quite confusing for people here who might have knowledge to help you - but if can upload any copies you still have of all (or as many as you have) of the letters you have been sent over that time, and copies of anything you have written to them I suspect it would help people here give you any relevant information they can to assist.

Go back through everything, assemble all the correspondence / e-mails etc etc - blank out your personal details and any ref numbers that could identify you - then upload it all here for people with expertise on the forum to see first hand what exactly has happened.

Then you will get some clarity about the situation, your options, who to contact about this etc

Thank you. I’ll get them together. The thing is I only have my emails appealing and a reply saying the received my appeal. I never actually received any letters from them or a court summons. I just got a letter from the enforcement unit. Which is another reason I’m so annoyed. I would never of let it get to court if I knew. I just feel like they were playing games.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 16 Jun 2026 ==

There is no such offence. It should say on your court paperwork what you were convicted of. There are about a dozen offences it could be, from Railway Bylaw 18 to the Regulation of Railways Act 1889.

The SJP reversals were for offences which could not have been laid using the SJP procedure as they theoretically carry a maximum sentence of imprisonment.

This is the first think you need to do. Find out exactly what you were convicted of.

Thank you. I’ll look into this. I have never actually received any letters from them just the letter from the enforcement unit, saying I had to pay £403 in 10 days. I will ask them to see what was actually charged with.

 

[Fawkes Cat]

I have never actually received any letters from them just the letter from the enforcement unit, saying I had to pay £403 in 10 days. I will ask them to see what was actually charged with.

While it would help us to see as much as possible, sight of this letter (make sure you hide your personal details and any reference numbers) would be really helpful - it may give us enough information to start giving you helpful advice.

 

[blimmo]

I explained the situation and appealed. They acknowledged my appeal and said they would get back to me.

How and what exactly did you appeal? Was this a Penalty Fare (and if so do you still have the paper) and did you appeal it on some sort of online portal?

 

[Sunflower11]

How and what exactly did you appeal? Was this a Penalty Fare (and if so do you still have the paper) and did you appeal it on some sort of online portal?

Yes it was an online portal. I appealed the penalty fare notice. Yes I still have the paper. Luckily found it today.

 

[AlterEgo]

Yes it was an online portal. I appealed the penalty fare notice. Yes I still have the paper. Luckily found it today.

Please upload a copy of the penalty fare notice here with your details removed. It's really important we know *exactly* what we are dealing with.

 

[Sunflower11]

Please upload a copy of the penalty fare notice here with your details removed. It's really important we know *exactly* what we are dealing with.

Sorry it’s not that clear. Also just want to say at the time I did ask to pay the officers but they refused. I never intended not to pay.

 

[AlterEgo]

That's helpful. And you have proof of having appealed it online? I assume that is in the form of an email.

 

[furlong]

Northern made several different types of mistakes over the years.

It is important that you do your best to track down as much information as you can from old documents and emails and you might need to make new enquiries to obtain fresh copies of the relevant information.

Key questions so far:
(1) Did you submit a formal Penalty Fare appeal in line with the appeals process documented on those attachments and obtain a result from that appeal? If so, we need to see the letter informing you of the result of the appeal. (Or something equivalent, formally confirming the date and result.)
(2) What did the court paperwork that led to your conviction state on it? It might be that you have never seen a copy of this and will need to get them to send you a fresh copy as again, we need to see this to understand if there was anything wrong with it. (We need to know how the legislation used was quoted on the court papers, what the charge was, what evidence was offered, what prosecution method was used, what the conviction was etc.)

Even if they are correct that what happened doesn't fall within their precise current criteria, it might nevertheless still be wrong for a different reason. We know that so far their scheme is only rectifying some of their errors, not yet all of them.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 16 Jun 2026 ==

And to be quite clear - when the ticket machine is not working a Penalty Fare CANNOT lawfully be imposed upon you. Your offer to pay your fare on the spot should have been accepted.
I presume you also gave your correct name and address?

However, we think it was not uncommon for Northern to impose Penalty Fares in such circumstances, deny appeals, and subsequently prosecute if left unpaid (something that was also not supposed to happen after an appeal).

So what you describe falls within a pattern with which the forum is familiar, but sorting it out at this stage will need you to obtain evidenced facts.

 

[Puffing Devil]

It's good that you still had the PF details. Once you can provide the exact wording of the charge and the disposal information, the forum will better understand the potential next steps.

It’s fair to say that the original conviction was unjust. Boarding a train because the ticket machine was broken, intending to buy a ticket from a guard, isn’t deliberate fare evasion. Also, the NR ignoring your open Penalty Fare appeal and rushing you to court in your absence was a clear rule breach. However, realistically, that ship has probably sailed.

Since you learned about the case years ago and paid half the fine to stop the bailiffs, the courts likely see you as having known about the debt. Trying to get a court to accept a late Statutory Declaration or reopen the case under Section 142 after seven years is very difficult, with a low probability of success, and it would require a lot of effort.

Looking on the bright side, because this happened in 2019/20 (my assumption, TBC), the conviction is now legally spent. Under the Rehabilitation of Offenders Act 1974, a magistrates' court fine becomes spent after twelve months. This means it’s removed from Basic DBS checks and doesn’t need to be declared on standard job applications. It would only appear on Standard or Enhanced checks until the eleven-year filtering rule applies.

If the paperwork confirms you were charged under Section 5 of the Regulation of Railways Act 1889, you might still claim a full refund through the automated SJP Rail Project. If it were a standard Railway Byelaw charge, as suspected, paying the remaining balance and collection costs may be your best option. Paying the remaining £200 to settle the enforcement and be free of it, knowing the conviction is spent, is probably the most practical solution.

Let us know the exact charge details when you have them, and we’ll confirm it.