Northern Rail Fleet!

[atwales]

Do Northern have any long-term/short-term plans for there huge fleet of over 70 142's with regards to the electrification? How are they going to get rid of these; are they going to be transferred to another TOC? If so, who as there are now plans all over the country for electrification and no company is going to want or need this mass of 142's?

Also just out of interest - where are most of the 150/153/156/158 based, and also when and where would you see most units coupled up as that is what I'm into.

Thanks

 

[156441]

Quick reply. No plans to get rid of any of the old diesel units anytime soon.

With regards to traction types 142's are all over the bloody place based at Heaton, Neville Hill and Newton Heath similar to the 150's.

153,155, 158 are primarily 'eastern' units based in Yorkshire.

The 156 fleet is primarily based at Allerton Liverpool.

323's Longsight, 333 and 322's are Leeds based.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
With regards to doubling up it would help to know where you are based to give the best advice. Although if Manchester you'll see load of double units between 4-6 out of Manchester Picc

 

[Anvil1984]

Slightlty incorrect

142 based at Heaton / Newton Heath
144 based Neville Hill
150 based at Newton Heath
153 based at Newton Heath and Neville Hill
155 based at Neville Hill
156 based at Allerton and Heaton
158 based at Neville Hill
321/322/333 based at Neville Hill
323 based at Longsight

142s arent based at Neville Hill hence the daily ECS movement from York to Newcastle and vice versa. 150s also havent been based at Neville Hill since Northern decided to concentrate units on particular depots

 

[hairyhandedfool]

158s are all based in Yorkshire but do visit Blackpool and Manchester Victoria, there are a few 156s around the Newcastle area with the rest are primarily in the Manchester area and up the Cumbrian coast line, 153s can be seen in north Manchester, Yorkshire and the Cumbrian coast. 150s are Manchester and Yorkshire predominantly, though I have seen one at Nottingham.

I'm not sure the current electrification schemes will release all the 142s (directly or by cascades and they'd still have the 144s after that), I would expect more electrification or new DMUs to be ordered to see the end of the 142s, but in any case, given the scale of 'overcrowding' on Northern, the 142s may yet be of more use before 2019.

 

[WatcherZero]

Next to none, as it stands it would mostly be Sprinters freed up as their electrifying the higher density longer distance routes.

 

[atwales]

Quick reply. No plans to get rid of any of the old diesel units anytime soon.

With regards to traction types 142's are all over the bloody place based at Heaton, Neville Hill and Newton Heath similar to the 150's.

153,155, 158 are primarily 'eastern' units based in Yorkshire.

The 156 fleet is primarily based at Allerton Liverpool.

323's Longsight, 333 and 322's are Leeds based.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
With regards to doubling up it would help to know where you are based to give the best advice. Although if Manchester you'll see load of double units between 4-6 out of Manchester Picc

okay maybe I better explain myself, I'm a kind of spotter in the form, I don't have to see the sets - I have to be on the set with it moving then I can tick it off. This is why I like to find doubled sets so I can tick off a load of sets. See below for the list of sets I still need to go on:-

(142)
001/003/005/009/011/012/015/016/ 017/018/019/021/022/023/024/025/ 026/027/028/029/031/034/035/038/ 040/041/043/044/045/046/047/048/ 049/050/051/052/054/056/057/058/ 060/061/063/064/065/066/067/068/ 070/071/078/079/084/086/087/088/ 089/090/092/093/094/095/096/
(144)
001/002/003/004/005/006/007/008/ 010/011/012/013/014/015/016/017/ 018/019/020/021/022/023/
(150)
110/112/113/114/115/117/132/133/ 135/137/138/139/141/144/145/146/ 147/150/205/207/210/211/214/215/ 218/220/224/225/228/269/271/274/ 277/
(153)
301/304/307/315/316/317/324/328/
330/331/332/351/358/359/360/363/
(155)
341/342/344/345/346/347/
(156)
420/424/427/428/429/438/443/444/ 448/451/452/454/455/459/460/461/ 463/464/466/468/469/472/475/479/ 480/481/483/484/490/
(158)
752/754/757/758/759/784/787/790/ 791/792/793/794/795/796/797/815/ 816/817/842/843/844/845/848/849/ 850/851/853/855/859/860/861/872/ 901/902/903/904/905/906/907/908/ 909/910/
(321)
901/902/903/
(322)
481/482/483/484/485
(323)
223/225/228/229/230/232/234/236/ 238/239/
(333)
001/004/006/007/009/010/012/

I know it looks like the whole fleet although I have completed 20% of the fleet

I live far away on the ATW network down south and was hoping to go to Manchester Victoria after many trips to Picc. which I know many 142s are there on little trips to such locations as Rose Marple etc.. I was hoping for some Victoria exclusive trains!

Thanks again!

 

[Geeves]

If you come to Victoria the hourly (XX:00 Vic - Leeds trains are generally 144s

The XX:48 Selby trains will give you your 3 car 158s and in the afternoon no doubt some Heaton based 142s

Vic - Wigans 07, 10, 33 and 46 mins past the hour will have a stupid amount of 142s on

Pretty much seeing as every train is a Northern unit you are gonna get your fleet list covered in record time!

Obviously if you want 323s or 333s as mentioned you are gonna have to go elseware.

If you want coupled units the peaks are the best time, hell of alot of trains running with either 4 or 5 car 142+144 combos, 150+153 combos and also 158X2 156X2 and 150X2. Everything

 

[142094]

There are quite a few 156s up in the north east, mainly used on the Carlisle - Newcastle, Newcastle - Middlesbrough and Middlesbrough - Whitby routes. Add to this there are normally a few on the Cumbrian Coast and the ones that go to Dumfries in the morning.

 

[RobShipway]

There are quite a few 156s up in the north east, mainly used on the Carlisle - Newcastle, Newcastle - Middlesbrough and Middlesbrough - Whitby routes. Add to this there are normally a few on the Cumbrian Coast and the ones that go to Dumfries in the morning.

The 156's are also used on the Carlisle - Settle - Leeds service aren't they?

 

[34D]

The 156's are also used on the Carlisle - Settle - Leeds service aren't they?

That was many years ago. Believe Leeds-Carlisle booked solid 2 or 4 car 158 now (someone will correct me).

The only time you'll see a class 156 in Yorkshire is the Man Vic-Huddersfield service.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

142s arent based at Neville Hill hence the daily ECS movement from York to Newcastle and vice versa. 150s also havent been based at Neville Hill since Northern decided to concentrate units on particular depots

Didn't know this. Thanks anvil. For others, this link lists the ECS trains on the ECML http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/search/advanced?location=Thirsk&date=15%2F04%2F2013&tocs=NT&timespan=3&show_schedules=11&schedule_type=0&show_wtt=1&show_var=1&show_stp=1

 

[atwales]

If you come to Victoria the hourly (XX:00 Vic - Leeds trains are generally 144s

The XX:48 Selby trains will give you your 3 car 158s and in the afternoon no doubt some Heaton based 142s

Vic - Wigans 07, 10, 33 and 46 mins past the hour will have a stupid amount of 142s on

Pretty much seeing as every train is a Northern unit you are gonna get your fleet list covered in record time!

Obviously if you want 323s or 333s as mentioned you are gonna have to go elseware.

If you want coupled units the peaks are the best time, hell of alot of trains running with either 4 or 5 car 142+144 combos, 150+153 combos and also 158X2 156X2 and 150X2. Everything

Thanks for the help! Would Monday be a good time to go?

 

[156441]

I could swear I've worked a NH based 142.
Will have to check my notes!

 

[hairyhandedfool]

....I live far away on the ATW network down south and was hoping to go to Manchester Victoria after many trips to Picc. which I know many 142s are there on little trips to such locations as Rose Marple etc.. I was hoping for some Victoria exclusive trains!

Thanks again!

Well, you won't see any electrics at Victoria on a normal day (you certainly won't be able to ride them if they do appear!), but you could get virtually any of the other classes there. From my travels I believe the 1500 Manchester Victoria-Clitheroe is usually 150+153 and you could (if you are quick) get a ride on both by the time you get to Salford Crescent. The only line out of Victoria you would really struggle to get a quick return journey on is the Liverpool line because it has an hourly service and trains pass between Victoria and Eccles (the first stop), those services are only ever 156, 150 or 142.

That was many years ago. Believe Leeds-Carlisle booked solid 2 or 4 car 158 now (someone will correct me).

The only time you'll see a class 156 in Yorkshire is the Man Vic-Huddersfield service....

Correct on both counts as far as I know.

 

[ainsworth74]

Correct on both counts as far as I know.

Definitely correct but the operative word is 'booked'. The only time I've done the S&C it was a 150...

 

[yorksrob]

That was many years ago. Believe Leeds-Carlisle booked solid 2 or 4 car 158 now (someone will correct me)_stp=1[/url]

plus the odd 153 for strengthening.

 

[tbtc]

The only time you'll see a class 156 in Yorkshire is the Man Vic-Huddersfield service

They do some duties on the Hope Valley stopper to Sheffield - normally a 142 route, but 156s are there from time to time (plus you may see an EMT 156 at Doncaster - though the Lincoln services are normally just 153s)
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Do Northern have any long-term/short-term plans for there huge fleet of over 70 142's with regards to the electrification?

As others have said, CP5 electrification will mainly affect longer distance routes that see few 142s (will free up more 185s etc than Pacers).

Do Northern have plans for replacement? Probably not - they only have the franchise for another couple of years (and Pacers are "fine" until the end of 2019), so it's not something that they need to worry about at the moment - there is no "long term" when there's only a couple of years left on your franchise.

 

[Anvil1984]

I could swear I've worked a NH based 142.
Will have to check my notes!

NH is Newton Heath isnt it. NL being Neville Hill. It might have been an old repair book but definately no 142s based in Leeds

 

[34D]

Definitely correct but the operative word is 'booked'. The only time I've done the S&C it was a 150...

The two times I've done it, it was a class 40 and then a class 156. Happy Days

 

[driver9000]

NH is Newton Heath isnt it. NL being Neville Hill. It might have been an old repair book but definately no 142s based in Leeds

Correct.

I thought all 153s had moved to Neville Hill in the big shuffle a few years ago?

 

[185143]

I went on the Settle Carlisle on a 2x158 to Leeds. At Leeds, the trains were split, the front two coaches going to Blackpool North, the rear two forming the 17:37 to Manchester Victoria, my onward train. So I went from Carlisle to Manchester Victoria on the same train!

 

[atwales]

Coupled Units @ Man Vic.

Looking for coupled:

142s
144s
150s
153s
156s
158s

Are there more coupled units on a Monday or a Saturday?

 

[hairyhandedfool]

The two times I've done it, it was a class 40 and then a class 156. Happy Days

I travelled in a 156 on the S&C last year, but it didn't go to Leeds, it was Blackpool bound!

 

[Darren R]

From my travels I believe the 1500 Manchester Victoria-Clitheroe is usually 150+153 and you could (if you are quick) get a ride on both by the time you get to Salford Crescent.

Correct, although more often than not it's a 150/1 + 153 combi, so if you need to buy a ticket on-board (or indeed if you have no intentions of doing ) you have to pick which part of the train to board. Sometimes we get spoiled by a 156 + 153 combi. It's an all-day diagram though: departures from MCV at 0555, 0900, 1200, 1500, 1800, and 2100 - but only on weekdays. I think Mondays to Fridays are your best bet for double-unit services; there doesn't seem to be much strengthening on Saturdays, at least not on this side of the Pennines. Services around Leeds are more likely to be double units than those at MCV.

Morning and evening peak services are most likely to be strengthened, particularly on (both) Calder Valley routes twixt MCV and LDS, although I think the odd service to Liverpool, Southport and Blackpool North are doubled up.

The 0723 MCV to Blackburn is usually a double unit, along with the 0829. This latter is usually a 150+153. Later the 1802 Rochdale - Blackburn is generally a double 142. This is formed from the 1648 Wigan Wallgate to Rochdale via Bolton, so it seems safe to assume it's the same units from Wigan.

On Saturdays the only services that I know are double-units are the Hazel Grove to Prestons.

 

[atwales]

Correct, although more often than not it's a 150/1 + 153 combi, so if you need to buy a ticket on-board (or indeed if you have no intentions of doing ) you have to pick which part of the train to board. Sometimes we get spoiled by a 156 + 153 combi. It's an all-day diagram though: departures from MCV at 0555, 0900, 1200, 1500, 1800, and 2100 - but only on weekdays. I think Mondays to Fridays are your best bet for double-unit services; there doesn't seem to be much strengthening on Saturdays, at least not on this side of the Pennines. Services around Leeds are more likely to be double units than those at MCV.

Morning and evening peak services are most likely to be strengthened, particularly on (both) Calder Valley routes twixt MCV and LDS, although I think the odd service to Liverpool, Southport and Blackpool North are doubled up.

The 0723 MCV to Blackburn is usually a double unit, along with the 0829. This latter is usually a 150+153. Later the 1802 Rochdale - Blackburn is generally a double 142. This is formed from the 1648 Wigan Wallgate to Rochdale via Bolton, so it seems safe to assume it's the same units from Wigan.

On Saturdays the only services that I know are double-units are the Hazel Grove to Prestons.

How unfortunate as I've now decided to go on Saturday. However, take a look at the video link which is a Saturday @ MCV and features lots of coupled sets!

http://m.youtube.com/watch?client=mv-google&gl=GB&hl=en-GB&v=tbOCI8c4PD8

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

The 0723 MCV to Blackburn is usually a double unit, along with the 0829. This latter is usually a 150+153. Later the 1802 Rochdale - Blackburn is generally a double 142. This is formed from the 1648 Wigan Wallgate to Rochdale via Bolton, so it seems safe to assume it's the same units from Wigan.

Any idea what normally forms the 0559 Buxton to Clitheroe service ?

 

[ANorthernGuard]

Any idea what normally forms the 0559 Buxton to Clitheroe service ?

150/1, 150/2 or a 156 can be any of them

 

[atwales]

How unfortunate as I've now decided to go on Saturday. However, take a look at the video link which is a Saturday @ MCV and features lots of coupled sets!

http://m.youtube.com/watch?client=mv-google&gl=GB&hl=en-GB&v=tbOCI8c4PD8

http://www.youtube.com/watch?client=mv-google&gl=GB&hl=en-GB&v=tbOCI8c4PD8 this is the link for the video which I posted earlier on

 

[sprinterguy]

150/1, 150/2 or a 156 can be any of them

Seems to be booked a 150 (Of any of the varieties opeated by Northern, admittedly) wherever possible though.

 

[175001]

The 0723 MCV to Blackburn is usually a double unit, along with the 0829. This latter is usually a 150+153. Later the 1802 Rochdale - Blackburn is generally a double 142. This is formed from the 1648 Wigan Wallgate to Rochdale via Bolton, so it seems safe to assume it's the same units from Wigan.

No, its booked for a single 150, but many times a 153 all alone will appear on it

 

[Silv1983]

I drove the 07:07 from Clitheroe to Manchester Vic this morning - it was a 150/2 + 153. At Victoria it turned back and went to Blackburn at 08:29.

One to bare in mind if you want to ride that configuration.