Northern and TPE Short List Announced

[LNW-GW Joint]

DfT announcement today: https://www.gov.uk/government/news/...-transpennine-express-rail-operators-revealed

The shortlisted bidders to run the 2 franchises from February 2016 are:
•Northern:
•Abellio Northern Ltd
•Arriva Rail North Limited
•Govia Northern Limited

•TransPennine Express:
•First Trans Pennine Express Limited
•Keolis Go-Ahead Limited
•Stagecoach Trans Pennine Express Trains Limited

Edit: One obvious point is that one company will not run both franchises [but Keolis own 35% of Govia].
Another is that Serco will not run Northern.

 

[Monty]

Secro will be miffed... Fingers crossed Stagecoach get the TPE franchise.

 

[59CosG95]

Secro will be miffed... Fingers crossed Stagecoach get the TPE franchise.

What have Serco got to worry about? Their pockets will be filled by the sleeper; of that I'm fairly sure, having seen the improvements it's got.

That said, hoping Stagecoach win!

 

[Domh245]

Will First TPE still be a first/keolis partnership, because if so, it seems a bit cheeky for them to have 2 chances of getting in out of 3!

 

[Surreyman]

Can't help thinking that who ever 'wins' Northern, will be taking on a poisoned chalice, the numbers may stack up but the Image/PR will be terrible.
Lack of Rolling stock, old trains, overcrowding, likely fare increases.

 

[Simon11]

Will be interesting to see how First and Keolis handle their bids. With them both having an interest in the current franchise, they will both be wanting to use the staff at the TOC to assist them on their bids. How do they ensure there aren't any conflicts!

 

[SGS]

Arriva!? Do they not think the North has suffered enough?

 

[sprinterguy]

Oh good grief. For the love of all that is good, I hope nobody puts Arriva back in charge of local train services in the North.

Interesting that Keolis have “jumped ship” and got in bed with Go-Ahead for the TPE franchise. Does anybody have any idea of what proportion of the franchise bid is Keolis and how much is Go-Ahead?

 

[northwichcat]

Secro will be miffed... Fingers crossed Stagecoach get the TPE franchise.

If they do they'll probably be happy at the idea of Liverpool-Nottingham going to TPE, while if they don't they'll continue objecting to it.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Oh good grief. For the love of all that is good, I hope nobody puts Arriva back in charge of local train services in the North.

Interesting that Keolis have “jumped ship” and got in bed with Go-Ahead for the TPE franchise.

Keolis is probably the reason 'First' TPE got the franchise. The TPE franchise shortlist included First/Keolis, Arriva and Connex. First, Arriva and Connex were all guilty of managing franchises poorly at the time.

There was no real difference between First North Western and Arriva Trains Northern. Both were guilty of poor industrial relations which resulted in strikes and frequent cancellations due to staff refusing to work overtime while both seemed to think a train with a decent interior would keep itself clean without any work.

Does anybody have any idea of what proportion of the franchise bid is Keolis and how much is Go-Ahead?

65% Keolis and 35% Go Ahead for TPE and the reverse for Northern according to Railway Gazette: http://www.railwaygazette.com/news/...tml?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter

 

[Blindtraveler]

Secro will be miffed... Fingers crossed Stagecoach get the TPE franchise.

Seconded, and Abellio for Northern
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Arriva!? Do they not think the North has suffered enough?

Its to be hoped most have forgotten the ATN days however bus pax in the Northeast and Yorkshire are still lumbered with them. On that note I'd think the CC would take great interest in an Ariva trains win as the situation this would create would be similar or worse situation than First in Scotland were in in 2005↲

 

[northwichcat]

Its to be hoped most have forgotten the ATN days however bus pax in the Northeast and Yorkshire are still lumbered with them. On that note I'd think the CC would take great interest in an Ariva trains win as the situation this would create would be similar or worse situation than First in Scotland were in in 2005↲

Don't forget ATN's franchise area included Manchester, Stockport, Warrington and Liverpool with Arriva operating buses in all 4.

However, it's the Arriva contract for non-emergency hospital transportation which is Arriva's main failure in the North West at the moment.

Elderly and vulnerable patients are missing medical appointments because the non-emergency transport system is so unreliable, it has been revealed.

More than two-thirds of people surveyed in Stockport who use Arriva arrived over an hour late. And 35 per cent of those missed appointments by more than two hours.

One patient in Stockport reported that they spent over seven hours getting to and from an appointment, being picked up for treatment at 8.40am and not arriving home until 4pm.

Arriva took over non-emergency patient transport in Manchester last year after undercutting the North West Ambulance Service by £3.5m.

The latest survey was carried out by patient rights forum the Greater Manchester Healthwatch Network with 575 people responding.

http://www.manchestereveningnews.co...kport-delay-misery-vulnerable-elderly-7291921

 

[ANorthernGuard]

I would be happy if Abellio won, However Arriva have done a good job with ATW and XC in my opinion. Govia I haven't a clue lol

 

[scrapy]

Its quite likely the New franchise wouldnt be arriva branded even if they won. The majority of passengers wouldnt know who ran it anyway. Many think first run northern now.

 

[Crossforth]

I'm not bothered who wins Northern as long as the service improves.

TPE seems to run well at the minute under First in my opinion so I wouldn't complain if they came back.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

65% Keolis and 35% Go Ahead for TPE and the reverse for Northern according to Railway Gazette: http://www.railwaygazette.com/news/...tml?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter

The FirstGroup announcement makes no mention of Keolis: http://otp.investis.com/generic/regulatory-story.aspx?newsid=440880&cid=858
Not that this is necessarily significant, they do all they can to blur the perception of the current franchise ownership.
But it would be odd if Keolis were in twice for the same competition.

Edit: This is the Go Ahead announcement: http://www.go-ahead.com/media/news/2014-news/19-08-2014.aspx
And the Arriva version: http://www.arriva.co.uk/media_centre/press_releases/2014/august/19-aug-2014.aspx?sc_lang=en
And Abellio: http://www.abellio.com/news/abellio-shortlist-new-northern-rail-franchise
Nothing on the Keolis or Stagecoach sites yet.

 

[Emyr]

I'm not bothered who wins Northern as long as the service improves.

Has anyone official hinted at "No Growth" this time round? :roll:

 

[northwichcat]

Its quite likely the New franchise wouldnt be arriva branded even if they won. The majority of passengers wouldnt know who ran it anyway. Many think first run northern now.

Of course when First won the withdrawn West Coast franchise award a lot of people thought First would operate much shorter trains based on the Desiros they operate on busy TPE routes. If Virgin had been bidding for TPE I imagine some people would want them to win thinking they'd introduce much longer trains than other bidders.

 

[willbaforceday]

Hope they bring in better rolling stock on the Northern rail franchise! The 158s are getting to be awful now! How about some 185s like FTPE use. They would be loads better than the usual collection of battered pacers, sprinters, super sprinters and express sprinters!

 

[HH]

The FirstGroup announcement makes no mention of Keolis: http://otp.investis.com/generic/regulatory-story.aspx?newsid=440880&cid=858
Not that this is necessarily significant, they do all they can to blur the perception of the current franchise ownership.
But it would be odd if Keolis were in twice for the same competition.

They aren't. First were not at all happy with Keolis's contribution to the franchise and decided they never want to JV again.

 

[northwichcat]

Has anyone official hinted at "No Growth" this time round? :roll:

There are proposals to introduce extra capacity on some routes. However, one possibility for that extra capacity appearing is to reduce calls at lightly used stations. For instance, there could be a half-hourly Buxton-Manchester service but stations like Furness Vale and Chapel-en-le-Frith see a reduction in service instead of an increase.

 

[Emyr]

Ah, the old "robbing Peter to pay Paul" strategy.

 

[Bantamzen]

Arriva for the Northern franchise...?

Nooooooooooooooooo!!!!

I'm already having flashbacks to the misery suffered at the hands of Arriva "When we can be bothered to run" Trains Northern*, especially towards the end....

I dread to think what they could do with even older stock than when they left the franchise.

(* This is not dig at the staff of the time BTW, just the way the franchise seemed to be run from a passenger perspective)

 

[jopsuk]

So is Keolis-Go-Ahead basically an inverse Govia (which is 65% Go-Ahead/35% Keolis)?

 

[Emyr]

If TPE and Northern were re-merged we could revive the Regional Railways paintjob...

 

[Qwerty133]

Anyone but Stagecoach for TPE
Anyone but. Arriva for Northern

 

[Deerfold]

Anyone but Stagecoach for TPE
Anyone but. Arriva for Northern

Care to share your reasons?

 

[bb21]

I imagine inherited hatred towards EMT and XC.

 

[northwichcat]

If TPE and Northern were re-merged we could revive the Regional Railways paintjob...

Don't forget the North Wales was part of Regional Railways North West.

 

[Emyr]

Don't forget the North Wales was part of Regional Railways North West.

Unlikely given devolution, but reintegration of Mersey's concessions might help strengthen the brand.

 

[northwichcat]

Unlikely given devolution, but reintegration of Mersey's concessions might help strengthen the brand.

Well if you want a merged Northern, TPE and Merseyrail franchise that can't be considered until at least 2028 (the year Merseyrail expires), changing services included in the Wales & Border franchise could happen in 2018.