North Fylde Line Signal Boxes

[Whistler40145]

I have just been listening to the Radio Lancashire Travel News & a Signal Box was announced as being shut due to staff shortage, leading to 20 minutes delay to all Blackpool North to Preston services.

I have several questions for someone to answer.

1. Which box is shut?

2. If there is a staff shortage, why isn't a relief signalman available?

3. If the box is switched out, which box is taking control of the section?

 

[Freel07]

I have just been listening to the Radio Lancashire Travel News & a Signal Box was announced as being shut due to staff shortage, leading to 20 minutes delay to all Blackpool North to Preston services.

I have several questions for someone to answer.

1. Which box is shut?

2. If there is a staff shortage, why isn't a relief signalman available?

3. If the box is switched out, which box is taking control of the section?

I can't answer question 1 .
But the answer to 2 is that relief signallers cover a number of boxes for planned absences etc so it is quite possible that the relief for the affected box is already covering another duty.
The simple answer to 3 is the boxes either side. There will be a long block section which is why there is a delay as the headway is extended by the fact that 2 sections become one.

 

[142094]

Not Blackpool North signal box is it? Thought that was locked out of use recently.

 

[BriefEncounter]

The only box that switches out on that line is Poulton.

 

[The Planner]

Id guess at either Poulton or Carleton Crossing being switched out. Id have thought it would be Carleton though.

Doh, should have read all the thread.

 

[driver9000]

Not Blackpool North signal box is it? Thought that was locked out of use recently.

You may be thinking of Blackpool North No.1 which was switched out in 2007 and abolished in January this year. If Blackpool North No.2 was to become unmanned for whatever reason then nothing would be able to enter or leave Blackpool North station.

Carleton Crossing can't be switched out because there would be nobody to operate the level crossing which would mean no trains could run to and from Blackpool North.

 

[Get-Pulled-Off]

As said, Poulton is the only box that shuts out, the block section is then Carleton to Kirkham.

As for why a relief signalman isn't available, well either they are all working, have worked a turn already that day, are working at 6am the following morning, have already worked 6 shifts in a row or simply are on a day off and don't want to work (they can't be forced). I *think* there are only 6 relief staff to cover 5 boxes on that line, and we are still in the summer holiday season where signalman are compelled to take 2 weeks leave. This lasts until the end of September, when the winter leave season starts. Although this requires only one weeks leave taken, the fact most of us hold our "odd days" back early in the year for fear of running out, there is then a mad scramble to take them before the calander year ends. We used to be able to take remaining days over until March of the following year, but management have ceased that now.

 

[Whistler40145]

Please correct me that after Kirkham Box the next is Salwick, which is the Fringe Box to Preston Power Box.

 

[Get-Pulled-Off]

Correct.

 

[142094]

You may be thinking of Blackpool North No.1 which was switched out in 2007 and abolished in January this year. If Blackpool North No.2 was to become unmanned for whatever reason then nothing would be able to enter or leave Blackpool North station.

Probably was that, although haven't been to Blackpool since last year so couldn't remember the exact details.

 

[Whistler40145]

Although I am a Blackpool Lad, was Blackpool No. 1 Box near Devonshire Road Bridge?

 

[driver9000]

Although I am a Blackpool Lad, was Blackpool No. 1 Box near Devonshire Road Bridge?

Yes it was. Located on the Down side of the railway.

 

[Toots]

As said, Poulton is the only box that shuts out, the block section is then Carleton to Kirkham.

.

No,it doesn't shut out anymore,it's a 24 hour box since the closure of No.1,but your lack of knowledge is understandable on this matter, especially being stuck in an office all day........

 

[Whistler40145]

I presume all boxes are 24 hours so that the Manchester Airport services can run.

 

[Toots]

No ,it doesn't work like that Tim.Some boxes have a 'Block Switch',which effectively switch out that box and make two sections into one.Poulton has one,but doesn't use it anymoe.

 

[The Planner]

Doesn't answer the original question though, one must have switched out, if it wasn't Poulton, which one was it ??

 

[driver9000]

No,it doesn't shut out anymore,it's a 24 hour box since the closure of No.1,but your lack of knowledge is understandable on this matter, especially being stuck in an office all day........

It will switch out if required (as happened on Thursday). It isn't booked to switch out though

 

[Toots]

Doesn't answer the original question though, one must have switched out, if it wasn't Poulton, which one was it ??

It would have to have been Poulton as that is the only one that has a Block Switch and as has been pointed out,the only one that logistically can,ie,no crossing and no points that need to be operated....
As for you Driver 9000,I suspect you knew I meant 'booked',a fact which will I'm sure will be pointed out in the subsequent TDA enquiry!

 

[driver9000]

It was Poulton that switched out.

It would have to have been Poulton as that is the only one that has a Block Switch and as has been pointed out,the only one that logistically can,ie,no crossing and no points that need to be operated....
As for you Driver 9000,I suspect you knew I meant 'booked',a fact which will I'm sure will be pointed out in the subsequent TDA enquiry!

Toots - I knew you meant booked, but there are plenty on here that wouldn't have known that when you said the switch isn't used any more which may have given the impression that it isn't ever left unmanned

 

[Whistler40145]

What does Carleton Crossing Box control?

 

[driver9000]

What does Carleton Crossing Box control?

The Level crossing. Carleton signals are the Up distant on the end of Layton platform, stop signals protecting the crossing both ways and the Down distant is on the same post as Polutons Down section signal.

 

[Whistler40145]

So if Poulton was switched out, is it Blackpool or Carleton controlling Signals to Kirkham?

 

[driver9000]

So if Poulton was switched out, is it Blackpool or Carleton controlling Signals to Kirkham?

When Poulton (indeed any box that can do so) is switched out the signals controlled by that box are all left in the off position, Carleton and Kirkham would then communicate with each other regarding sending trains through the section.

 

[Toots]

Its Carleton that works to Kirkham..(I couldn't cancel this and you got your post in before me Driver 9000)

 

[Whistler40145]

I bet that was unexpected extra work for them last Thursday!

 

[Toots]

No,not really,apart from the process of switching out,its just the same as working Poulton...

 

[Whistler40145]

OK Toots, thanks for making it clear. I am just a humble enthusiast.

 

[Toots]

No problem mate,believe me,there are anomilies and different types of signalling all over the country,and rules that cover each method,so if AB signalmen in a small box were to find themselves in an IECC then it would be a new learning process all over again.The basic rules are the same but there are many differences in actual practice.....

 

[Get-Pulled-Off]

Yes Toots is right (and a bit of a smart alec ) ... Poulton is not booked to switch out, but is the only one that can with the line still open. Any other boxes shutting would close the line (Blackpool Souths could run provided Kirkham and Salwick were open).

If any of the signallers in boxes other than Poulton were to go sick and no replacement found, then if a relief signaller is at Poulton they will move them to the box that would otherwise have shut. This can even be mid shift using the MOM to provide transport if needed.