No more First TPE First Class Declassification

[61653 HTAFC]

Having First Class on the 185s isn't a problem. The problem is the implementation of it - placing it in such as awkward position that it takes up the majority of one coach on a three coach train. First Class is better positioned on the 170s, by being in a small area at the end of one carriage.

Fair point- it would have less of an impact if it was at the opposite end of the unit to the accessible toilet, though that would fall foul of accessibility legislation!

 

[transmanche]

Having First Class on the 185s isn't a problem. The problem is the implementation of it - placing it in such as awkward position that it takes up the majority of one coach on a three coach train. First Class is better positioned on the 170s, by being in a small area at the end of one carriage.

Well, I wouldn't say the first class area takes up the majority of coach A - it doesn't even use up all the space between the doors.

Image source: thetrainline.com.

 

[howittpie]

I commuted for about 6 months between Manc and Leeds useing a first class season. Overcrowding in the morning peak was the Huddersfield to Leeds bit but it was noticeable that if you got a trains that had started a Newcastle from mid afternoon you were lucky to get a first class seat on more than one occasion I was in standard seat as that was the only one avauilable so First class outstrips demand on some north services.

I think the Blackpool Norths are the ones that shouldn't have first class on as they are basicaly a commuter service and very overcrowded often from Manc to Chorley in peaks.

 

[WestCoast]

I think the Blackpool Norths are the ones that shouldn't have first class on as they are basicaly a commuter service and very overcrowded often from Manc to Chorley in peaks.

However, Preston - Manchester Picc is still a heavy flow with the Blackpool North services taking 46 mins to 52 mins on this section of the route, Leeds - Manchester Picc is basically only a few more minutes longer.

I am not saying the route needs First Class, just that users on the Blackpool North services shouldn't be treated as inferior to those on other TPE routes (give 'em Pacers seems to be the attitude I've heard at times!) :roll: Remember that FNW had 175s on the North West routes and the Northern 180s are history.

 

[All Line Rover]

Well, I wouldn't say the first class area takes up the majority of coach A - it doesn't even use up all the space between the doors.

If First Class was located at the front of Coach C, yes, it would be small - perhaps one table of four and one table of two - but it would be there for those that need it. Standard Class would gain an additional 16 seats once the lost seats in Coach C are taken into account. First Class would lose nine seats, which often go unused anyway.

 

[Solent&Wessex]

First Class would lose nine seats, which often go unused anyway.

First Class, as alluded to earlier, is often full with First Class Passengers being turned away and sitting in Standard Class, especially on Newcastle services.

 

[All Line Rover]

First Class, as alluded to earlier, is often full with First Class Passengers being turned away and sitting in Standard Class, especially on Newcastle services.

If First Class is busy, the solution is simple - raise the prices! They are unregulated, after all. The same cannot be said for Standard Class.

 

[Goatboy]

If First Class is busy, the solution is simple - raise the prices!

Ah yes, the XC approach. Reduce train size. Discover overcrowding. Beleive as a result it must be because the tickets are not expensive enough.

 

[snail]

If First Class is busy, the solution is simple - raise the prices!

It would be even busier if they implemented your plan to reduce the number of seats!

I think reducing the number of Advance tickets on peak trains would help in Standard. On the 1816 from Manchester to Edinburgh yesterday only the rear portion of the centre coach was free of seat reservations. I know they won't all be Advances but having so many seats unavailable when there are a lot of commuters travelling is very frustrating.

It will be interesting to see if the 350s improve the situation on that route once the Bolton and Chorley people are taken out of the equation. It will also be interesting to see what kind of First Class seating the new trains get - will it be TPE style or LM style?

 

[Pumbaa]

TPE have said previously it'll be 2+1 in 1st.

 

[transmanche]

If First Class is busy, the solution is simple - raise the prices!

Or do what used to happen in Northern Spirit days - allow an inexpensive first class upgrade every day, rather than just at weekends.

Weekend First upgrade on TPE is £6 (£10 on Scottish services). From memory it used to be about this amount to upgrade on any day under Northern Spirit (and possibly during Arriva's early years).

 

[Asian Demon]

However, Preston - Manchester Picc is still a heavy flow with the Blackpool North services taking 46 mins to 52 mins on this section of the route, Leeds - Manchester Picc is basically only a few more minutes longer.

I am not saying the route needs First Class, just that users on the Blackpool North services shouldn't be treated as inferior to those on other TPE routes (give 'em Pacers seems to be the attitude I've heard at times!) :roll: Remember that FNW had 175s on the North West routes and the Northern 180s are history.

As a Guard along this route, all I can say is Pacers may be too good for some along this said route