Night bus Services

[MotCO]

No-one said Reading buses didn't make a profit. Only that they are not only looking at getting the highest profit margin on routes.

Nor do they need to produce attractive dividends to shareholders, (I don't know if Reading Buses pay a dividend to the Council, but it probably would not need to be as great as a plc.)

 

[NorthernSpirit]

The N9 and N10 are fairly disappointing as night routes with one midnight journey - Leeds used to have 8 First-run routes with 3 journeys on each. They're much like the 314 except they've been given a special number.

The FLX has just the one journey at 2340 - enabling people to get home after leaving Leeds at 2231 or Manchester at 2258. Useful, but not what I'd call a night service.

Huddersfield also used to have a small nightbus network before First dropped it in the early nineties. A little later they dropped the Halifax network citing poor usage - odd news to those of us used to having to stand on a double decker. They did briefly run a Leeds - Bradford - Halifax night service hourly on Friday and Saturday nights.

I remember the remaining three Leeds routes a good few years ago the 921, the 927 and the 928. The 927 was the penultimate nightbus to go apparently over lack of users, it wasn't long the 921 and the 928 went the same way. I'd love to know what the other five were.

I have to say- the Leeds Night Service options aren’t great. Wish there was more of an offer the N1 & N10 to be honest.
For such a big city and with such a large Student population you’d have thought it would be fairly established night network and marketed well for students...

You would have thought so but when I contacted the then freshly created West Yorkshire Combined Authority in 2015, they seemed disinterested about having nightbuses again citing that "no one will use them" or "there's no money to pay for them". The thing is, is that people will use them if they were provided and go where people want them to. Just by looking at certain routes in Leeds I can see the ideal candidates such as the 34 to Otley (and the X85 on the way back), the 7A and 7S to Alwoodley and Shadwell (an "N7" would, more than likely, run as Shadwell via Alwoodley), the X98 to Wetherby, the X26/X27 to Garforth via Thorpe Park, the 28 to Leeds Docks* and the 51/52 to Morley and Tingley Mills.

* Since all services would have run back to Donisthorpe Street, it would probably make sense to extend the exisiting services to run to Leeds Docks before going out of service back to the depot.

This is what got me thinking about the universities in Huddersfield and also in Bradford, although with Bradford most of those who'll attend will either live locally or they'll get a taxi. The N10 is in a way partially thanks to me taking up an enquiry with Wakefield Council about Wakefield having its own nightbus network which see services run to at least 3am, as I felt that it was more of a local issue than a countywide one. I did the same with the other four West Yorkshire councils but were either fobbed off to WYCA or simply got no reply.

As Deerfold said, that Leeds use to have its own network before it was scrapped. Likewise with both Halifax and Huddersfield that use to have a nightbus network before it too was scrapped. From what I remember the Halifax nightbus had three routes - one went to Ripponden via Brighouse, Elland, West Vale and Sowerby Bridge, one went to Todmorden and another went around the northern part of Halifax. As with Wakefield, I took up the idea for a Halifax/Calderdale nightbus network to my local councillor but didn't get a satisfactory answer, just a regarble of what WYCA said.

No wonder the local economy is going down the crapper when people can't get to or from work early or late.

 

[Mutant Lemming]

People on a night out just want to enjoy themselves and go home when they feel like without hanging around for up to an hour for a bus. Apart from London nightbuses carry a minute fraction of people out on the town - the overwhelming majority go for the convenience of a minicab. For those working a bus that may be delayed and full of drunks coming home from a night out is a great incentive to buy a car. Only a well policed turn up and go service might (and only just might) persuade people not to use cabs and most towns and cities can't even manage that during the daytime.

 

[Deerfold]

I remember the remaining three Leeds routes a good few years ago the 921, the 927 and the 928. The 927 was the penultimate nightbus to go apparently over lack of users, it wasn't long the 921 and the 928 went the same way. I'd love to know what the other five were.




You would have thought so but when I contacted the then freshly created West Yorkshire Combined Authority in 2015, they seemed disinterested about having nightbuses again citing that "no one will use them" or "there's no money to pay for them". The thing is, is that people will use them if they were provided and go where people want them to. Just by looking at certain routes in Leeds I can see the ideal candidates such as the 34 to Otley (and the X85 on the way back), the 7A and 7S to Alwoodley and Shadwell (an "N7" would, more than likely, run as Shadwell via Alwoodley), the X98 to Wetherby, the X26/X27 to Garforth via Thorpe Park, the 28 to Leeds Docks* and the 51/52 to Morley and Tingley Mills.

* Since all services would have run back to Donisthorpe Street, it would probably make sense to extend the exisiting services to run to Leeds Docks before going out of service back to the depot.

This is what got me thinking about the universities in Huddersfield and also in Bradford, although with Bradford most of those who'll attend will either live locally or they'll get a taxi. The N10 is in a way partially thanks to me taking up an enquiry with Wakefield Council about Wakefield having its own nightbus network which see services run to at least 3am, as I felt that it was more of a local issue than a countywide one. I did the same with the other four West Yorkshire councils but were either fobbed off to WYCA or simply got no reply.

As Deerfold said, that Leeds use to have its own network before it was scrapped. Likewise with both Halifax and Huddersfield that use to have a nightbus network before it too was scrapped. From what I remember the Halifax nightbus had three routes - one went to Ripponden via Brighouse, Elland, West Vale and Sowerby Bridge, one went to Todmorden and another went around the northern part of Halifax. As with Wakefield, I took up the idea for a Halifax/Calderdale nightbus network to my local councillor but didn't get a satisfactory answer, just a regarble of what WYCA said.

No wonder the local economy is going down the crapper when people can't get to or from work early or late.

I'm afraid your memory is slightly faulty.
Halifax had the services.
The N51, N52 and N53.

The N53 went to Sowerby Bridge via the 579 route then up Tuel Lane then along the 590 route to Todmorden, returning along the 590 route.

I forget which way round the other two were.

One went up to Illingworth, returning via Queensbury. The other went to Hipperholme, Brighouse, Elland and back to Halifax.

If there'd been a night bus to Ripponden, I'd have used it. I used to stay at my Mum's or occasionally walk from Sowerby Bridge.

When they were withdrawn they charged £1.20 for a single and did not accept any passes.

For comparison a daytime single was 60p to Sowerby Bridge and £1.20 to Todmorden.

 

[Tim33160]

Below is the current list of night buses in operation in the Greater Manchester area.
https://tfgm.com/public-transport/bus/night-bus
X43 (Manchester to Burnley) Transdev Sat: Mcr (Chorlton St) to Burnley: 1am, 2am, 3am
43 (Manchester Airport to Manchester Piccadilly) Stagecoach Daily ev30mins
86 (Manchester Piccadilly to Sale (Ashfield Road)) Stagecoach Monday to Saturday: Manchester Piccadilly to Sale (Ashfield Road): 12:25am, 12:55am, 1:25am, 1:55am, 2:25am and 2:55am.
142 (Manchester Piccadilly to East Didsbury) Stagecoach Piccadilly to East Didsbury: Monday to Thursday (University term time): ev15mins to 3:47am. Friday to Saturday (University term time): ev10mins to 3:54am. irregular to 3:24am.
Manchester Piccadilly to East Didsbury: School holidays (Monday to Sunday): ev30mins to 3:24am.
East Didsbury to Manchester Piccadilly: Monday to Thursday (University term time): ev15mins to 3:23am. East Didsbury to Manchester Piccadilly: Friday to Saturday (University term time): ev15mins to 3:28am.
East Didsbury to Manchester Piccadilly: Sundays: ev30mins to 3:03am.
East Didsbury to Manchester Piccadilly: School holidays (Monday to Saturday): ev30mins to 3:01am.
143 (Manchester Piccadilly to West Didsbury (Central Road)) Stagecoach Manchester Piccadilly to West Didsbury (Central Road): Friday to Saturday (University term time): ev10mins to 3:05am.
192 (Manchester Piccadilly to Stockport Bus Station and Hazel Grove)
Stagecoach
Manchester Piccadilly to Stockport Bus Station: Monday to Wednesday: 12:20am and 12:35am.
Manchester Piccadilly to Stockport Bus Station and Hazel Grove: Thursday: 12:20am, 12:35am, 12:50am, 1:55am, 2:10am and 2:25am.
Manchester Piccadilly to Stockport Bus Station and Hazel Grove: Friday and Saturday: ev10mins to 1:05am, then ev15mins to 3:35am.
Hazel Grove (Rising Sun) to Stockport Bus Station: Monday to Sunday/Bank Holidays: 12am, 12:10am, 12:20am, 12:30am and 12:40am
Hazel Grove (Rising Sun) to Stockport Bus Station and Manchester Piccadilly: Thursday, Friday and Saturday: 1:05am, 1:20am and 1:35am.
Hazel Grove (Rising Sun) to Stockport Bus Station and Manchester Piccadilly: Friday and Saturday: 12:05am, 12:20am, 12:35am, 12:50am, 1:50am, 2:05am, 2:20am, 2:35am, 2:50am and 3:05am.
201 (Manchester to Hyde) Stagecoach Manchester to Hyde: Friday and Saturday: 12:15am and 1:15am. Hyde to Manchester: Friday and Saturday: 12:45am and 1:145am.
203 (Manchester to Stockport) Stagecoach Mcr to Stockport: Friday and Saturday: 12:45am, 1:45am and 2:45am. Stockport to Mcr: Friday and Saturday: 1:15am, 2:15am and 3:15am.
216 (Manchester to Ashton) Stagecoach Manchester to Ashton: Friday and Saturday: 1am, 2am and 3am. Ashton to Manchester: Friday and Saturday: 12:30am, 1:30am and 2:30am.
219 (Manchester to Stalybridge and Glossop) Stagecoach Manchester to Stalybridge: Friday and Saturday: 1.20am. Manchester to Stalybridge and Glossop: Friday and Saturday: 2:40am. Stalybridge to Manchester: Friday and Saturday: 2am.

These are all commercial services.

 

[Andyh82]

First wouldn’t provide them commercially and the WYCA would have better things to spend their money on if they had any.

There is also the problem of fares, they have to be high enough to pay for the staff and running of the buses, but low enough to compare with a group of people jumping in a cab.

Most places that have them have either universities, airports or a progressive bus company interested in developing such things rather than managing decline.

 

[NorthernSpirit]

I'm also going to mention that Doncaster had a nightbus network too which didn't last long, the services were scrapped around a decade ago.

Barnsley on the other hand has the N66 operated by Stagecoach.

I'm afraid your memory is slightly faulty.
Halifax had the services N51, N52 and N53.

The N53 went to Sowerby Bridge via the 579 route then up Tuel Lane then along the 590 route to Todmorden, returning along the 590 route. I forget which way round the other two were. One went up to Illingworth, returning via Queensbury. The other went to Hipperholme, Brighouse, Elland and back to Halifax. When they were withdrawn they charged £1.20 for a single and did not accept any passes. For comparison a daytime single was 60p to Sowerby Bridge and £1.20 to Todmorden.

I'm going off what a reletive had told me in regards to the routes, as they use to use one to get to Elland of which on one occation when they managed to get a seat upstairs, they saw two people at the back of the bus joining the mile long club. I'll have a look in the West Yorkshire Archives to see if they have a copy of the timetable of the said routes to try and get a better understanding of the former network.

If the N51, N52 and N53 were running now, I'd guess that the fares would probably be around the £3 mark or bordering close to the £4 mark, although I'm basing the fares on the current N10 which charges £3 single and I'm guessing the same for the N9 but I could be wrong.

 

[johnnychips]

^^
The last manifestation of Donny’s night buses meant they all left from Hallgate or Silver St in the “entertainment district” rather than a bus station, at about 0215...I can’t remember exactly but it was just after the clubs threw out. Of course that was either just before or not long after licensing laws were relaxed and people didn’t all leave at the same time so they failed.

 

[Andyh82]

I’ve got some timetables here

HNR/002 dated 29/01/93

N51 from Halifax via Ovenden, Illingworth, Bradshaw, Queensbury, Boothtown, Halifax
N52 from Halifax via Hipperholme, Lightcliffe, Brighouse, Nunnery Lane, Elland, Halifax
N53 from Halifax via Highroad Well, King Cross, Sowerby Bridge, Mytholmroyd, Hebden Bridge, Todmorden and then back direct to Halifax

All departed George Street at 2345, 0100 & 0215 Friday and Saturdays only operated by Yorkshire Rider, one bus per service.

HNR/003 dated 05/09/97

Same as above but the N51 was withdrawn replaced by the 950

Halifax to Leeds via Queensbury, Bradford, Stanningley

Departures at 2330, 0030, 0130 & 0230 from both ends. One bus provided by Calderline, one bus by Leeds City Link

The 950 was withdrawn 29/01/99 as per the Leeds timetable that it was also shown in, as I haven’t got a new Halifax timetable I assume the N52 & N53 would have been withdrawn at the same time.

 

[neilmc]

Penrith's bus services are terrible but there's an 00:48 departure to Carlisle every night!

In LCT/Metro days Leeds used to have a reasonable night network - they had a few dedicated drivers who covered various routes through the city though not on any regular frequency. Best place served was Cross Gates where I used to live, with the last service 25 bus short working to Cross Gates at 23:41 then a night service to Swarcliffe at midnight, another around 01:30 and another at around 03:00. On major routes the daytime service was back in operation before 05:00.

I recall on the university route a night 336 to Tinshill (I think) at around 23:30. This was a crew operation departing before the last 25 Cross Gates as mentioned above and was a bit naughty as it was actually a late shift working by a Headingley crew held back and made into a night service to rip off the students with double fares.

 

[Deerfold]

Don't forget Bradford's old Nightrider 'network'.

The 938 linked Bradford and Keighley, in that direction only, on Friday and Saturday nights with 3 departures. Oddly, it was run by Yorkshire Rider, though the daytime journeys were all run by Keighley and District.

It was withdrawn before the Halifax and Huddersfield networks.

 

[route101]

Penrith's bus services are terrible but there's an 00:48 departure to Carlisle every night!

In LCT/Metro days Leeds used to have a reasonable night network - they had a few dedicated drivers who covered various routes through the city though not on any regular frequency. Best place served was Cross Gates where I used to live, with the last service 25 bus short working to Cross Gates at 23:41 then a night service to Swarcliffe at midnight, another around 01:30 and another at around 03:00. On major routes the daytime service was back in operation before 05:00.

I recall on the university route a night 336 to Tinshill (I think) at around 23:30. This was a crew operation departing before the last 25 Cross Gates as mentioned above and was a bit naughty as it was actually a late shift working by a Headingley crew held back and made into a night service to rip off the students with double fares.

I recall some late buses back from Carlisle to Center parcs!

Glasgows night bus network is pretty sparse now , Castlemilk is no longer served by N75. Weekday services ran for a short time about ten years ago . Later buses n key routes should be considered

 

[Jordan Adam]

Aberdeen has seen a slightly decline in use. Pre 2016 the N1 and N17 both ran half hourly often on standing loads, they cut them to hourly following the oil downturn to allow the creation of the new N5 & N18. However both those have been axed now with the N1 & N17 going back to their old routes on hourly frequencies.

Allegedly the N1 & N17 prior to 2016 could make £200+ per run.

 

[Andyh82]

Don't forget Bradford's old Nightrider 'network'.

The 938 linked Bradford and Keighley, in that direction only, on Friday and Saturday nights with 3 departures. Oddly, it was run by Yorkshire Rider, though the daytime journeys were all run by Keighley and District.

It was withdrawn before the Halifax and Huddersfield networks.

I don’t know about that, during this 1990s period that I am looking at there were no night buses in Huddersfield

 

[Adlington]

List of night buses in Greater Manchester (not all of them operate every day of the week)

 

[Deerfold]

I don’t know about that, during this 1990s period that I am looking at there were no night buses in Huddersfield

I'll have a look next week to see if I have any of the old timetables (I know I have Halifax and Leeds ones) to try and work out how long they ran - I only ever used the N53 and 950.

The only times I ever seem to be on a bus in West Yorkshire after midnight these days, it's the last journey into Leeds on the X84, heading for an overnight Megabus.

 

[GaryMcEwan]

Glasgow used to have a decent night bus service a few years ago. First used to run numerous routes on Friday and Saturday nights, and so did Arriva when they were still on the go.

These days, First only run a handful now and the ones they do run have been massively scaled back. McGill's don't even run any night routes at all.

 

[Ianno87]

List of night buses in Greater Manchester (not all of them operate every day of the week)

Wow - all the North Manchester ones have disappeared then?

Bolton and Wigan also had very brief* flirtations with a Night Bus network in the mid-2000s.

*Long enough to at least personally sample the 125N in December 2004. Very useful for me and the other passenger.

 

[ANDREW_D_WEBB]

Poole/Bournemouth have the 24/7 m1 and m2 routes.

Yellow Buses also operates the N5 on Wednesday and Friday nights. Press release from their website at https://www.yellowbuses.co.uk/night-bus

 

[duncanp]

In Birmingham, National Express West Midlands service 9 to Stourbridge has departures from the city centre up to 01:00 every night of the week, and an all night service at weekends.

https://nxbus.co.uk/files/NX-West-Midlands/current_timetables/DudleyNewTimetables18/D09_2Sep18.pdf

But the overall level of provision in Birmingham is disappointing, considering it is the second largest city in England with several universities and hospitals.

 

[Statto]

In Birmingham, National Express West Midlands service 9 to Stourbridge has departures from the city centre up to 01:00 every night of the week, and an all night service at weekends.

https://nxbus.co.uk/files/NX-West-Midlands/current_timetables/DudleyNewTimetables18/D09_2Sep18.pdf

But the overall level of provision in Birmingham is disappointing, considering it is the second largest city in England with several universities and hospitals.

There's a few routes in Birmingham that have post midnight & 1am departures 7 days a week, i think the X1 is the only one that operates 24/7 & that is only Birmingham to/from Airport, although Coventry section starts from 3am onwards.

Night buses require bigger budget to operate, things like drivers pay[ i would have thought drivers want at least time & half, if not double time to work nights]ecc, why some night routes have premium fares with passes & the like not valid, if the company can't profit from that then night route won't operate, & i think most people want companies put resources into routes during the day than overnight.

 

[SteveHFC]

Arriva service A between Luton Airport and Dunstable runs 24 hours a day including a half hourly service at night

https://www.arrivabus.co.uk/GetTime...d45-30367f4cb51e&id=116914&date=190217-190528