Next Lib Dem leader?- and when?? (guessing game)

[Busaholic]

They should definitely do a reality TV show where Lembit Opik is parachuted into places, and Orkney and Shetland provide excitingly small targets for landing.

If he chose an Arctic Skua breeding point on Unst, he'd get more than he bargained for. I inadvertently strayed onto one and was lucky to only feel the rush of air as the Bonxie divebombed me, a couple of feet from my head. I was young then, so definitely beat the 200 metres British record to escape to a nearby hut.

 

[cjmillsnun]

Like the BBC, we must remain impartial (in theory).

So: who will be the next Lib Dem leader?

I'll go with Nick Clegg. Whisper it quietly...

It must be a serving MP. It is part of the party constitution.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

It must be a serving MP. It is part of the party constitution.

Clegg WAS a serving MP when that post was made... Just!

 

[317 forever]

Jo Swinson is my MP and I would like to see her get the job.

It was being leader that caused the problems. Lib Dems have a large LGBT membership - some of whom have always been unhappy with Farron's Christian views. He felt he was forced to betray his Christian values when pressed by the press on issues such as gay sex as to do otherwise would be regarded as political suicide. He should have stood true to his principles and made it clear that a key part of being a Liberal is accepting other views and allowing people to live as they see fit and not imposing your views on others. He voted in favour of LGBT equality legislation and was happy to be interviewed by Pink News and outline his support for equality issues.

I would like to see Jo Swinson elected leader - which would leave Labour as the only major party not to have a permanent female leader.

I agree with both of you in wanting Jo to become leader.

I think the worst choice would be Vince Cable. He would come out with some clever soundbites (like when he described Gordon Brown as having transformed from Stalin to Mr Bean) but would be far too vivid a reminder to people who felt let down by the LibDems in coalition.

 

[Jonny]

I think you might want to look into the meaning of liberalism

It depends on the definition of liberalism. Unfortunately, it seems to change with the wind.

The most stupid reason to resign ever. Than he also joined the wrong party. he seems to be in parlement since 2005. And than it was never a problem, untill he became leader of the LD. How many seats did they lose?! Oh it seems to be even +4.

Trust me, they're all a mismatch. The least worst one is the Conservatives. Their trouble is that they don't delineate well between the deserving and the undeserving poor, particularly in terms of hidden disabilities that can make employment a lot harder.

Labour, on the other hand, have some good ideas but they take solidarity too far. Far too far.

 

[Jonny]

^ Somebody's in denial about the level of public support for renationalising the railways.

Majority support for rail nationalisation

Maybe, but the irony is that the same DafT oops I meant DfT, the Department for Transport, who provide government oversight and would run any ren-nationalised railway are preventing demand-surge deterrent pricing in other parts of the network that might ease overcrowding; I was thinking GTR-Southern commuting to London(and return), and the Leeds <> Manchester corridor as examples. That is what is needed; if I lived and worked in the London-SE area or Manchester-Leeds belt, I would have no objections to a higher fare per journey (as long as it applied to everyone in that area) in exchange for less overcrowding. Which is also my thoughts on the fares structure on the London Underground (and other TfL services for that matter)... certainly before TfL goes chasing central government funding...

 

[AlterEgo]

Jo Swinson has ruled herself out.

 

[backontrack]

It'll be Vince Cable now. I'm fairly sure that the re-election of Cable was the only reason why Paddick resigned in the first place.

 

[northwichcat]

Layla Moran, who gave up a teaching job to become MP, has become their Education Spokesperson. Not exactly a surprise!

 

[cjmillsnun]

Clegg WAS a serving MP when that post was made... Just!

He was not. At the time, there were no serving MPs as parliament had been dissolved.

 

[317 forever]

Jo Swinson has ruled herself out.

Obviously Jo has to be true to herself and is under no obligation to put herself forward for leader. Subject to a deputy leadership position being advertised she should walk it.

 

[AlterEgo]

Obviously Jo has to be true to herself and is under no obligation to put herself forward for leader. Subject to a deputy leadership position being advertised she should walk it.

I was certainly pleased to read her honesty on her blog, which was disastrously sexist and ensures that the Lib Dems won't be getting my vote in the near future.

 

[takno]

I was certainly pleased to read her honesty on her blog, which was disastrously sexist and ensures that the Lib Dems won't be getting my vote in the near future.

They won't be getting your vote because somebody who isn't standing to be leader expressed a vaguely sexist sentiment in a blog post? That's even worse than the tuition fees thing

 

[AlterEgo]

They won't be getting your vote because somebody who isn't standing to be leader expressed a vaguely sexist sentiment in a blog post? That's even worse than the tuition fees thing

I rarely vote; it only encourages them.

It wasn't "vaguely" sexist; try reversing the gender roles and see how it reads then. I just have no time whatsoever for idiots like that.

I didn't vote Labour mainly because of Diane Abbott in the end who also wasn't the leader either.

 

[takno]

I rarely vote; it only encourages them.

It wasn't "vaguely" sexist; try reversing the gender roles and see how it reads then. I just have no time whatsoever for idiots like that.

I didn't vote Labour mainly because of Diane Abbott in the end who also wasn't the leader either.

It's slightly lazily put, I imagine she assumed the reader could infer that these things are on a spectrum, and stating that men would go for a it and women wouldn't is more of an on-average thing than a cold hard fact that applies in every case. It was necessary to reference it since it's long-standing theme in feminism that women effectively exclude themselves from leadership roles through lack of confidence, so somebody else was bound to bring it up if she didn't.

Clumsy phrasing but hardly crime of the century and from somebody who might make make it to deputy of a minor party and will never therefore have a leading role in government.

In contrast Dianne Abbot would really have been in a significant position of power. Fair enough if that was enough for you to change your vote. It didn't concern me enormously - I wouldn't have chosen her the job, but I don't think she'd be any worse than May was.

 

[northwichcat]

I was certainly pleased to read her honesty on her blog, which was disastrously sexist and ensures that the Lib Dems won't be getting my vote in the near future.

On Twitter she clarified she meant running for senior political positions but that doesn't make it right - you could hardly say Andrea Leadsome was a suitable person to run for leader of the governing political party or that Dianne Abbott should have run for Labour leader in 2010. You could also say Chukka Ummana was a suitable candidate for Labour leader but decided against running. Yet according to Ms Swinson it's the men who run for the top positions whether or not they are qualified to.

 

[AlterEgo]

On Twitter she clarified she meant running for senior political positions but that doesn't make it right - you could hardly say Andrea Leadsome was a suitable person to run for leader of the governing political party or that Dianne Abbott should have run for Labour leader in 2010. You could also say Chukka Ummana was a suitable candidate for Labour leader but decided against running. Yet according to Ms Swinson it's the men who run for the top positions whether or not they are qualified to.

A load of old toss from Swinson.

If a male politician were to say:

I have of course wondered what a lass in my position would do. It’s obvious. Most lasses in my shoes would run for leader like a shot.

...But just as often I have observed women going for the promotion when they shouldn’t. Just because a woman would do it, doesn’t make it the right thing to do.

...they'd have had scorn heaped upon them.

It was a completely unnecessary and unhelpful aside in an otherwise reasoned blog post about why she didn't want to be leader - there was no reason whatsoever to bring that in unless she's playing to a feminist audience (and frankly I have little time for feminists that think like that and make sweeping generalisations).

tl;dr on the blogpost: she ain't good enough - yet.

 

[takno]

there was no reason whatsoever to bring that in unless she's playing to a feminist audience (and frankly I have little time for feminists that think like that and make sweeping generalisations).

She was talking to an audience that will inevitably include a fairly large number of feminists. That doesn't mean she's playing to them, and whether you personally have any time for them or not isn't strictly relevant to whether politicians and blog authors choose to address them.

Feminists generally aren't making a sweeping generalisation. The argument is that men will, on average, apply for promotion more often than women, and it's backed up by fairly good statistics and studies at all levels of management. The main thrust of the argument at senior levels is that women have a duty to put themselves outside their comfort zone to ensure that they are appropriately represented. She needed to address why she was not willing to do that.

Dianne Abbott ran for leader in 2010 because the left always put up a candidate, without any hope of winning. Since McDonnell, Benn and various others had gone for it before it was very much her turn. She knew she wouldn't win, so she clearly wasn't really trying to be leader anyway.

In the case of Leadsom, 5 men and 2 women made a serious tilt at the leadership. Fox and Gove were at least as spectacularly unqualified as Leadsom. Leadsom only got through to the final two because two overly-ambitious men tore each other apart in front of each other and she was the only one left standing. Doesn't sound much like a story of women being just as ambitious as men to me.

 

[northwichcat]

Dianne Abbott ran for leader in 2010 because the left always put up a candidate, without any hope of winning. Since McDonnell, Benn and various others had gone for it before it was very much her turn. She knew she wouldn't win, so she clearly wasn't really trying to be leader anyway.

McDonnell failed to get nominated. When Abbott tried to get nominated MPs wanting one of the Milibands were encouraged to nominate Abbott to broaden the range of candidates.

In the case of Leadsom, 5 men and 2 women made a serious tilt at the leadership. Fox and Gove were at least as spectacularly unqualified as Leadsom. Leadsom only got through to the final two because two overly-ambitious men tore each other apart in front of each other and she was the only one left standing. Doesn't sound much like a story of women being just as ambitious as men to me.

It should be remembered 21% of the current Conservative MPs are women and prior to the recent election the percentage was even lower than that. Given the proportion of women MPs in the Conservative party having 2 female ones on a list of 7 suggests women are more likely to go for a promotion than men! The problem (at least in the Conservative party) seems to be getting women to be MPs in the first place, not what the female MPs do after election.

 

[Busaholic]

Wasn't Swinson really implying that Farron was never a suitable leader, but wouldn't quite come out with it? The only jarring note in the Commons tribute to Jo Cox came from Farron imo.

 

[takno]

Wasn't Swinson really implying that Farron was never a suitable leader, but wouldn't quite come out with it? The only jarring note in the Commons tribute to Jo Cox came from Farron imo.

They'd have been better off sticking with Nick Clegg as leader in 2015, given that all the credible replacements had lost their seats. Unfortunately, much like Milliband he was so busy falling on his sword that he didn't bother to look at succession at all. Farron was just the leader that everybody hated the least, and I doubt even he thought anything more positive than that he'd grow into the role. Who knows though, maybe he was really ambitious but thought it was sinful to show it.

 

[northwichcat]

Jo Swinson has become deputy leader after no-one else put their name forward.

Vince Cable is standing for leader.

 

[317 forever]

Jo Swinson has become deputy leader after no-one else put their name forward.

Vince Cable is standing for leader.

Alas it is now looking like a Cable coronation as all other moderately known candidates have ruled themselves out, including Jo Swinson, Ed Davey, Norman Lamb and Alistair Carmichael.

As Vince Cable is so badly remembered from the Coalition, this is unlikely to yield them much progress.

 

[northwichcat]

Options are really someone who was involved in the coalition or someone who's a new MP. At least Cable has a pre-coalition voting record so the media can't accuse him of having a voting record which has always been consistent with the Conservatives, like the Independent tried to with Jo Swinson.

 

[Busaholic]

Ming Campbell wishes it to be remembered that he was considered 'too old' to continue leading the party at the age of 64 i.e. ten years younger than Cable! It is a sign of desperation that he's about to be anointed: if the LibDems think he'll have the 'Corbyn effect' on the young they're delusional. He is far too associated with Clegg and the Coalition Government, and it's that younger age group who voted LibDem in 2010 who are the least forgiving of that. He was full of bluster in the Coalition years, briefing journalists that he would bring the government down if they did this or that, then going very quiet when the govt went ahead anyway!

 

[northwichcat]

Ming Campbell wishes it to be remembered that he was considered 'too old' to continue leading the party at the age of 64 i.e. ten years younger than Cable! It is a sign of desperation that he's about to be anointed: if the LibDems think he'll have the 'Corbyn effect' on the young they're delusional. He is far too associated with Clegg and the Coalition Government, and it's that younger age group who voted LibDem in 2010 who are the least forgiving of that. He was full of bluster in the Coalition years, briefing journalists that he would bring the government down if they did this or that, then going very quiet when the govt went ahead anyway!

I think pre-coalition Cable appealed more to younger voters than Campbell ever did. Also since then the demographic of typical Lib Dem supporters has changed. Although, saying that the Conservatives don't appeal to many younger voters and while Labour are popular with under 25s currently they won't appeal to everyone - so there should still be a younger group that the Lib Dems can appeal to.

 

[Darandio]

Vince Cable it is.....

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-40662737

Sir Vince Cable is the new leader of the Liberal Democrats, after no-one stood against him.

The 74-year old Twickenham MP was the only candidate on the ballot paper when nominations closed at 16:00 BST.

The former business secretary said there should be an "exit from Brexit" and he believed the party's call for a second referendum would be vindicated.

He also said he did not intend to be a "caretaker" leader and he would "serve as long as I need to".

Sir Vince, who has been acting and deputy leader in the past, has argued that Brexit is not inevitable.

He assumes the leadership vacated by Tim Farron, who stood down after a disappointing general election in which the party increased its number of MPs from nine to 12 but saw its vote share fall to 7.4%.

Sir Vince paid tribute to his predecessor as he was announced as the new leader, saying Mr Farron had taken over the leadership at a time of crisis for the party and had rebuilt its membership to record levels.

He argued that the Conservatives and Labour had been taken over by "ideologues" and British politics had lost its "basic common sense", moderation and mutual respect - his aim was for the Liberal Democrats to move into that space.

He warned that he feared the UK was "heading for a disastrous outcome" over Brexit, headed by a dysfunctional and disunited government - and said he felt there should be an "exit from Brexit".

The party's main campaign pledge during the election was to give the public the final say on the terms of the UK's exit from the EU in a further referendum, ahead of the scheduled withdrawal date in March 2019.

Although Sir Vince has admitted this message did not "cut through", he has argued that attitudes are beginning to change and that the public mood will come round to the party's position.

He said as the difficulties of Brexit became clearer, Mr Farron's policy would be "absolutely vindicated". He added: "I'm ambitious for this country and I'm ambitious for this party. In difficult times, we have shown enormous resilience but I believe we can fight our way back, break through and make an enormous success of our party and eventually, in government."