New Overground line names progress?

[Wolfie]

Great video from Jago Hazard in which he very deftly and amusingly puts down the various common moans about the names:

TY for posting. Agree with your comments.

 

[birchesgreen]

Yes good video by Jago (as usual) but how come i am this old but didn't know there was a Turkey Street station?! That is definitely on the list to visit next year...

 

[duffield]

Yes good video by Jago (as usual) but how come i am this old but didn't know there was a Turkey Street station?! That is definitely on the list to visit next year...

I was disappointed to find out that the origins of the place name Turkey Street have nothing to do with the bird, but appear to relate to a family called Toke or Tokey.

I'd hoped that perhaps the name somehow related to the famous Norfolk turkey drives, where turkeys were fitted with little bootees and walked at length from Nortfolk to London to eventually meet their grisly fate at Christmas.

Turkeys in Boots

No, this is not a bizarre idea for a new Christmas panto! Just a plain, factual statement of what took place in Norfolk in Georgian times. From the late 16th century, thousands of geese and turkeys…

penandpension.com

 

[talldave]

Yes good video by Jago (as usual) but how come i am this old but didn't know there was a Turkey Street station?! That is definitely on the list to visit next year...

Before moving to Oyster land I bought all my travelcards as Turkey Street ones during December!

 

[Wolfie]

Before moving to Oyster land I bought all my travelcards as Turkey Street ones during December!

Love it!

 

[Dstock7080]

I can’t believe TfL Go still hasn’t been updated

TfL Go app now updated

 

[duffield]

BBC London local news Tfl "scoreboard" not yet updated.

I don't live in London but it's the default local news on the BBC News channel; personally I think they should rotate through the regions.

 

[fairysdad]

BBC London local news Tfl "scoreboard" not yet updated.

I believe from a source that there's some API issues from the cyber attack - a bodge job was made following it but I expect that there are some lingering issues in place there which'll probably break more things than not!

 

[boiledbeans2]

TfL Go app now updated

It's a relief that the Cable Car is suspended.

 

[Peter Sarf]

I hope that if I want the North London line I will be able to easily find it.

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

I hope that if I want the North London line I will be able to easily find it.

... Well you know now to look for the Mildmay line, don't you, so head to that and you will find it...

 

[Peter Sarf]

... Well you know now to look for the Mildmay line, don't you, so head to that and you will find it...

So do I have to remember all the new names for the Overground lines or can I just work it out *(below) or rely on the existing names ?.
For instance North London Line and East London line are easier to remember as they geographically represent where they are even its only roughly right. They are also existing names and I do not think we should mess about with existing names.

*= what I am thinking about is if I know what station I want to go to will that still be listed on information or do I have to know the name of the line the station is on.

 

[bluegoblin7]

So do I have to remember all the new names for the Overground lines or can I just work it out *(below) or rely on the existing names ?.
For instance North London Line and East London line are easier to remember as they geographically represent where they are even its only roughly right. They are also existing names and I do not think we should mess about with existing names.

*= what I am thinking about is if I know what station I want to go to will that still be listed on information or do I have to know the name of the line the station is on.

Except they’re not existing names - you may know them as that as an enthusiast, but they have never been used publicly to describe the services that currently exist on them. The old East London line closed in 2007 and the new London Overground route is a very different beast.

More generally, refusing to accept or use the new names or feigning some level of confusion is pathetic, to be quite honest. The general public are already having no trouble adapting to the names, and this would have been the case whatever was chosen.

 

[wanderingriver]

Except they’re not existing names - you may know them as that as an enthusiast, but they have never been used publicly to describe the services that currently exist on them. The old East London line closed in 2007 and the new London Overground route is a very different beast.

Refusing to accept or use the new names or feigning some level of confusion is pathetic, to be quite honest. The general public are already having no trouble adapting to the names, and this would have been the case whatever was chosen.

This is a sentiment I’ve noticed with a lot of enthusiasts. They seem unable to realise that outside of this interest, the “old line names” don’t exist to most people. I think a lot of people have to start to learn that what has happened is here to stay and TfL isn’t going to “go back”.

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

Refusing to accept or use the new names or feigning some level of confusion is pathetic, to be quite honest. The general public are already having no trouble adapting to the names, and this would have been the case whatever was chosen.

I agree, although with more polite sentiments.

 

[Dave W]

what I am thinking about is if I know what station I want to go to will that still be listed on information or do I have to know the name of the line the station is on.

And how is that different to what you had to do before? Facetious nonsense.

Refusing to accept or use the new names or feigning some level of confusion is pathetic, to be quite honest. The general public are already having no trouble adapting to the names, and this would have been the case whatever was chosen.

Surely you must understand that the railway runs for the benefit of us enthusiasts!

(totally agree and your sentiment was entirely appropriate)

 

[bramling]

Except they’re not existing names - you may know them as that as an enthusiast, but they have never been used publicly to describe the services that currently exist on them. The old East London line closed in 2007 and the new London Overground route is a very different beast.

Not sure this is entirely the case. A friend of mine who has zero interest in railways bought an apartment near Surrey Quays (post 2010), and has always referred to his local rail service as the “East London line”. I’d place a wager that the same applies for the North London line as well. Agree that the remainder has always been fairly nondescript.

 

[norbitonflyer]

The North London Line appeared on Tube maps, with that name, for many years, so will have acquired some familiarity. Historically, part of it was the North London Railway, but it also included the Hampstead Junction railway, the North and South Western Junction Railway and part of the London & South Western, and in its modern incarnation has also taken over the West London Railway and the West London Extension. Try fitting "NL,HJ,NW&SWJ,LSW,WL&WLE line" on a Tube Map!

 

[birchesgreen]

The North London Line appeared on Tube maps, with that name, for many years, so will have acquired some familiarity. Historically, part of it was the North London Railway, but it also included the Hampstead Junction railway, the North and South Western Junction Railway and part of the London & South Western, and in its modern incarnation has also taken over the West London Railway and the West London Extension. Try fitting "NL,HJ,NW&SWJ,LSW,WL&WLE line" on a Tube Map!

Yes that's an interesting point, an example can be seen here.

https://www.clarksbury.com/cdl/maps/tube77.jpg

 

[Peter Sarf]

Except they’re not existing names - you may know them as that as an enthusiast, but they have never been used publicly to describe the services that currently exist on them. The old East London line closed in 2007 and the new London Overground route is a very different beast.

Refusing to accept or use the new names or feigning some level of confusion is pathetic, to be quite honest. The general public are already having no trouble adapting to the names, and this would have been the case whatever was chosen.

I have come across quite a few people who refer to East London Line or East London Railway. Also same for North London Line. Most were not enthusiasts etc. Are they all Pathetic ?.
Or shall we leave out the insults ?.

And how is that different to what you had to do before? Facetious nonsense.

Perhaps you could answer the question please. I am not asking if it is the same as before I was asking if it will be easy to work out via the destination name.

Surely you must understand that the railway runs for the benefit of us enthusiasts!

(totally agree and your sentiment was entirely appropriate)

Its not just enthusiasts that used the old names. Granted they were not geographically correct but they were good enough AND why not build on what people know already.

 

[Wolfie]

I have come across quite a few people who refer to East London Line or East London Railway. Also same for North London Line. Most were not enthusiasts etc. Are they all Pathetic ?.
Or shall we leave out the insults ?.

Perhaps you could answer the question please. I am not asking if it is the same as before I was asking if it will be easy to work out via the destination name.

Its not just enthusiasts that used the old names. Granted they were not geographically correct but they were good enough AND why not build on what people know already.

It's exactly the same maps and station signage other than each of the newly named lines being broken out separately. Why would it be any more difficult to work out routes via destination name?

 

[miklcct]

It's exactly the same maps and station signage other than each of the newly named lines being broken out separately. Why would it be any more difficult to work out routes via destination name?

because not all trains go to the final destination, and there may be more than a way for a train to go to a certain destination (e.g. Highbury & Islington to Clapham Junction).

 

[bluegoblin7]

I have come across quite a few people who refer to East London Line or East London Railway. Also same for North London Line. Most were not enthusiasts etc. Are they all Pathetic ?.

There is a huge difference between using a historical name which someone has always used and will continue to use and falsely equating that with ordinary people using a line unfamiliar to them that never previously had a name. Those who have used, for example, the Watford DC line for years won't be looking at the new signage, even if they've always called it 'Harlequin'.

Perhaps you could answer the question please. I am not asking if it is the same as before I was asking if it will be easy to work out via the destination name.

Presumably you struggle to use the Metropolitan to Amersham, the Jubilee to Stratford, the Wherry Lines to Lowestoft, the A train to 42nd Street or Line 4 to Châtelet.

It's just a name. It isn't going to hurt you.

 

[Lee898]

There is a huge difference between using a historical name which someone has always used and will continue to use and falsely equating that with ordinary people using a line unfamiliar to them that never previously had a name. Those who have used, for example, the Watford DC line for years won't be looking at the new signage, even if they've always called it 'Harlequin'.


Presumably you struggle to use the Metropolitan to Amersham, the Jubilee to Stratford, the Wherry Lines to Lowestoft, the A train to 42nd Street or Line 4 to Châtelet.

It's just a name. It isn't going to hurt you.

I think it hurts as it is woke stuff that should not have any bearing on an already badly financed and thus, badly steered system. Simply put, this was done to ram post modernism down our throats , and wipe the identity of these lines that have an identity.

 

[sh24]

Most of my friends and colleagues would just refer to the Overground. The names help break that down. I don't much care for a couple of them but overall it helps usability.

 

[GLC]

I have come across quite a few people who refer to East London Line or East London Railway. Also same for North London Line. Most were not enthusiasts etc. Are they all Pathetic ?.
Or shall we leave out the insults ?.

I think it is quite unfair of you to refer to the people you know who aren't enthusiasts as "Pathetic" (your words). You may find insulting members of the public on a forum acceptable, but I think this is something that shouldn't even be questioned. It's very disappointing to see posters on here ask if they are allowed to insult others.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 6 Dec 2024 ==

I think it hurts as it is woke stuff that should not have any bearing on an already badly financed and thus, badly steered system. Simply put, this was done to ram post modernism down our throats , and wipe the identity of these lines that have an identity.

In the name of balance, perhaps the service on each of the lines could do the opposite of what the name was, so that all sides of the issue at hand are covered e.g. women not allowed on the Suffragette line, black people banned from the Windrush line etc. I can understand there may be some negative comments, but as I say, it would be a best effort attempt cover all the bases in here in the name of balance

 

[Via Bank]

Just to be clear, the signage does include destinations and line diagrams as well (e.g. Mildmay line to Stratford, Windrush line to New Cross) and the maps have been updated too. It's not like all reference to the Stratford-Camden Road-Richmond/Clapham Junction service has been scrubbed and replaced with "Mildmay Line." Yes there may be momentary confusion the first time someone uses it if they've not seen the new names before, but let's not blow it out of proportion.

 

[Peter Sarf]

It's exactly the same maps and station signage other than each of the newly named lines being broken out separately. Why would it be any more difficult to work out routes via destination name?

Thanks. That is what I hoped.

I think it is quite unfair of you to refer to the people you know who aren't enthusiasts as "Pathetic" (your words). You may find insulting members of the public on a forum acceptable, but I think this is something that shouldn't even be questioned. It's very disappointing to see posters on here ask if they are allowed to insult others.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 6 Dec 2024 ==

I was not inferring anyone was pathetic nor was I slinging insults.

In the name of balance, perhaps the service on each of the lines could do the opposite of what the name was, so that all sides of the issue at hand are covered e.g. women not allowed on the Suffragette line, black people banned from the Windrush line etc. I can understand there may be some negative comments, but as I say, it would be a best effort attempt cover all the bases in here in the name of balance

Now you seem to be doing what you accused me of.

At the end of the day some will be used to the old names and some will get used to the new names. In reality I suspect some will not bother with either name just as long as the information is there to determine which platform will lead them to their destination/interchange station.

Ironically I have recently come across someone who seemed oblivious to the deep level tube lines. I don't think they were from outside London but quite possibly rarely travelled by public transport. So its all lost on them but will not be a problem if there is enough information and/or people to help them.

 

[Recessio]

Most of my friends and colleagues would just refer to the Overground. The names help break that down. I don't much care for a couple of them but overall it helps usability.

Similarly, I overheard someone on the phone call the Overground "the orange tube line"

 

[Peter Sarf]

Similarly, I overheard someone on the phone call the Overground "the orange tube line"

Ah yes. My granddaughter says they (378s) are just underground trains !. Orange - the problem is the colours of the rainbow were incorrectly specified all that time ago - should have split it up into more colours .