New 4-tier system for England

[kristiang85]

There are videos of St Pancras online showing it absolutely rammed with people getting out - so predictable.

The irony is that most of them were probably planning to travel off peak and as socially distant as possible over the next few days; if the government had any behavioural scientists at hand (or an ounce of common sense), they would know this would happen, and now the risk of spread is much higher.

Of course when the next spike happens the people travelling will be blamed, and not government policy.

 

[bussnapperwm]

Meanwhile at St Pancras, half the world seems to have turned up to get out of London before midnight...

https://twitter.com/HarrietClugston/status/1340383304143540227?s=20

What a massive superspreader event. Prepare Yorkshire for Tier 4

 

[Bikeman78]

Why do I suddenly have the urge to play Phil Collins

I'm going with Rage against the Machine's "Killing in the name." It was all the rage when I was at school. It seems rather appropriate now. For those that don't know it, Youtube is your friend.

 

[bramling]

They'll hope to sell more copies of the books they will no doubt write, and more after-dinner speaking engagements. Don't forget that some people get off on controlling others...

I suppose there will be a market for “how I completely wrecked a country in a year”...

 

[Hadders]

With Christmas now effectively dead in the water, would there be any scope simply for supermarkets to revert to normal opening hours for every day apart from Christmas Day, in order to dampen down some of what will be a mad rush next week?

Most supermarkets have extended hours next week (which is normal practice at Christmas) plus they are encouraging customers to spread their visits across the day to assist with numbers in store at any one time. Staffing schedules will be in place and they get hard to change at short notice.

 

[221129]

By that token it would appear that travel to/from tier 2 and 3 areas can still go ahead without any restrictions?

As has always been the case..

 

[yorkie]

Agree. There are people around here who want to deny the seriousness of the virus and therefore try to invent other reasons why restrictions are put in place.

I am not denying the seriousness of the virus, but I am also well aware of the average age of a death of someone with the virus, and I am well aware of the fact that the vast majority of people who catch the virus have no symptoms or very mild symptoms.

Do you think the virus itself is a bigger threat to the majority of people than the threat posed by the measures imposed to mitigate against the spread of the virus? How long do you think people can go on living like this for?

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 19 Dec 2020 ==

By that token it would appear that travel to/from tier 2 and 3 areas can still go ahead without any restrictions?

The addition of Tier 4 has not resulted in the imposition of any further restrictions in Tier 2/3 areas that I am aware of.

 

[bramling]

I am not denying the seriousness of the virus, but I am also well aware of the average age of a death of someone with the virus, and I am well aware of the fact that the vast majority of people who catch the virus have no symptoms or very mild symptoms.

Do you think the virus itself is a bigger threat to the majority of people than the threat posed by the measures imposed to mitigate against the spread of the virus? How long do you think people can go on living like this for?

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 19 Dec 2020 ==


The addition of Tier 4 has not resulted in the imposition of any further restrictions in Tier 2/3 areas that I am aware of.

Is it actually *illegal* to travel out of a tier 4 area? This doesn’t seem clear.

 

[Richard Scott]

I'm going with Rage against the Machine's "Killing in the name." It was all the rage when I was at school. It seems rather appropriate now. For those that don't know it, Youtube is your friend.

Try 'No-one is to blame' by Howard Jones'. Just about sums it all up especially the line 'you can feel the punishment but you can't commit the sin'.

 

[trainophile]

I am not denying the seriousness of the virus, but I am also well aware of the average age of a death of someone with the virus, and I am well aware of the fact that the vast majority of people who catch the virus have no symptoms or very mild symptoms.

Do you think the virus itself is a bigger threat to the majority of people than the threat posed by the measures imposed to mitigate against the spread of the virus? How long do you think people can go on living like this for?

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 19 Dec 2020 ==


The addition of Tier 4 has not resulted in the imposition of any further restrictions in Tier 2/3 areas that I am aware of.

I thought there was some instruction/request for people to "stay local" under the new system. Perhaps I got that wrong. Also upthread someone mentioned the possibility of a return to essential travel only being permitted.

 

[yorkie]

Is it actually *illegal* to travel out of a tier 4 area? This doesn’t seem clear.

Not right now (well technically Tier 4 doesn't exist yet) but when this sort of wording has appeared before, it has generally been accompanied by legislation, so based on past experience, I expect draconian legislation to be brought in. Whether the legislation has to go through any democratic process I do not know (I am not convinced we are living in a full democracy at the moment)...

If it doesn't get legislated, then I think they ought to change the wording of the guidance accordingly.

 

[Hadders]

Is it actually *illegal* to travel out of a tier 4 area? This doesn’t seem clear.

We need to see what the Statutory Instrument says when it is published which probably won't happen until very near to midnight.

 

[adc82140]

I'm buggered if I'm changing my plans. Chances of a police offer calling round are next to zero.

 

[Bikeman78]

Meanwhile at St Pancras, half the world seems to have turned up to get out of London before midnight...

https://twitter.com/HarrietClugston/status/1340383304143540227?s=20

And they are doing a set swap at Derby! Hopefully the replacement will be at least as big as the original.

 

[kristiang85]

I'm buggered if I'm changing my plans. Chances of a police offer calling round are next to zero.

I can't imagine members of the police force being too enthralled if they were given a call to come into work at short notice for Christmas to police people celebrating Christmas with their families.

 

[Darandio]

I can't imagine members of the police force being too enthralled if they were given a call to come into work at short notice for Christmas to police people celebrating Christmas with their families.

I'm not so sure about that. Given some of the behaviour seen on some forces of late i'd imagine many are rubbing their hands at the thought.

 

[Mag_seven]

I'm buggered if I'm changing my plans. Chances of a police offer calling round are next to zero.

Just call them and say you have been burgled, then you can guarantee they won't be round anytime soon.

 

[C J Snarzell]

It's been interesting watching the developments unfold in the last few days surrounding Andy Burnham and the Greater Manchester Police fiasco.

Over recent months I've watched Andy Burnham & Police Chief Ian Hopkins lie and bulls**t the public and yesterday Hopkins finally fell from grace, which has been a long time coming. I've known for years that GMP has been on a downward spiral and the yes men have continued to deceive both the frontline cops and the people of Greater Manchester.

It's perhaps not too disimillar with what the government are doing to the UK public with Covid. Boris Johnson, like Joe 90 Hopkins, is feeding the public half truths and the idea that he is doing things for the 'greater good' when behind the scenes there is a right thunderstorm brewing.

I suspect BJ has got himself into such a hole now he is unwilling or simply too arrogant to acknowledge he has made huge mistakes to the public.

CJ

 

[43096]

And they are doing a set swap at Derby! Hopefully the replacement will be at least as big as the original.

Being swapped for an HST (NL11 was planned).

 

[6862]

Ultimately we just need to get through the next 6-8 weeks

And then the next 6-8 weeks.

And then the next 6-8 weeks.

repeat ad infinitum

 

[Bikeman78]

Being swapped for an HST (NL11 was planned).

Every cloud has a silver lining!

 

[43096]

Every cloud has a silver lining!

They could have done with it from London!

 

[Bertie the bus]

They'll hope to sell more copies of the books they will no doubt write, and more after-dinner speaking engagements. Don't forget that some people get off on controlling others...

An alternative view is all of them made serious mistakes in spring and are overcompensating now by making equally serious mistakes but at the other end of the spectrum.

I don’t believe for a second any of them are evil or have malicious intentions but I do believe they are all completely out of their depth and are desperate to not go down in history as granny killers.

 

[SuspectUsual]

I can't imagine members of the police force being too enthralled if they were given a call to come into work at short notice for Christmas to police people celebrating Christmas with their families.

There seems to be a fair amount of evidence of some of the polis loving it, and at Xmas they’d be doing it on overtime rates as well

 

[Crossover]

What a massive superspreader event. Prepare Yorkshire for Tier 4

Even without that happening, my family are willing to place bets on us being in Tier 4 soon into the New Year

 

[westv]

Meanwhile at St Pancras, half the world seems to have turned up to get out of London before midnight...

https://twitter.com/HarrietClugston/status/1340383304143540227?s=20

Why St P? What about the other terminals?

 

[55002]

It's been interesting watching the developments unfold in the last few days surrounding Andy Burnham and the Greater Manchester Police fiasco.

Over recent months I've watched Andy Burnham & Police Chief Ian Hopkins lie and bulls**t the public and yesterday Hopkins finally fell from grace, which has been a long time coming. I've known for years that GMP has been on a downward spiral and the yes men have continued to deceive both the frontline cops and the people of Greater Manchester.

It's perhaps not too disimillar with what the government are doing to the UK public with Covid. Boris Johnson, like Joe 90 Hopkins, is feeding the public half truths and the idea that he is doing things for the 'greater good' when behind the scenes there is a right thunderstorm brewing.

I suspect BJ has got himself into such a hole now he is unwilling or simply too arrogant to acknowledge he has made huge mistakes to the public.

CJ

You’ve known for years you say, but so have the Tory party. Funnily enough, they don’t like Burnham, so have gone after his police guy. Similarly rumours about the mayor of Liverpool have been around for ages and all of a sudden he’s being questioned. You have to question the timing..it’s almost like the government need something to deflect people’s attention. Have no idea why.

 

[alex397]

I can’t take any more of this. If we had a competent government, from whatever colour, we wouldn’t be in such a mess. People would have trusted the government more and acted more sensibly earlier on. Sure, we probably would have still been in a bit of a mess like most countries, but not as much as this. And not promising us a Christmas, then completely going back on that just weeks afterwards.

This government has completely failed us in many ways, and I hope more people will get their heads out the sand and see this, but there seems to be a cult supporting it.

 

[bussnapperwm]

You’ve known for years you say, but so have the Tory party. Funnily enough, they don’t like Burnham, so have gone after his police guy. Similarly rumours about the mayor of Liverpool have been around for ages and all of a sudden he’s being questioned. You have to question the timing..it’s almost like the government need something to deflect people’s attention. Have no idea why.

At least we won't see the Tories going after the Midlands Mayor as he's one of the lads.

 

[DB]

Meanwhile at St Pancras, half the world seems to have turned up to get out of London before midnight...

https://twitter.com/HarrietClugston/status/1340383304143540227?s=20

Looking at the comments on there, loads of people who don't understand the difference betwene guidance and law, with claims that it's the 'law' that you can ony travel between tiers for essential reasons.

No it isn't - it's guidance!