Missing advance train, connecting from "free" ticket

[lj9090]

I've managed to grab myself some of the £5 ea/way tickets from EC for a trip from London to York. Just need to get to London!

I'm planning on using some of the SWT free gold card tickets to get me up there, but do these cover me for delays? So if the SWT service is late gettting into Waterloo and I miss the service out of Kings Cross am I covered as usual and would be allowed on the next train?

 

[DarloRich]

I don’t know the “official” answer but I have always approached a staff member and got their permission to board the next t train without any problems. I have never just boarded and tried to sort it out.

 

[SickyNicky]

The fact that a ticket was "free" doesn't exclude it from the National Rail Conditions of Carriage (NRCoC), so you would be entitled to combine the tickets to make one "journey" and thus be protected in such circumstances.

I've often considered this when using East Coast's free rewards tickets. To confirm that, members of this forum have experience of missing connections with such "free" tickets and being allowed on later trains (as in DarloRich's example above).

 

[yorkie]

I've managed to grab myself some of the £5 ea/way tickets from EC for a trip from London to York. Just need to get to London!

I'm planning on using some of the SWT free gold card tickets to get me up there, but do these cover me for delays? So if the SWT service is late gettting into Waterloo and I miss the service out of Kings Cross am I covered as usual and would be allowed on the next train?

NRCoC makes it very clear that you may use two or more tickets for one journey.

Advance tickets remain valid for your journey if you are delayed while travelling.

There is no minimum price for a ticket. Price does not determine validity (some people falsely claim that it does, but they should be ignored).

Providing you allow at least the minimum interchange time for Waterloo - King's Cross, and still miss it, you won't have any problems getting on the next train, I'm sure.

If you are delayed into Waterloo, alight at the front* of the train, and head for the Bakerloo Line. Change at Oxford Circus for the Victoria Line, and exit from the 4th car.

(* If you are travelling at a time when the direct peak hour entrance from the mainline platforms to the LU station is open, that would be quicker, I am unsure exactly where the best alighting position for the underpass is, perhaps the 4th car-ish?)

 

[cuccir]

Are you planning on using Oyster to get you from Waterloo to Kings Cross? Or does/can the free ticket cover your origin to Kings Cross?

Unless I'm mistaken, while you'd be covered for any delays on your journey into London, you wouldn't be covered for any delays on the tube unless you're using a railway-issued ticket.

 

[lj9090]

Are you planning on using Oyster to get you from Waterloo to Kings Cross? Or does/can the free ticket cover your origin to Kings Cross?

Unless I'm mistaken, while you'd be covered for any delays on your journey into London, you wouldn't be covered for any delays on the tube unless you're using a railway-issued ticket.

Yes, I will be oystering. I've got an 18.23 arrival in Waterloo and then the 19.30 out of King Cross, so I'm not too worried about the tube. I've done this before a couple of times in 25 minutes, there's plenty of options, and if all lines are down I'll just grab a boris bike. The only time the connection would be tight would be if SWT was delayed, which would cover me anyway.

Thanks all, was mainly trying to work out if I need to get a £10 advance to cover me, but it's gone up since yesterday to £14.70 so I'll just use one of the free ones as it looks like I'm ok for delays on that anyway.

 

[yorkie]

Are you planning on using Oyster to get you from Waterloo to Kings Cross? Or does/can the free ticket cover your origin to Kings Cross?

Unless I'm mistaken, while you'd be covered for any delays on your journey into London

I agree, but...

...you wouldn't be covered for any delays on the tube unless you're using a railway-issued ticket.

I disagree with that interpretation, however I do agree that it is open to interpretation, so is ideally best avoided.

I would agree that if you commence your journey by a mode other than National Rail (e.g. LU) and do not use a National Rail ticket inclusive of the additional portion of the journey then you are not covered, although even in those circumstances "discretion" may be shown.

 

[Tetchytyke]

I disagree with that interpretation, however I do agree that it is open to interpretation, so is ideally best avoided.

I would agree that if you commence your journey by a mode other than National Rail (e.g. LU) and do not use a National Rail ticket inclusive of the additional portion of the journey then you are not covered, although even in those circumstances "discretion" may be shown.

The Manual says that "tickets that cannot be read on-train (e.g. smartcards)" do not allow you to travel on a different train in the event of a delay. The caveat is "allowable where electronically checked, delay verified and Advance ticket endorsed in Travel Centres".

It specifically says that you can combine two advance tickets with a tube ticket: "combination of rail only tickets, e.g. Advance ticket Bristol-Paddington plus tube single ticket plus Advance ticket Kings Cross to Hull." However Oyster is a smartcard that usually can't be read on board (I don't think EC staff have Oyster readers, anyway).

This also gives us another reason to avoid The Key like the plague...

 

[Haywain]

The Manual says that "tickets that cannot be read on-train (e.g. smartcards)" do not allow you to travel on a different train in the event of a delay. The caveat is "allowable where electronically checked, delay verified and Advance ticket endorsed in Travel Centres".
It specifically says that you can combine two advance tickets with a tube ticket: "combination of rail only tickets, e.g. Advance ticket Bristol-Paddington plus tube single ticket plus Advance ticket Kings Cross to Hull." However Oyster is a smartcard that usually can't be read on board (I don't think EC staff have Oyster readers, anyway).

East Coast staff have Oyster readers in Kings Cross Travel Centre. I've seen them in use.

 

[yorkie]

The Manual says that "tickets that cannot be read on-train (e.g. smartcards)" do not allow you to travel on a different train in the event of a delay. The caveat is "allowable where electronically checked, delay verified and Advance ticket endorsed in Travel Centres".

It specifically says that you can combine two advance tickets with a tube ticket: "combination of rail only tickets, e.g. Advance ticket Bristol-Paddington plus tube single ticket plus Advance ticket Kings Cross to Hull." However Oyster is a smartcard that usually can't be read on board (I don't think EC staff have Oyster readers, anyway).

The tickets combine at London Terminals, so it's a valid combination of tickets, in the same way that tickets could combine at Bradford Stns.

The only difference is that for most cross-London transfers, the transfer time assumes travel via LU. In some cases it is viable to walk, though not for others. As travel times assume travel via LU, I believe the Advance FAQ is merely clarifying that the cost of an LU transfer is additional to the tickets to/from London Terminals. In practice, if there were delays on LU, I do not believe that anyone paying for the LU transfer by Oyster PAYG will be penalised, likewise anyone who bought a paper ticket which was swallowed by the barrier (EC passengers would not be used to tickets being swallowed!) would, I am sure, not be penalised either.