Merseyrail

[RMTGuard]

Hi guys,

Just wondering for the people who use the Merseyrail network how you think it could be improved?

How can your journey be made more enjoyable?

What changes would you suggest?

Any information appreciated.

RMT Guard

 

[Ivo]

Hi guys,

Just wondering for the people who use the Merseyrail network how you think it could be improved?

How can your journey be made more enjoyable?

What changes would you suggest?

Any information appreciated.

RMT Guard

I'm not exactly the most frequent Mersey traveller, but I believe that the Southport route could do with more than twelve carriages an hour. Is there any provision for a ten-minute service between Southport and Hunts Cross, with the timings of the Ormskirk and Kirkby routes changed to run either two before or three after a Southport service [i.e. 00 08 10 13 20 23 28]?

Otherwise, the system is pretty efficient. Regarding Ellesmere Port though, I don't know the current situation but it should maintain peak services to Liverpool, if not necessarily through off-peak or weekend services.

 

[ChrisTheRef]

No idea how realistic, but they were toying with the idea of a shuttle service from South Parkway to Central.

Maybe leaving at 07, 22, 37 and 52 and running non stop.

Not sure if the platforms at Central could take it...

 

[Ivo]

No idea how realistic, but they were toying with the idea of a shuttle service from South Parkway to Central.

Maybe leaving at 07, 22, 37 and 52 and running non stop.

Not sure if the platforms at Central could take it...

Well then, why not make these the Southport services, and extend the Kirkby services to Hunts Cross?

 

[ukrob]

No idea how realistic, but they were toying with the idea of a shuttle service from South Parkway to Central.

Maybe leaving at 07, 22, 37 and 52 and running non stop.

When and why?

 

[ChrisTheRef]

When [stn]LPY[/stn] was built. The idea being it would shuttle people between the airport and the city centre.

 

[herdster]

I alaways wonder why Merseyrail don't let you buy tickets on the train , I think it would make life easier for customers on the odd occassion they may need to buy a ticket on the train and may even help revenue protection .

Herdster

 

[ChrisTheRef]

Because Merseyrail are money grabbing *insert expletives here* who would rather issue a £20 penalty fare instead of a £3.50 ticket

 

[northwichcat]

15 minute frequency to Chester with some of the lesser used stations not being served by every train to get faster journey times between Chester and Liverpool but not to reduce frequncies at intermediate stations.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

I alaways wonder why Merseyrail don't let you buy tickets on the train , I think it would make life easier for customers on the odd occassion they may need to buy a ticket on the train and may even help revenue protection .

If the ticket machines at the likes of Capenhurst don't let you buy a ticket to any destination then you should be able to excess on the train e.g. pay the difference between a Capenhurst to Chester ticket and a Capenhurst to Sheffield ticket.

One woman who boarded at Hunts Cross without a ticket says she didn't have time to buy one. Considering the frequency is every 15 minutes I don't think that excuse goes down well.

 

[RMTGuard]

15 minute service to chester should be implemented very soon.

The reason guards do not sell tickets on board is because we have a penalty fare system.

It would not be consistant if we sold tickets AND had penalty fares.

For example you could get on one morning at station A and the guard would sell you a ticket. The next day you could get on the train at station A and meet a penalty fare officer who would penalty fare you.

You would feel wronged.

 

[First class]

15 minute service to chester should be implemented very soon.

The reason guards do not sell tickets on board is because we have a penalty fare system.

It would not be consistant if we sold tickets AND had penalty fares.

For example you could get on one morning at station A and the guard would sell you a ticket. The next day you could get on the train at station A and meet a penalty fare officer who would penalty fare you.

You would feel wronged.

Well perhaps that is where the future of the guards should be heading then- issuing Penalty Fares, giving them full retail training. That way guards can be more effectively monitored to whether they are actually leaving the cab or not. As for the reason guards don't sell tickets- I don't believe it is anything to do with Penalty Fares, other TOCs manage to have commercial guards in PF areas. I personally believe it was to reduce training time and costs as well as remove cashing up time etc from dockets. Merseyrail has left the guard powerless to do anything to someone without a ticket other than 'ask' them to get off. If they don't, they can't hold the train, so they travel for free and usually without a PF! Nonetheless, a guard is still important to have on a train, but only if they are actively patrolling. Guards should not have access to the rear cab other than to store their kit bags or in limited circumstances, (e.g. fault, overcrowding, emergency etc).

There are endless lists of things that need improving at Merseyrail, but I'll try and list a few of the more important.

1) Better CIS boards installed, (with scrolling calling points).
2) A complete overhaul of the on-board annoucements (automated). The annoucements are far too frequent, annoying and repetitive. Customers switch off to them.
3) There should be permanent train dispatch staff at (Northern Line) Liverpool Central (all times) and Moorfields (peaks). This would reduce delays to customers trying to get on at the last minute and should reduce dwell times improving PPM scores. I would also argue that the guards cannot always see right down the platforms and are hazarding a guess most of the time that it is safe to close the doors. Staff regularly start putting wheelchairs on, only for the hustle alarm to start sounding and frantic hand danger-stop signals being given.
4) There should be proper train announcements for all trains arriving/departing at the busier stations, mainly Liverpool Central. Most other stations in the UK have automated systems that announce trains, their platform and calling points. At the moment this is only done in times of disruption/late platform changes, but certainly should be getting done regularly.
5) General retail training needs improving vastly. This should include a PROPER course on ticket recognition, (needs at least 5 days training), Station Assistants, retailers, ticket inspectors and guards ALL need this.

more to come...

 

[nedchester]

Personally I think Merseyrail offer a really good service. Their staff are polite and well dressed, the trains are clean and usually reliable.

This is much better than 5 or 6 years ago.

I use Merseyrail to go to work a couple of times a week using my bike. Not many TOCs allow you to use your bike at peak times so thumbs up to them for that.

The ability to buy tickets to any destination at my local station (Capenhurst) has made things easier although I perhaps would like to be able to buy the full range of tickets (rovers, rangers etc)

 

[CarterUSM]

Guards should not have access to cabs?!! Where else shall we locate the emergency brake? Or an area to store any goods or parcels? As for monitoring, what do you have in mind? CCTV? Or Spot checks by management?

 

[ChrisTheRef]

I echo the dispatch concerns!

At times, I've stood at the bottom of the escalators, directing people to the right train when the CIS boards crashed...

 

[Pumbaa]

Top points there as usual Ste, I personally enjoy using ME and do so very frequently. I agree with Central, its a nightmare sometimes when dispatch stops. Goes belly up, and announcements would go down well.

The only other thing I'd say is for ME to get their fingers out and order new stock while the relatively cheap opportunity is staring them in the face. It may be prohibitive to try and order new 378s once the production line has closed.

 

[First class]

Guards should not have access to cabs?!! Where else shall we locate the emergency brake? Or an area to store any goods or parcels? As for monitoring, what do you have in mind? CCTV? Or Spot checks by management?

My post clearly mentioned limited circumstances in which they would be allowed in, overcrowding, emergency and to store their kit were just some of the circumstances listed.

What reason do guards have to remain in the cab, other than during a problem?

As for monitoring, GSMs getting out a bit more doing spot checks or acting upon customer complaints/comments should be sufficient.

 

[Pumbaa]

To this end, as first class lists, LOROL guards are explicitly told not to use their cabs, and are to remain in the train at all times. Good thing too, a visible presence is nicer.

 

[ukrob]

Guards should not have access to cabs?!! Where else shall we locate the emergency brake? Or an area to store any goods or parcels? As for monitoring, what do you have in mind? CCTV? Or Spot checks by management?

It was VERY clearly stated that the guard would still have access to the cab.

Are you a guard who is extremely lazy and hates people?

 

[CarterUSM]

No, but I don't need management or the public telling me how to carry out my duties either.

 

[First class]

No, but I don't need management or the public telling me how to carry out my duties either.

So how do you continually improve the service you provide if you only do what YOU think is right. That's a very dangerous and selfish attitude.

 

[CarterUSM]

You also listen to the workforce. Something many TOC's only pay lip service to. There is too many chiefs trying to justify their shaky positions.

 

[Bellwater]

My post clearly mentioned limited circumstances in which they would be allowed in, overcrowding, emergency and to store their kit were just some of the circumstances listed.

What reason do guards have to remain in the cab, other than during a problem?

As for monitoring, GSMs getting out a bit more doing spot checks or acting upon customer complaints/comments should be sufficient.

Got to love these ex-CO1/2s when they get a bit of power.

Anyway, there's numerous reasons... an extra pair of eyes for what happens on the lineside, Contacting the Driver or Signaller if something happens there and so on.

I've had a manager say to me once i've carried out my duties the company expect me to do, i can go and sit in the cab.

 

[ukrob]

Got to love these ex-CO1/2s when they get a bit of power.

Anyway, there's numerous reasons... an extra pair of eyes for what happens on the lineside, Contacting the Driver or Signaller if something happens there and so on.

I've had a manager say to me once i've carried out my duties the company expect me to do, i can go and sit in the cab.

Which of course totally contradicts what other TOCs tell their staff to do. There is no 'right and wrong'.

 

[Bellwater]

You have issues with Guards sitting in Rear/Middle Cabs though.

 

[ukrob]

You have issues with Guards sitting in Rear/Middle Cabs though.

Do I? News to me. Could you show me where I have suggested that?

Or was it a fact stating that 'there are issues with guards sitting in middle/rear cabs'?

 

[Bellwater]

It was VERY clearly stated that the guard would still have access to the cab.

Are you a guard who is extremely lazy and hates people?

^^^^^

 

[ukrob]

^^^^^

That doesn't 'suggest' anything.

It was correcting somebody who (probably deliberately) misread something and was being very defensive.

Cheers for telling me what my view is though, I need not state opinions anymore, it is a waste of typing if others decide what my opinion is for me.

Anyway, I'm sure this thread was about Merseyrail - and my view on Merseyrail is that the guards should be in the train if at all possible - exactly as they are now (if you have a problem with that, let them know). I don't think they should unit-hop from the rear unit though (apart from stations very close together) - it doesn't bother me personally, but a lot of people prefer a member of staff accessible to them.

 

[Chapeltom]

I used the Merseyrail network in January when travelling from Chester to Liverpool on a Cheshire Day Ranger. I enjoyed the experience, a good service and I prefer a system of buying tickets before you get on like the Manchester Metrolink. I think twice about not buying a ticket with a penalty fare system in place.

 

[First class]

Other things which I dislike about Merseyrail/need improving upon:

1) It's advertising is starting to become tacky. Merseyrail branded posters offering two bottles of cheap tango for £1.50 plastered all over the "flagship" Liverpool Central makes the place look like one big advert for crap nobody actually even wants to buy. MtoGo is NOT a concept that "flows" well, particularly at large stations. Someone in a rush for a train has to wait behind 5 people who are just wanting a packet of fags/crisps/drink etc... The "experience" is frustrating, for both staff and customers.

2) The fares structure for the network needs tidying up. Things a bit more useful to the customers could be printed on the tickets, e.g. Southport-Kirkby currently shows a route as 'Any Permitted'. AFAIK, this ticket is not valid via Liverpool Central. However, hundreds of people do this journey each day thinking they can double back. A route of 'Not Liverpool' would sort this out. Equally, Chester-Southport (valid via Manchester on Sundays), is only valid that way on a technicality, and clearly was never intended to be valid that way- that could be fixed by printing route "Birkenhead". I suppose this could be said for a lot of TOCs that tickets need overhauling. If Merseyrail is so inclined to 'provide the best customer experience' they should take the lead.

---other little petty thing that bug me:

3) No bins on the Underground stations or trains. I've not found any documentation to prohibit bins on these stations. TRANSEC Security policy shouldn't prevent it, and I can't find anything in the sub-surface fire regulations. People (staff, managers) will quite happily tell you that bins aren't allowed because of terrorism/fire, where does it say that??!

The sad thing is, RMT Guard, is that I have given these ideas to management in the past. Nobody is interested, hence when there is an accident, I will be writing to the investigators informing them that I had raised concerns previously about the lack of train dispatch during busy periods.

 

[tony_mac]

Southport to Kirkby is certainly valid via Liverpool Central as part of the Liverpool Group. I think a lot of people would prefer waiting at Central to Sandhills at night.

The fares and routeings are a bit of a mess in places; Southport to Chester via Liverpool is £4.40 CDR, Huyton to Chester is £7.30 - or valid on a £4.50 Saveaway.
Southport to Chester is perfectly sensible via Warrington; although it is much cheaper than Warrington to Chester.
I think some of this is down to calling the 'city line' Merseyrail, when it is treated quite differently to the rest of the Merseyrail network.

As far as I remember, the bins on the underground were taken out of action after the Warrington bombings, I don't suppose there has been a good enough reason to re-instate them.