Merseyrail reveals refub interiors

[michael74]

Not sure if this has already been done, had a look, can't see it...

http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/news...yrail-reveals-new-look-seating-trains-8635124

 

[Bletchleyite]

Not sure if this has already been done, had a look, can't see it...

http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/news...yrail-reveals-new-look-seating-trains-8635124

More of a refresh than a refurb - they're the same seats. Looks nice though - back to the old days with the yellow panels. I guess the idea is that the brighter colours show the muck less.

Not sure about the orange stripe on the doors, looks odd!

Neil

 

[fowler9]

I'd let them use whatever colours they want if they'd turn the heating down. I believe it isn't possible.

 

[Bantamzen]

Not entirely on-topic, but I love what one commenter on that article has to say:

Oh I'm sure this will help cut down the amount of time myself and other motorists wait at the level crossings in Waterloo waiting upto 15mins for two or three trains to pass!

Erm.......

I'm not entirely sure how he wants that answering!!

 

[Y Ddraig Coch]

I wish they would just change the seats, they must be the most uncomfortable seats anywhere on the network. (A new thread altogether maybe)

The low back seats on the pacers have more comfort in my opinion.

When not in a great hurry I have sometimes travelled from North Wales to Liverpool via Warrington just to avoid the joys of Merseyrail.

 

[michael74]

I still miss the soft springy horse hair seats of the 503 and agreed its not a comfy ride on those seats especially if your going from Moorfields to Southport. But my main gripe has always been the heating on the 508, its either equivalent temperatures to Pluto or Mercury (usually in the opposite seasons).

 

[martynbristow]

He says that it will take a week at Birkenhead North, but the the previous sentence he says it's being done at a purpose built factory in Kirkdale :/

 

[Bletchleyite]

He says that it will take a week at Birkenhead North, but the the previous sentence he says it's being done at a purpose built factory in Kirkdale :/

Perhaps both depots are doing it.

Neil
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

I wish they would just change the seats, they must be the most uncomfortable seats anywhere on the network.

You've not been on East Coast then.

In all seriousness, I don't see a problem with them - they're the fairly standard metal-backed ones like those used on Desiros and the likes. And they are 2+2.

Neil

 

[northwichcat]

In all seriousness, I don't see a problem with them - they're the fairly standard metal-backed ones like those used on Desiros and the likes. And they are 2+2.

A Desiro seat is more comfortable than a 507/8 seat and the Desiro's aren't exactly known for comfortable seating. Desiro seats also seem to get more comfortable once they've had people sitting on them for a few months while the 507/8 seats don't.

 

[Bletchleyite]

A Desiro seat is more comfortable than a 507/8 seat and the Desiro's aren't exactly known for comfortable seating.

Matter of opinion I guess. I've found the new Merseyrail seats fine. I also find 350/1, 3 and 4 seats very comfortable. (350/2 ones are too narrow as 3+2).

Desiro seats also seem to get more comfortable once they've had people sitting on them for a few months while the 507/8 seats don't.

Haven't really noticed that - they do get softer, though.

Neil

 

[northwichcat]

Matter of opinion I guess. I've found the new Merseyrail seats fine. I also find 350/1, 3 and 4 seats very comfortable. (350/2 ones are too narrow as 3+2).

What sort of journeys have you done on Merseyrail? They're OK for a short hop but not good for Chester/Ellesmere Port/Southport to Liverpool and in my opinion not really acceptable for Chester/Ellesmere Port to Southport and Merseyrail is the fastest option for such a journey.

 

[Bletchleyite]

What sort of journeys have you done on Merseyrail?

Ormskirk (Aughton Park specifically) to Liverpool, and sometimes on to Chester etc. It's my old patch. I genuinely find them fine - the old 3+2 ones were rather basic, but the new 2+2 ones I find to be to IC standard except for the lack of armrests.

Neil

 

[northwichcat]

but the new 2+2 ones I find to be to IC standard except for the lack of armrests.

A couple of mm of padding makes the IC standard?! The Pendolinos must have around 5 times more padding and yet some people complain about those not having as much padding as old IC trains. Are you sure you don't mean S-Bahn standard?

 

[Y Ddraig Coch]

Ormskirk (Aughton Park specifically) to Liverpool, and sometimes on to Chester etc. It's my old patch. I genuinely find them fine - the old 3+2 ones were rather basic, but the new 2+2 ones I find to be to IC standard except for the lack of armrests.

Neil

IC std? Really? They are much narrower, horribly shaped for your back and very little padding and the silly little space between seats which seems to have no purpose and could be used for wider seats is perfect for people to put their feet on, almost encouraging, then the feet police are round dishing out fines!!

I have had enough after 16 stops and 45 minutes between Chester-Liverpool long distance on them would be truly unbearable.

I truly dislike most things merseyrail, the PIS announcing every stop before arriving and leaving each station which are never more than about 3/4 minutes apart.

The noisy old bell for start signalling every couple of minutes, the extremely loud PA if the guard makes an announcement.

The extreme temperatures which has been mentioned previously.

There just doesn't seem to be anything comfortable or pleasurable about traveling merseyrail, just a necessary evil.

Rant over

 

[Bletchleyite]

A couple of mm of padding makes the IC standard?! The Pendolinos must have around 5 times more padding and yet some people complain about those not having as much padding as old IC trains. Are you sure you don't mean S-Bahn standard?

There's more than a couple of millimetres of padding, they seem similar as I say to the Desiro seats, and I find that the Class 444 is near enough the perfect UK InterCity unit.

Neil

 

[northwichcat]

There's more than a couple of millimetres of padding, they seem similar as I say to the Desiro seats, and I find that the Class 444 is near enough the perfect UK InterCity unit.

If you look at these photos there's quite obviously less padding on the 507/8 seats than the 455s seat. The 455s are used on equivalent routes to the 507/8s while the 444s (with much thicker seats) are used on longer distance services.

507/8 seats: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Britis..._507_Merseyrail_train_(507026)_-_DSCF1117.JPG
455 seats: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Britis...wer/File:455732_D_M_Cl_508_TSO_Interior_1.JPG

 

[Bletchleyite]

There is little difference in any significant sense, IMO. But that said, personal preference is key here - I like relatively firm seating, and indeed a fairly hard orthopaedic-type bed. Others like plush armchairs and deep-sprung mattresses, I can barely get comfortable enough to sleep on the latter. You won't please everyone.

Neil

 

[507 001]

I find the seats perfectly reasonable, and I used to use them regularly between Lime Street and Chester before anybody asks.

I also don't find the PA system intrusive, in fact I think its one of the best PA systems I've heard.

I've also never found the heating to be too much of a problem, I agree that it can be Warm in the summer but its certainly not as bad as the deep level tube lines for example.

 

[baldyman26]

I think Merseyrail clearly are nowhere near announcing the fleet replacement to spend this much money (ok small amounts in the grand scheme of things but still significant).

The trains we have are brilliant for their age, we do have a system for all it's failings that is extremely reliable, and credit has to go to the staff. I work in the commercial vehicle trade, and sadly a commercial vehicle has now gone from being a workhorse to a thing of comfort. All these add ons for the driver basically create so many mechanical issues it truly is shocking, and I certainly long for the days when a van used to be a van.. The 507 / 508 are probably pretty basic compared to all the newer trains, but 9 time out of 10 when I want to use the train, they turn up.

 

[northwichcat]

There is little difference in any significant sense, IMO. But that said, personal preference is key here - I like relatively firm seating, and indeed a fairly hard orthopaedic-type bed. Others like plush armchairs and deep-sprung mattresses, I can barely get comfortable enough to sleep on the latter. You won't please everyone.

If you'd they're similar to Desiro seats but firmer I would have accepted that.

However, you were claiming they are practically Intercity standard. The 507/8 seats aren't in any way like that. They are exactly the same seats as on the Southern 455s (with 3+2 seating), they aren't even wider than the seats on the Southern 455s - they've just left a generous space between the seats and between the window and seats (but no armrests unlike any proper Regional or Intercity train.)

I have a mattress described as "medium firm" but a mattress is completely different to a seat as you're not resting the majority of your body weight on one part of your body like you are when you sit down.

Being personal preference isn't something I agree with as people with certain medical conditions get told to avoid certain type of seating. Sitting on hard seats if you have haemorrhoids can cause internal and external bleeding.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Being personal preference isn't something I agree with as people with certain medical conditions get told to avoid certain type of seating. Sitting on hard seats if you have haemorrhoids can cause internal and external bleeding.

But people with back problems are better on firm, supportive seating. Other than providing both...

Neil

 

[Camden]

Just off for my third Merseyrail journey of the day, and I can confirm my lumbar is intact (and no I haven't needed a cushion). I can update after my fourth and final journey when I've boarded my train to Euston, to confirm the results of my stress test.

 

[northwichcat]

But people with back problems are better on firm, supportive seating. Other than providing both...

Or just provide class 170 style seating which wouldn't cause major issues for anyone opposed to choosing between firm Merseyrail seats and soft original class 158 seats.

 

[Wolfie]

Or just provide class 170 style seating which wouldn't cause major issues for anyone opposed to choosing between firm Merseyrail seats and soft original class 158 seats.

I am far from keen on Class 170 seating personally! The problem is that people keep assuming that their own personal preferences are objectively correct as opposed to completely subjective! (not a dig at you jc, a general comment)

 

[northwichcat]

I am far from keen on Class 170 seating personally!

I'm actually saying it's more of a compromise. It's not the very hard seating some people will dislike but at the same time it's not the type of seating that's very soft.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Or just provide class 170 style seating which wouldn't cause major issues for anyone opposed to choosing between firm Merseyrail seats and soft original class 158 seats.

It'd be nice for all trains to have high backed full IC seats with headrest wings and armrests (personally I'd like everything to have the seats found on the fGW HSTs, but I know I'm perhaps unusual in liking those). But it really isn't necessary on a city S-Bahn.

Neil

 

[mcnw35282]

He says that it will take a week at Birkenhead North, but the the previous sentence he says it's being done at a purpose built factory in Kirkdale :/

I think they meant the external refresh was done at Birkenhead while the internal refresh is being done at Kirkdale

 

[fowler9]

Well just to repeat myself if they turned the heating down I'd be quite happy using them on short journies, they do a brilliant job on an almost metro type service. However I work with several people who commute on them every day from Southport to South Parkway. I'd be looking for another job. ha ha. They really aren't inter city standard though, unless your experience of inter city is very different from mine over the years. I've been on comfier trains in Poland and Peru than I have on recent inter city journies in the UK.

 

[M60lad]

I think one of the main problems with the Merseyrail Units is that the windows on them have been blocked from opening fully like what they used to so not enough ventilation is passing through the train anymore.

 

[Camden]

I think one of the main problems with the Merseyrail Units is that the windows on them have been blocked from opening fully like what they used to so not enough ventilation is passing through the train anymore.

I doubt the windows have ever opened any more than they do already, else people would get head injuries. The windows are bog standard hopper windows and open as much as any window I've ever seen on a unit (bar the slide open type of days long gone by).

I think the cause of heat is more likely to be heating turned on high (probably first thing) and left on, or left on too long, combined with periods of underground running where you can have all the windows you like open but it won't help to cool the train down. This would also explain why on some trains on the same day the ambient temperature is acceptable, and on others it is not. It's 1970s technology in use on trains in 2015.