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I went for a short ride today. Very impressed. Lots of airline seats which I prefer. Lots of knee room. Nice height - much higher than the class 319 I went into Liverpool on. Firm but not uncomfortable.
The exit to platform are much better than on the 331s. On my trip from Liverpool Central the on-train announcements were for the return trip.
What's the width like? They're claimed to be wider than the 507 seats but without dividers. Do you get pushed against the wall, and if so is the window of a height where your shoulders can use the window space to be comfortable and your arm rest on the sill?
What's the width like? They're claimed to be wider than the 507 seats but without dividers. Do you get pushed against the wall, and if so is the window of a height where your shoulders can use the window space to be comfortable and your arm rest on the sill?
It does worry me how Merseyrail don't mention that. I sort of understand as why would they mention possible negatives? But at the same time, it's not what they say that's important, it's what they don't say.
What's the width like? They're claimed to be wider than the 507 seats but without dividers. Do you get pushed against the wall, and if so is the window of a height where your shoulders can use the window space to be comfortable and your arm rest on the sill?
I had a seat to myself so I didn't notice a problem with the width, but there was four inches of space between my knees and the back of the seat in front.
I had a seat to myself so I didn't notice a problem with the width, but there was four inches of space between my knees and the back of the seat in front.
Obviously depends on your upper leg length (this is the main factor affecting legroom, not necessarily height) but I wonder if that was a priority seat. There was plenty of space in those.
Personally I found the 777 seats to be the worst seats on the national network at present, which is saying a lot considering how bad the ones fitted to the 80x fleet are!
Personally I found the 777 seats to be the worst seats on the national network at present, which is saying a lot considering how bad the ones fitted to the 80x fleet are!
I would be inclined to agree. As ever, if you try to be clever, you generally fail. Even that seat would have been better without the protruding headrests designed for people of a very specific height.
For a 30 minute journey (typically) the Sophia would have been more than fine. That's what it's designed for, after all.
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I didn't sit in the tip-ups but they do have more constraints. They are however a stupid idea - tip-up seats create passenger conflict and should not be used anywhere. Their purpose is to massage figures on capacity. If the units should have a pram and luggage area, it should just be a pram and luggage area without tip-ups.
It wasn't the base I disliked, though, I'm fine with hard seat bases. It was the stupid shape of the back and headrest, which if tall curves your spine forwards unless you slouch. Totally the wrong shape.
I complained about the protruding headrests when I viewed the mock-up, it seems they have bodged the issue by thickening the cushion which is no better, rather than actually changing the headrest shape.
I suppose the perception of comfort/discomfort, with these seats at least, depends on whether your body shape and size fits the template. I must be the ideal size because on my (so far only two) trips, in uncrowded trains, I felt perfectly comfortable.
I was initially sceptical about the 'airline' seating (I don't know why it's called that because you don't often have backward facing seats on planes), having got used to the four-seat bays, but they seem to work ok. I wonder if they thought about a mixture of longitudinal and four-seat groups like the Metropolitan line?
I suppose the perception of comfort/discomfort, with these seats at least, depends on whether your body shape and size fits the template. I must be the ideal size because on my (so far only two) trips, in uncrowded trains, I felt perfectly comfortable.
I was initially sceptical about the 'airline' seating (I don't know why it's called that because you don't often have backward facing seats on planes), having got used to the four-seat bays, but they seem to work ok. I wonder if they thought about a mixture of longitudinal and four-seat groups like the Metropolitan line?
I recall visiting the mock up on show at Pacific Road Birkenhead with Merseytravel staff present for feedback, plenty of people complaining about the rock solid seats, clearly doesn't matter!
At the end of the day, a subjective issue such as seat comfort will never create agreement.
For what it's worth, I couldn't care less about it. It doesn't even register on my consciousness and I am fairly certain that nobody could ever convince me otherwise. I genuinely don't care about it - and I'm not saying that in an antagonistic way - some people genuinely do not perceive things in the same way as others. I respect other people don't feel like I do and of course we just have to accept subjective opinions.
There will never be a one size fits all. The 507/508s did not please everyone. For what they are used for, both the 507/508s and 777s generally have benefits that outweigh the shortcomings, for very different reasons.
There will never be a one size fits all. The 507/508s did not please everyone. For what they are used for, both the 507/508s and 777s generally have benefits that outweigh the shortcomings, for very different reasons.
The 507/508, in their current guise at least, don't seem to have as many complaints. For one thing, I've not seen anyone say the 777s seats are better than the old ones, just that they find them OK. Makes you wonder why they didn't just try to copy the old seats as best they could.
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