Medloc trains post WW2

[vidal]

Not something I had ever heard of, and there's not a massive amount around on the interweb so it's time that thinking caps were put on!

My grandfather was released from active duty post WW2 after service in Italy. He was to proceed from Mestre to Milan and by train and then via MEDLOC (Middle East Direct Line of Communication) back to the UK.
James

I'm going to be in Milan in August, it would be nice to see where he had been - I'm assuming it would be Centrale Station?

 

[John Webb]

Was 'MEDLOC' a plane or train journey? Thinking of the battering the railways in France and elsewhere had received in the previous year makes me think there was probably a regular schedule of planes UK-Med-Middle East and return. And Milan has an airport nearby?

 

[Gloster]

MEDLOC was a through service for military personnel from Italy to Calais: it was used both for leave and postings. There was an interest sudden increase in interest around twenty or thirty years ago, but it seems to have died away, like those who used it. It was always less well-known than anything related to events in northern Europe. There were repatriation flights of POWs and others in the immediate aftermath of VE-Day, but these seem to have dropped off once the urgent cases has been dealt with.

 

[stuving]

This page about wartime trains includes details of Medloc services (I have no idea how accurate it is). Of Medloc B it says:

Medloc B:
From July 1945 Milan - Simplon - Calais, up to 4 trains daily, in 1946 stopped. Green, brown/beige or silver FS cars, 1 CIWL train, 2 SBB trains, 1 hospital train.

In The National Archives Medloc appears with this description:

Operation "Medloc" (establishment of an overland rail route across France from the English Channel to the Mediterranean

 

[Beebman]

This page about wartime trains includes details of Medloc services (I have no idea how accurate it is). Of Medloc B it says:

The page includes a photo of what looks like an LMS Period II coach with German-language lettering?

 

[John Webb]

Thanks for the clarifications.

 

[StephenHunter]

What was a PYTHON in this context? I'm only familiar with that as a Cold War codename for "get the ministers into the bunkers".

 

[Gloster]

MEDLOC (Mediterranean Line of Communication) trains started on 25 July 1945 with a Milan-Calais service via Switzerland: this was known as MEDLOC B, possibility later B1. A Toulon-Dieppe (MEDLOC A) and a Milan-Dieppe (MEDLOC B2) started on 1 August. On 12 August a second Milan-Calais (MEDLOC B1) started. From 9 October a third MEDLOC B started to carry passengers that were bussed from Villach, with a fourth on 15 November. There were feeder services from various parts of Italy and 3,800 troops a day could be moved. On 15 December the B were cut to three as the passengers from Villach now had their own direct train to Calais (MEDLOC C). On 1 February 1946 B was cut to two trains, and both A and B ceased later in the year, but C lasted until 1955.

GWR, LMS and LNER coaches went to the Continent, but they don’t seem to have been used much, if at all, on MEDLOC B. They were used on Ambulance trains, MEDLOC C and trains to Germany.

It looks as though the trains through Switzerland were for unarmed personnel going on returning from leave. It appears that they weren’t used for postings.

Source: The McNaughton Report, British Military Passenger Train Working in Europe 1945-1961; Lt. Col. I.K.A McNaughton; World War Two Railway Study Group; 2009.

 

[stuving]

What was a PYTHON in this context? I'm only familiar with that as a Cold War codename for "get the ministers into the bunkers".

Initially, Python was a scheme for giving home leave to long-term servicemen (i.e not wartime conscripts) serving abroad. Hence on that form it's a distinct reason for travel (not duty, leave, or release). A lot of them had had their overseas service extended, and under wartime conditions might never get a short visit back home. Python could get them an air passage each way.

Obviously they were limited in number, and highly desirable, so became something of an obsession for those who were eligible. But the rules kept changing, adding to the level of argument and resentment about fairness etc. Since eligibility was set as so many years abroad, it became possible for conscripts and wartime volunteers to qualify.

After the war ended, many on Python home leave were in fact demobilised rather than returned to their units. The term started to be used more loosely, including for anyone being demobilised. It crops up in my Dad's letters home from India, and he was a conscript.

He was flown home in 1946, by Dakota (a trip of many short hops). I asked him if he got an air rather than sea passage due to being medically unfit for service, but he said it was just the luck of the draw - so many had to get home that all means available were used to full capacity. I'm sure much the same applied to Italy (with the addition of rail and possibly road).

 

[Gloster]

What was a PYTHON in this context? I'm only familiar with that as a Cold War codename for "get the ministers into the bunkers".

It seems to have been a system that organised priority for return of troops who had been serving overseas for leave and, presumably for non-regulars, demob. There was a points system based on length of service and length of time abroad, with other factors, such as medals and children under 18 also taken into account.

There was also LILOP, Leave in Lieu of Python, for regulars who volunteered to go abroad again, and LIAP, which was Leave in Addition to Python. Time abroad to qualify for Python seems to have varied, being less in the Far East.

 

[vidal]

Thanks for all the informative replies. I'm heading to Milan this August for a few days, a trip from Centrale to Lugarno is on the cards for a day trip.

Does anyone now what the potential route my grandfather's train may have taken?

James

 

[Gloster]

Thanks for all the informative replies. I'm heading to Milan this August for a few days, a trip from Centrale to Lugarno is on the cards for a day trip.

Does anyone now what the potential route my grandfather's train may have taken?

James

Most likely Milan-Domodossola-Brig, then either Martigny-Lausanne-Vallorbe or Spiez-Bern-Pontarlier and Dijon. From there it could have been straight up to Paris and north, or cross-country to Calais. Most French mainlines were in operation within a few months of the country being liberated.

Spellcheck doesn’t like Martigny: it prefers Martians.

 

[30907]

Most likely Milan-Domodossola-Brig, then either Martigny-Lausanne-Vallorbe or Spiez-Bern-Pontarlier and Dijon. From there it could have been straight up to Paris and north, or cross-country to Calais. Most French mainlines were in operation within a few months of the country being liberated.

The first (both parts) would have been the "normal" Route, with the Grande Ceinture round Paris probably. Using the very secondary Pontarlier route would have surprised me, but I do wonder if the Mont Cenis route via Turin-Chambery might have been an option?

Spellcheck doesn’t like Martigny: it prefers Martians.

 

[Gloster]

A snippet seen in the latest Bulletin of the Military Railway Study Group: meals for both Calais and Dieppe trains were provided at a camp run by the British Army of the Rhine at Épluches, near Pontoise north-west of Paris. This would suggest that the trains came round the Grande Ceinture and the Calais ones continued to Creil to join the line to Amiens and Calais; the Dieppes would probably have reversed and gone via Pontoise, Gisors and Serqueux.