Manchester to St Pancras? Where's my train gone?

[EM2]

According to the GB Rail Timetable, there's an EMT service from Manchester Piccadilly to Sheffield at 08.43, from which I can connect from Sheffield to St Pancras at 10.27.
But if I try and book a through ticket for this journey, it says I have to also change at Doncaster.
Is it because I'm leaving too big a gap between the two trains? Should I book for the 09.20 from Picc?
Or, if I want the 08.43, will I have to book two separate tickets which looks like it comes out more expensive... i.e. £23 for 2 x Advance Single as opposed to £18 for an Advance on the through ticket.

 

[philjo]

It is probably only showing the quickest journey option.

I sometimes wish that you could specify which combination of connections you wish to use via the online booking (i.e. to split the journey up & specify each train individually) - as it may book you on to 2 services with say a 9-minute connection time when you might want to use a slightly earlier train to give a more reliable connection (e.g. if the 2nd train isn't very frequent such as the Cambrian Coast from Shrewsbury etc when a missed connection means a 2-hour wait)

 

[clagmonster]

The 09:20 will get to Sheffield at 10:11, giving a 16 minute connection onto the St Pancras train. My advice would be to specify 'via Leicester' on the internet booking site to give you a train via the MML.
If you want to allow a longer connection time at Sheffield, it may be possible for that to be achevied if you book at the station. Do note however that you get £1 off the EMT advance fares if you book via the EMT website.

 

[dan_atki]

Or, if I want the 08.43, will I have to book two separate tickets which looks like it comes out more expensive... i.e. £23 for 2 x Advance Single as opposed to £18 for an Advance on the through ticket.

I have managed to get it to come up as one journey on WebTIS based planners - but it is a bit convoluted seeing as the 'extended journey time' or 'TOC only' options on NRE do not pass off correctly to any online purchasing system...

thetrainline based systems won't show it as they don't allow you to specify a route like WebTIS does.

So onto NXEC or Southern as you wish, put in the journey details required. Once on the results page, click 'Show slower routes' on the left hand side, untick 'Show fastest services' and tick the two EMT options (in reality your ticket is routed as the first option but for some reason you need the second ticked to make the fare come up :?) - EMT+conn and EMT+FCC, then click update.

Your requested itenary and a through advance fare should now be shown!

 

[glynn80]

thetrainline based systems won't show it as they don't allow you to specify a route like WebTIS does.

theTrainline based systems do allow you to specify a route?

If you are on theTrainline.com, on the home page click the bottom left link "More Options", this takes you to the Advanced Search (http://www.thetrainline.com/buytick...mmand=moreOptions&RedirectionNotRequired=true) and it is here that you are given the option to specify a via or avoid point.

If you are on a TOC branded version of theTrainline, such as First Scotrail (http://www.firstscotrail.trainsfare...rements/journey_requirements.asp?sitecode=SCR), the via or avoid option is usually on the front page when inputting the journey details- the fifth and sixth stages of "Step 1- Where would you like to go?".

 

[John @ home]

According to the GB Rail Timetable, there's an EMT service from Manchester Piccadilly to Sheffield at 08.43, from which I can connect from Sheffield to St Pancras at 10.27.
But if I try and book a through ticket for this journey, it says I have to also change at Doncaster.
Is it because I'm leaving too big a gap between the two trains? Should I book for the 09.20 from Picc?
Or, if I want the 08.43, will I have to book two separate tickets which looks like it comes out more expensive... i.e. £23 for 2 x Advance Single as opposed to £18 for an Advance on the through ticket.

No, you don't need to book two tickets.

To get what you want, go to http://www.nationalrail.co.uk/index.html
Under Journey Planner click on Advanced search options
Enter MAN (Manchester Piccadilly) to STP (London St Pancras) for 0830 on your chosen date.
Under Specify Your Route click on I want to travel VIA station., CHD (Chesterfield) and click on Add
Under Changing Trains click on Increase Interchange Time., and set this to 1/2 hour increment

You should then be offered the journey you want. For next Tuesday 18 August, for example, you are offered £23 Standard or £25 First Class. On Friday 18 September it is £18 Standard and £30 First Class. If this still does not bring the price down for the date you want, perhaps the 0843 EMT train from Manchester Piccadilly has sold its cheaper Advance tickets for that day.

John

 

[dan_atki]

theTrainline based systems do allow you to specify a route?

The option of via/avoid to me is NOT the same as choosing which route I wish to appear on my ticket . It certainly helps getting the route you want but you have no control to select 'EMT+Conn' or 'EMT+FCC only' like you can on WebTIS.

As an aside, I notice that for this itenary on WebTIS, it is only allowing a change at Chesterfield rather than Sheffield.

Judging by the fact that the xx20 departures are also coming up for the EMT+Conn option (with a change showing at Sheffield) then I'm led to believe it is the Sheffield/Chesterfield to London bit which is the main 'reservable' part of the ticket.

I'm not sure what control a ticket office would have in being able to move the 'changing' location of the itenary for you (if you did want to change at Sheffield), or whether the Manchester to Sheffield/Chesterfield portion is a normal 'connections' portion and hence allows travel on any service to enable a change at Sheffield (WebTIS reserves a seat on both legs).
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

You should then be offered the journey you want. For next Tuesday 18 August, for example, you are offered £23 Standard or £25 First Class. On Friday 18 September it is £18 Standard and £30 First Class. If this still does not bring the price down for the date you want, perhaps the 0843 EMT train from Manchester Piccadilly has sold its cheaper Advance tickets for that day.

John

You are correct in stating you are offered the ticket then, but you try booking it on thetrainline or WebTIS and it will not be successful (thetrainline) or will not find the service again unless you go through the method I posted above (WebTIS)!

Of course, I doubt a ticket office would have any problem...

 

[glynn80]

The option of via/avoid to me is NOT the same as choosing which route I wish to appear on my ticket . It certainly helps getting the route you want but you have no control to select 'EMT+Conn' or 'EMT+FCC only' like you can on WebTIS.

Ah a neat little feature!

 

[EM2]

Thanks for that chaps. Sorted!