Manchester - Stalybridge Electrification

[Xenophon PCDGS]

The last train to Dobcross presumably continued to Delph. That was another place where the station was separated from the village by a steep hill.

The part of the poem/song that I referred to before which mentioned Dobcross was......

"And at Measurements Halt, the track has been lifted
The platform is all overgrown
There's willow and scrub where the Delph Donkey ran
And the valley has claimed back its own

In the Saddleworth hills on a crisp autumn day
A plume of smoke still lingers on
But I'm dreaming out loud, sure it's only a cloud
And the last train to Dobcross has gone"

 

[edwin_m]

"the night was dark and stormy,the rain fell down in lumps
Tram were on its journey from 'Ollinwood to Mumps
A dog ran in the tram tracks, driver rang 'is bell
Dog didn't hear his signal so he's on his way to Hellifax
So we're off, we're off,we're off in a motor car
Fifty bobbies are after us and we don't know where we are"

(from memory of 45 years ago)

Better not mention the lollipop on a family forum...

 

[GRALISTAIR]

Looks like the 2 week closure to upgrade is being posted

https://twitter.com/TheGNRP

 

[snowball]

(Also posted in the TP CP6 thread)

Here's the press release on that:

https://www.networkrail.co.uk/feeds...hanges-to-services-through-ashton-under-lyne/

Ashton-under-Lyne station will close for 16 days while work takes place to provide passengers with better journeys between Manchester Victoria and Stalybridge.

As part of the Great North Rail Project, Team Orange will be working round-the-clock to remove a signal box, resignal sections of the railway and remodel the track from Saturday 14 April to Sunday 29 April 2018.

The upgrade will increase the linespeed in the area, helping to provide faster journeys, and renew the signalling system, which will make journeys more reliable.

During the work, Northern services will be replaced by buses between Manchester Victoria and Stalybridge. TransPennine Express trains will not run between Manchester Victoria and Liverpool Lime Street, only Manchester Piccadilly. Trains will continue to run from Stalybridge to Manchester Piccadilly station.

Nick Brown, project manager for Network Rail, said: “As part of the Great North Rail Project, this work will help us move towards a more modern railway. Not only are we aiming to improve the line speed but the signalling system at Ashton Moss will be changed so it can be controlled from our state-of-the-art rail operating centre in Manchester.”

Liam Sumpter, regional director for Northern, said: “We’re very sorry for any disruption this vital engineering work will cause for our customers. We are working closely with our partners in the rail industry to help keep people on the move and we will have a robust rail replacement system in place to get our customers where they need to be.”

Customer experience director for TransPennine Express Kathryn O’Brien said: “This essential work will deliver notable enhancements for rail customers across the North.

“There will be changes to our services between Liverpool, Manchester and Leeds, York and the North East over the 16 days and customers are encouraged to check and plan their journeys in advance.”

Preparation work will take place in the area over the coming weeks which will not affect services.

We will also be holding community drop-in sessions on Wednesday 14 March and Monday 16 April 2018 at Ashton Cricket Club, Reyner Lane, Richmond Street, Ashton-under-Lyne, OL7 0AU. Members of the project team will be on hand to answer any questions residents may have in relation to this work.

Passengers are advised to check before they travel at www.nationalrail.co.uk.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

Traversing the route today, there's a lot of physical work going on on both sides of the line to Stalybridge.
Much of it seems to be building new cable routes (for the OHLE "extension lead"?) which look really complicated where they avoid obstacles.
Plus things like new drainage.
I didn't see any obvious preparation for new signals to replace the semaphores at Ashton Moss.
Approaching Victoria there are 6 initial gantries, mostly dressed, then a sizeable gap before the ones immediately east of Victoria station.
It looks like that stretch will need large "gravity pads" for form the mast bases, so wiring is definitely not imminent.

 

[snowball]

Pictures of Ashton Moss posted on SSC by Freel07, including some glimpses of the extension lead:

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpost.php?p=146513181&postcount=319

 

[snowball]

The Twitter feed has pictures of work near Cheetham Hill Road bridge:
(The remaining tracks under the bridge are being lowered over Easter)

https://twitter.com/TheGNRP/status/979665027186790401

https://twitter.com/TheGNRP/status/979621853051392000

 

[jyte]

re-lowered?!

 

[absolutelymilk]

think that should say "are being lowered"

 

[snowball]

Whoops, have corrected.

 

[WatcherZero]

Further lowered, as in they temporarily lowered it and now they are lowering it even further to achieve the necessary bridge clearance?

 

[snowball]

Further lowered, as in they temporarily lowered it and now they are lowering it even further to achieve the necessary bridge clearance?

I thought it was that they previously lowered the right-hand tracks as seen from the station, and are now lowering the left-hand tracks. Someone in the know has explained it somewhere since the turn of the year.

Edit: the platform 5 and 6 lines according to twpsaesneg here:

https://www.railforums.co.uk/thread...e-electrification.148433/page-10#post-3303893

 

[snowball]

More track lowering pictures from Vic:

https://twitter.com/TheGNRP/status/980022453249433600

 

[snowball]

And some more:

https://twitter.com/TheGNRP/status/980109010706862080

 

[snowball]

More pictures from the Twitter feed:

Sunday morning: https://twitter.com/TheGNRP/status/980022453249433600

Monday morning: https://twitter.com/TheGNRP/status/980109010706862080

Tuesday: https://twitter.com/TheGNRP/status/980752971179929600

Pictures posted on SSC on Monday:

by Johnny de Rivative: http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpost.php?p=146945301&postcount=4035

by r02bapurdie (familyguy) (taken from a tram): http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpost.php?p=146949039&postcount=4036

 

[childwallblues]

More pictures from the Twitter feed:

Sunday morning: https://twitter.com/TheGNRP/status/980022453249433600

Monday morning: https://twitter.com/TheGNRP/status/980109010706862080

Tuesday: https://twitter.com/TheGNRP/status/980752971179929600

Pictures posted on SSC on Monday:

by Johnny de Rivative: http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpost.php?p=146945301&postcount=4035

by r02bapurdie (familyguy) (taken from a tram): http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpost.php?p=146949039&postcount=4036[/QUOTE

Excellent

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

Had a look round Victoria yesterday.
There are masts alongside the Platform 1 bay line, it's evidently in the process of being wired.
No masts are visible for the adjacent P2 line, but on closer inspection there are 3 big yellow plates on the floor next to the railings on the main concourse.
I expect these are for the P2 masts.
East of the station there are 2 full portals with a complete set of danglies, then another 5 portals much further east.
There's still a lot to do in the stretch between the two sets of completed portals, with the odd gravity pad under construction.

Killing time at Victoria, I noticed this interesting advertising display.
How do the installation guys not notice it is displaying upside down?
Or is it the latest marketing wheeze to get people looking at the advert?
It certainly got my attention.

 

[jyte]

Had a look round Victoria yesterday.
There are masts alongside the Platform 1 bay line, it's evidently in the process of being wired.
No masts are visible for the adjacent P2 line, but on closer inspection there are 3 big yellow plates on the floor next to the railings on the main concourse.
I expect these are for the P2 masts.
East of the station there are 2 full portals with a complete set of danglies, then another 5 portals much further east.
There's still a lot to do in the stretch between the two sets of completed portals, with the odd .

Killing time at Victoria, I noticed this interesting advertising display.
How do the installation guys not notice it is displaying upside down?
Or is it the latest marketing wheeze to get people looking at the advert?
It certainly got my attention.
View attachment 45320

Re you're imagine - orientation issues are all far too common. The display might have had to have been put upside down for various reasons and someone forget to set a software rotation in the controller.

I've watched the start of quite a few movies upside down in a cinema...

 

[adamedwards]

Pictures of Ashton Moss posted on SSC by Freel07, including some glimpses of the extension lead:

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpost.php?p=146513181&postcount=319

Please to see the posts from the Woodhead line 1500 DC electrification are still up behind the signal box. Might they be pressed into use for 25,000 AC at some point?!

 

[Joseph_Locke]

Please to see the posts from the Woodhead line 1500 DC electrification are still up behind the signal box. Might they be pressed into use for 25,000 AC at some point?!

Only if someone was prepared to spend the time and money inspecting and assessing each one to verify that their height, strength and condition is adequate, and then come up with a unique set of fittings to attach modern SPS to old and relatively small steel sections. In summary - unlikely to be cost-effective, IMHO.

 

[Taunton]

Only if someone was prepared to spend the time and money inspecting and assessing each one to verify that their height, strength and condition is adequate. In summary - unlikely to be cost-effective, IMHO.

OK, that's a morning's work for a competent engineer.

Anything else we can think of to squander the electrification funds and come in 4 times over budget? Don't dismiss this - it's exactly what the GW electrifcation delivered.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

Aren't they all off-line to the main TP route though?
They were positioned on the branch/sidings/exchange lines from the old GC route onto the L&Y.
While the steelwork is ugly and should have been removed decades ago, I doubt if any of it is helpfully positioned to make any contribution to the modern TP route.
Having said that, there is modern 25kV OHLE fixed to similar LNER steelwork out of Liverpool St (and on bits of the MSJ&A still in NR control, and the remaining Woodhead route between Ardwick and Hadfield).
I think there are more disused masts in the undergrowth around Guide Bridge too, but again remote from the current Stalybridge running lines.

 

[childwallblues]

Please to see the posts from the Woodhead line 1500 DC electrification are still up behind the signal box. Might they be pressed into use for 25,000 AC at some point?!

The only time that I saw an electric locomotive at Ashton Moss was 8th June 1962 when i was on my way to York. The locos were E26016 and E26031.

 

[billh]

The only time that I saw an electric locomotive at Ashton Moss was 8th June 1962 when i was on my way to York. The locos were E26016 and E26031.

I got a cab ride on an EM1 from Guide Bridge to Ashton Moss South and return. Aged about nine. Collected a rake of wagons by the 'box . The sidings and route to GB were de-wired in 1972, so less than 20years use and 45 years of disuse for the remaining gantries. Some of those structures behind the North box are special tubular experimental types , not found elsewhere on the Woodhead route.

 

[YorkshireBear]

OK, that's a morning's work for a competent engineer.

Anything else we can think of to squander the electrification funds and come in 4 times over budget? Don't dismiss this - it's exactly what the GW electrifcation delivered.

No it isn't.... Developing new fixings from scratch is not half a days job.

 

[59CosG95]

No it isn't.... Developing new fixings from scratch is not half a days job.

Couldn't agree more. To quote a certain Mr. Dylan: "Don't criticise what you can't understand".
In this case, rather than pushing aside people who I'm sure do similar structural designs & analyses on a fairly regular basis, let them impart their own knowledge.
There's a ton of factors that need to be considered, and I'm sure @Joseph_Locke knows more about them than most of us on here.

 

[Joseph_Locke]

Couldn't agree more. To quote a certain Mr. Dylan: "Don't criticise what you can't understand".
In this case, rather than pushing aside people who I'm sure do similar structural designs & analyses on a fairly regular basis, let them impart their own knowledge.
There's a ton of factors that need to be considered, and I'm sure @Joseph_Locke knows more about them than most of us on here.

Like that when a certain project was requested to assess 100 existing signal structures for screening cages for OLE, this involved ground investigation and drilling holes in steelwork (because there were no records and the structures were 30 years old), structural assessments for each one, about a dozen different fixing details to get the (new, compliant) ladders and screening cages to stay on ... and the first 20 all failed so the 100 were replaced (the cost of the assessment work was the same as a new signal, as it turned out).

OLE conductor tensions are now very high and the radial loads produced can be significant meaning that older portal structrues suffering section loss, founded on 1940s bases, are unlikely to be able to bear the new equipment.

 

[GRALISTAIR]

Like that when a certain project was requested to assess 100 existing signal structures for screening cages for OLE, this involved ground investigation and drilling holes in steelwork (because there were no records and the structures were 30 years old), structural assessments for each one, about a dozen different fixing details to get the (new, compliant) ladders and screening cages to stay on ... and the first 20 all failed so the 100 were replaced (the cost of the assessment work was the same as a new signal, as it turned out).

OLE conductor tensions are now very high and the radial loads produced can be significant meaning that older portal structrues suffering section loss, founded on 1940s bases, are unlikely to be able to bear the new equipment.

This is absolutely correct yes. I do not want to get too far OT but a trip to Fylde Junction is well worth it IMHO. Although I am a materials scientist/Corrosion engineer I naively thought - oh this is easy - just continue wiring from Fylde to Salwick - no problem. Not as easy as that - loads of new kit gone in with substantial overlaps etc. Some old kit has got reused but they were headspans with huge mast and thus pretty substantial - but even they had to be inspected etc. So there are pulleys with weights and the autotensioners both used. I will post the link to the photos when I get chance. LDECRexile has put them up and he also used many of mine.

 

[GRALISTAIR]

Here is a sample of what I am talking about. How it is not easy just to use old bases and structures. I hope they illustrate what I am trying to say + Mr Locke I assume?

https://www.flickr.com/photos/127646831@N03/24493222287/in/album-72157651259517065/

https://www.flickr.com/photos/127646831@N03/24493222027/in/album-72157651259517065/

https://www.flickr.com/photos/127646831@N03/32720685370/in/album-72157651259517065/

https://www.flickr.com/photos/127646831@N03/24785348548/in/album-72157651259517065/

 

[Domh245]

How it is not easy just to use old bases and structures. I hope they illustrate what I am trying to say + Mr Locke I assume?

Because if the old bases and structures cannot be guaranteed to be strong enough to take the design loads (which are higher than earlier installations) then you aren't going to use them! Note how in the 2 9064 pictures that you've linked to, both of the reused masts, which for what it's worth don't seem like they'd see particularly high loads compared to those with tensioning or anchoring equipment, appear to have had new stays(?) added to them requiring bases themselves. If you are going to the trouble of putting in a new base for the stay, unless you are 99.99% confident that the existing mast is good enough then you may as well pay out a little more and get a new one.