Manchester - Liverpool Electrification

[Whistler40145]

I presume that if the OHLE is live on 03/08/2013, have the remaining missing sections been completed?

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

I presume that if the OHLE is live on 03/08/2013, have the remaining missing sections been completed?

I doubt it.
I think this is the overall safety drill so they can start testing what is ready.

 

[steverailer]

I presume that if the OHLE is live on 03/08/2013, have the remaining missing sections been completed?

Nope, doubt they will be completed for another couple of weeks!!!!

Alot around Kenyon and NLW has been registered, but the vast majority of the rest still has to be done, with alot still tied up with temp droppers and no reg arms. Several wire runs only on temporary anchors not the tensioners. Still some cantelevers missing and earth and ATF wiring to do.

Currently NWR are doing the main wiring at 4 times the cost of the original team and doing less per night.

Current word on site is completed around 6th September, but can't see it myself. There are alot of machines and staff on everynight trying to get it completed, and may see an improvement after the weekend block.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

Nope, doubt they will be completed for another couple of weeks!!!!

Alot around Kenyon and NLW has been registered, but the vast majority of the rest still has to be done, with alot still tied up with temp droppers and no reg arms. Several wire runs only on temporary anchors not the tensioners. Still some cantelevers missing and earth and ATF wiring to do.

Currently NWR are doing the main wiring at 4 times the cost of the original team and doing less per night.

Current word on site is completed around 6th September, but can't see it myself. There are alot of machines and staff on everynight trying to get it completed, and may see an improvement after the weekend block.

That's exactly what I thought.
Have Balfour Beatty given up then, or been booted off?
Their foundation team still seems to be hard at work Huyton-Wigan.
Doesn't bode well for the rest of the project.

Edit:
The NR "Phase 1 Complete" announcement on 17 July has this text:

From 3rd July, Network Rail started to commission and test the electrical equipment with the aim of having the whole system energised by 2nd September

So perhaps we should not complain if they meet that date.

 

[YorkshireBear]

Oh i thought Balfour were still doing it. To be fair they don't need to hurry up too much theres no units for the route!

Has their been some contractor disputes?

 

[SF-02]

Currently NWR are doing the main wiring at 4 times the cost of the original team and doing less per night.

Who were the original team and why the change to one much worse?!

 

[Whistler40145]

Has the project cost too much, so the remainder of the work is being taken back in house?

 

[steverailer]

Balfour Beatty are still the main contractors, just drafted alot of people in to get the job finished.

NWR doing contact and catenery wiring, also 4/5 crews registering and heights and staggers. Bourne rail and others doing steel work, SRS Rail doing ATF and earth wiring, plus other firms in doing S&T and other stuff.

Bourne did some of the wiring, then they had SRS in for the majority, now NWR finishing the job. Not sure why the change though, just heard the costs from some of the lads there

 

[GazK]

It should be noted that an energisation notice is not the same as "this OLE is live". Hence the "is now to be *treated* as live". It means you need a permit to work before you can work on the OLE and is issued in the runup to live testing. It gets people used to the idea of treating it with respect, rather than as a glorified building site.

sent from my Samsung Galaxy S3 using Tapatalk

 

[Eagle]

I think we should consider Saturday as a major milestone. A point in railway history. The first completed electrification project (treating each phase separate in my eyes as they all allow changes to services) of what could be 40 years of continuous electrification. Well done to Network Rail and all the contractors... Lets hope this is only the beginning!

No, that would be when the juice was switched on at Paisley Canal last October (which was after work on the Chat Moss had started).

 

[GazK]

Or Airdrie to Bathgate and Haymarket in 2010. Or Crewe Kidsgrove in 200e. Or HS1 in 2003. Or. ...

 

[Eagle]

Or Airdrie to Bathgate and Haymarket in 2010. Or Crewe Kidsgrove in 200e. Or HS1 in 2003. Or. ...

Yes but there were gaps between those schemes.

I'm saying that the start of the current long continuous period of electrification was the start of the works on the Paisley Canal branch in early 2012. By the time that was finished, the Chat Moss works had started, and by the time the Chat Moss is finished, GWML works will have started, and by the time that's finished something else will have already started, and so on.

 

[GazK]

Fair point.

 

[YorkshireBear]

Yes but there were gaps between those schemes.

I'm saying that the start of the current long continuous period of electrification was the start of the works on the Paisley Canal branch in early 2012. By the time that was finished, the Chat Moss works had started, and by the time the Chat Moss is finished, GWML works will have started, and by the time that's finished something else will have already started, and so on.

Fair play, apologies i forgot about that scheme. (which is annoying as i did my dissertation on electrification and talked alot about it!)

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

Fair play, apologies i forgot about that scheme. (which is annoying as i did my dissertation on electrification and talked alot about it!)

In fact, there might be 5 or more schemes running concurrently in CP5.
We already have: EGIP/Whifflet, North West and GW.
Then add TP and MML from 2015.

You also have to add E-W, local stuff in the Midlands (Bromsgrove, Rugeley) and the electric spine work, the Cardiff Valleys, and now GOBLIN and perhaps Windermere.

I still worry that this will stretch Network Rail and the contractors beyond what's manageable.
It's not that long since there were posts on this forum saying all the electrification skills had left the country (around the time of the Rugby/Liverpool St overrun fiascos).

 

[snowball]

Yes but there were gaps between those schemes.

I'm saying that the start of the current long continuous period of electrification was the start of the works on the Paisley Canal branch in early 2012. By the time that was finished, the Chat Moss works had started, and by the time the Chat Moss is finished, GWML works will have started, and by the time that's finished something else will have already started, and so on.

If I remember correctly three bridges were reconstructed in Eccles in 2011 as part of the Liverpool-Manchester electrification. Depends whether you want to count that.

 

[YorkshireBear]

In fact, there might be 5 or more schemes running concurrently in CP5.
We already have: EGIP/Whifflet, North West and GW.
Then add TP and MML from 2015.

You also have to add E-W, local stuff in the Midlands (Bromsgrove, Rugeley) and the electric spine work, the Cardiff Valleys, and now GOBLIN and perhaps Windermere.

I still worry that this will stretch Network Rail and the contractors beyond what's manageable.
It's not that long since there were posts on this forum saying all the electrification skills had left the country (around the time of the Rugby/Liverpool St overrun fiascos).

Yep, another comment from my dissertation saying we need to maintain steady no rushing and keep a solid skills base. I think network rail have been pushed too far personally and some of the projects will be finished not early but mid CP6, especially MML.

 

[snowball]

I thought I read somewhere that MML was being accelerated because some thinking had already been done on how to do it, in contrast to the electric spine which was sprung out of nowhere and will be decelerated.

 

[AndyLandy]

I thought I read somewhere that MML was being accelerated because some thinking had already been done on how to do it, in contrast to the electric spine which was sprung out of nowhere and will be decelerated.

I also suspect that there's simply less demand for the Electric Spine. I'm sure I've seen numerous reports about freight operators being pretty 'meh' about the whole thing. The only passenger service that might benefit from it would be XC's Bournemouth-Manchester, and there's no plans to acquire any EMUs to take advantage of it.

Electrifying the MML however, now that IEPs are replacing the IC225s on ECML, would mean there would be some suitable electric trains to use to replace the MML HSTs.

 

[Ships]

What's the goblin scheme? Some intresting proposals where put about regarding windermere but a friend of mine was working on the civics proposal for structures alterations.

 

[snowball]

What's the goblin scheme?

Gospel Oak - Barking LINe.

 

[YorkshireBear]

I thought I read somewhere that MML was being accelerated because some thinking had already been done on how to do it, in contrast to the electric spine which was sprung out of nowhere and will be decelerated.

That probably makes more sense actually, i meant the scheme as a whole. It does seem sensible to split it do the MML and get the spine done later. The conversion also will be late on i reckon.

 

[The Ham]

I also suspect that there's simply less demand for the Electric Spine. I'm sure I've seen numerous reports about freight operators being pretty 'meh' about the whole thing. The only passenger service that might benefit from it would be XC's Bournemouth-Manchester, and there's no plans to acquire any EMUs to take advantage of it.

Although with the new franchise set to start Nov 2019 it could be something the new operator would be looking to do (much like ICWC were planning on new trains to replace the 221's).

Either way it is no great rush, as it is likely that the new operator will need a good few months to get new trains delivered and ready to run from the start of the franchise.

 

[GRALISTAIR]

Yep, another comment from my dissertation saying we need to maintain steady no rushing and keep a solid skills base. I think network rail have been pushed too far personally and some of the projects will be finished not early but mid CP6, especially MML.

So absolutely true. We can not change the past, but what a glorious opportunity was missed late 80s and 90s. We had the skills base - no need to rush, nice steady ongoing program. Sadly our politicians ----- lets not go there!!

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

Wiring update:
A single wire run (the earth wire?) on each side now extends across the gap between the old and new wires either side of Parkside.
At Ordsall Lane, another short single wire extension from the west has been put in place on the Down line.
But there are still about 12 structures there without any wires, ironically right by the electrification depot.

The gap at Glazebury is as long as ever. About 30-odd structures are devoid of wires.
On the Wigan line, foundations have appeared on the north side of the embankment through the Pilkington works area, west of St Helens Central.

 

[Dixie]

I'm a local electric loco enthusiast and would appreciate any advance warning of load testing and/or trial runs - if anyone hears anything about it - Thanks

 

[DJH1971]

Wiring update:
A single wire run (the earth wire?) on each side now extends across the gap between the old and new wires either side of Parkside.
At Ordsall Lane, another short single wire extension from the west has been put in place on the Down line.
But there are still about 12 structures there without any wires, ironically right by the electrification depot.

The gap at Glazebury is as long as ever. About 30-odd structures are devoid of wires.
On the Wigan line, foundations have appeared on the north side of the embankment through the Pilkington works area, west of St Helens Central.

Any more progress east of St Helens?

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

Any more progress east of St Helens?

None that I could detect. Sometimes it's hard distinguishing the regular maintenance activity from electrification work.
There's also a heavy duty works depot near St Helens station but I think it's Network Rail preparing for track/resignalling work.
The most positive sight is crews loading up the electrification works trains at Edge Hill. So something is happening!
Rather less seems to be going on at Huyton.
The vegetation cleared from the 4-track layout and piled up during the winter now has a season's new growth on it.
You'd have though the resignalling would be next but no sign yet.
A work site has also been constructed at Astley, I imagine this is to do with upgrading the crossing there.

 

[DavidL]

Great to be hearing this!

I wonder if they will be putting up gantries on the Carr Mill bridge, like those in the Castlefield viaduct?

Mind you, they would have to do the same with the Sankey Valley viaduct at Earlestown.

Sorry for the delay, I wasn't ignoring your post but wondering much the same. St Helens and Garswood has been mostly complete base wise for a couple of weeks but I noticed the odd one or two extra kept popping up. A couple of standard concrete bases are now on Carr Mill bridge over the East Lancs, however nothing at the viaduct over the dam itself. There probably isn't space and it'll be something fancy as you suggest!

In other news, work equipment and teams still seem in place by Arch Lane bridge at Garswood.

 

[DJH1971]

Sorry for the delay, I wasn't ignoring your post but wondering much the same. St Helens and Garswood has been mostly complete base wise for a couple of weeks but I noticed the odd one or two extra kept popping up. A couple of standard concrete bases are now on Carr Mill bridge over the East Lancs, however nothing at the viaduct over the dam itself. There probably isn't space and it'll be something fancy as you suggest!

In other news, work equipment and teams still seem in place by Arch Lane bridge at Garswood.

Good to hear!

Wonder how long it will be when the mast bases reach Springs Branch junction?