Maidstone Barracks (MDB) Machine not working - leading to excess fare charge

[brad465]

I travelled earlier from MDB to Chatham, via Strood, leaving the former at 16:35 and arriving at Strood just before 17:00. The ticket machine was out of service (the only machine at this station), so as I always do if I cannot buy a ticket before boarding, I took a photo in case the evidence was necessary.

The guard checked tickets, and I asked for a return ticket as I required - he told me he can't sell returns or do railcard discounts on board (I have a 16-25), and the same applied to another passenger next to me, who had the same problem as me. I said I had proof of the MDB machine failure, but he said there was another machine on the other platform. What he said about the machine is a lie. I would have argued a lot better if I had photographs of every last spec of the station, but I didn't so didn't contest beyond this.

I had to pay £7 for a single with no railcard to get there, resulting in me paying another £4.60 for a discounted single to get back later, but if I had been able to buy before this would only have been £4.95.

Can I claim compensation or something for this? At the minimum I'm hoping to complain to Southeastern about this policy in the event of a passenger not being able to buy through no fault of their own, and the fact the guard lied (he had no name badge, but if Southeastern do care about employee work ethic they could I suspect trace him by the service he was assigned on).

 

[Kite159]

Make a complaint to South Eastern as there was no working TVM (send a picture of the TVM saying it was out of order) so the guard should have been able to sell you the ticket you wanted with discount so a clear failure of the guard to follow the national rail conditions of travel.

Did you manage to keep both tickets (assuming the barriers at Chatham were in operation?)

 

[brad465]

Did you manage to keep both tickets (assuming the barriers at Chatham were in operation?)

I did fortunately, the Chatham barriers were open on exit (even though they closed on my return)

 

[ForTheLoveOf]

I did fortunately, the Chatham barriers were open on exit (even though they closed on my return)

In that case this should be a straightforward claim for the difference between what you paid and what you should have paid, had the guard acted correctly.

If there is any doubt as to the availability of ticketing facilities at a given station, any revenue-involved staff should surely check, and if checking is not possible, give the benefit of the doubt.

Rejecting a claim of no ticketing facilities out of hand is completely wrong, but also unsurprising in today's under-regulated world of railways - where the DfT and ORR turn a blind eye to breaches of the NRCoT, TSA and franchise agreements because they know they would otherwise put off bidders for the upcoming franchises.

 

[Haywain]

What he said about the machine is a lie.

If he said this knowing it to be untrue then it is indeed a lie. If he believes there is a second machine then he was simply wrong and was not lying.

 

[Kite159]

To be honest that line is probably treated by some as a "Pay if challenged" service, unless they are heading to Strood (or Tonbridge). Most likely the guard was confusing it with another station which has got a TVM on each platform.

 

[EM2]

If he said this knowing it to be untrue then it is indeed a lie. If he believes there is a second machine then he was simply wrong and was not lying.

There is not, and never has been, a ticket machine on the Paddock Wood platform (p2). NRE shows this to be the case:
http://www.nationalrail.co.uk/stati...ons-made-easy/maidstone-barracks-station-plan

 

[Haywain]

There is not, and never has been, a ticket machine on the Paddock Wood platform (p2). NRE shows this to be the case:
http://www.nationalrail.co.uk/stati...ons-made-easy/maidstone-barracks-station-plan

I didn't say there is, or has been. I was just pointing out that accusing someone of lying is not appropriate when it is likely to be a simple mistake.

 

[farleigh]

I didn't say there is, or has been. I was just pointing out that accusing someone of lying is not appropriate when it is likely to be a simple mistake.

Although you are happy that the guard accused the OP of fare evasion when he had not done anything wrong and the guard was not sure of his facts.? Is that appropriate?

 

[father_jack]

I travelled earlier from MDB to Chatham, via Strood, leaving the former at 16:35 and arriving at Strood just before 17:00. The ticket machine was out of service (the only machine at this station), so as I always do if I cannot buy a ticket before boarding, I took a photo in case the evidence was necessary.

The guard checked tickets, and I asked for a return ticket as I required - he told me he can't sell returns or do railcard discounts on board (I have a 16-25), and the same applied to another passenger next to me, who had the same problem as me. I said I had proof of the MDB machine failure, but he said there was another machine on the other platform. What he said about the machine is a lie. I would have argued a lot better if I had photographs of every last spec of the station, but I didn't so didn't contest beyond this.

I had to pay £7 for a single with no railcard to get there, resulting in me paying another £4.60 for a discounted single to get back later, but if I had been able to buy before this would only have been £4.95.

Can I claim compensation or something for this? At the minimum I'm hoping to complain to Southeastern about this policy in the event of a passenger not being able to buy through no fault of their own, and the fact the guard lied (he had no name badge, but if Southeastern do care about employee work ethic they could I suspect trace him by the service he was assigned on).

Commission grabber.

Also this nonsense that he couldn't sell a railcard ticket or a return is total rubbish. Had it once at Birmingham New St where the the new "mini" ticket office was snowed under, you can't buy a priv on the machines that the staff sold out to. Gates open and was sent to the excess clowns by platform 1. "Sorry, these machines (Avantix) don't sell privs and we can only sell opens from Birmingham." So no split tickets. Back to the queue in the booking office..............

 

[Haywain]

Although you are happy that the guard accused the OP of fare evasion when he had not done anything wrong and the guard was not sure of his facts.? Is that appropriate?

You are mistaken (or you could be blatantly lying, but I'll give you the benefit of the doubt), nothing I have written uses the word happy or indicates my happiness. The OP clearly should not have been charged the full fare. However, to suggest that the guard "was not sure of his facts" is also wrong - he was sure of his facts whether lying or mistaken, but they were wrong.

 

[farleigh]

You are mistaken (or you could be blatantly lying, but I'll give you the benefit of the doubt), nothing I have written uses the word happy or indicates my happiness. The OP clearly should not have been charged the full fare. However, to suggest that the guard "was not sure of his facts" is also wrong - he was sure of his facts whether lying or mistaken, but they were wrong.

Ha ha - fair point. I just felt it was a bit mean of the guard to say that there were facilities if he did not know this to be the case (which he could not have known as it was not true).
I take your point

 

[brad465]

Whether he was lying or made a mistake, I think it should be a requirement that all guards have good working knowledge of any railway route, in regard to station facilities, service connections, etc., that they are assigned to (simliar to drivers being trained for extended time periods learning route knowledge). While everyone makes mistakes, I think the fact that myself and the other passenger both prompted him about the machine not working, should have triggered his mind to map out his knowledge of the station. His facts about MDB were not straight, so I think he either didn't know the route very well or, as has been suggested already, he mixed it up.

I should add that at the beginning of May the same issue at MDB with the machine was present, but had no problem with the inspector selling me a discounted return (to Grove Park, as part of the Lee Spur rare track running at the time), so this "policy" must have changed since then or it was that guard who got it wrong.

 

[island]

I don’t think any policies have changed; staff have always been allowed (even encouraged) to use their discretion when appropriate. Just that the staff member mentioned in the OP didn’t.

 

[farleigh]

I think it is clear that discretion is allowed but that the guard acted unprofessionally.