Lothian Buses and ECB Discussion

[OmniCity999]

No a second door would remove 4 seats. You can get two rows in the space of the door.

These will most likely only have 6 (or 7 at a push) step free seats. With only 15 (or 16) seats on the lower deck.

Our standard 11.4m vehicles hold a buggy space and a wheel chair space.

As someone who works in Engineering within the company i can confirm, if we were to dual door a 11.4m vehicle we'd lose a buggy space and 2 seats - The same can be said for one of these 104/10.5m vehicles, but as our current 50 (1001-1050) ex London buses weren't fitted with a buggy space, you're right in saying we'd lose 4 seats, however we were told recently that all new acquisitions, used or brand new are to have both a buggy space and a wheelchair space.

 

[Jordan Adam]

Our standard 11.4m vehicles hold a buggy space and a wheel chair space.

As someone who works in Engineering within the company i can confirm, if we were to dual door a 11.4m vehicle we'd lose a buggy space and 2 seats - The same can be said for one of these 104/10.5m vehicles, but as our current 50 (1001-1050) ex London buses weren't fitted with a buggy space, you're right in saying we'd lose 4 seats, however we were told recently that all new acquisitions, used or brand new are to have both a buggy space and a wheelchair space.

You're right, however with a second door you'd loose 4 potential seats. That was the point being made.

 

[Observer]

Are the ex-London stock long wheelbase or short?

 

[Jordan Adam]

Are the ex-London stock long wheelbase or short?

Short wheelbase, the shortest offered with the B9TL chassis.

 

[SpeedbirdA350]

Our standard 11.4m vehicles hold a buggy space and a wheel chair space.

As someone who works in Engineering within the company i can confirm, if we were to dual door a 11.4m vehicle we'd lose a buggy space and 2 seats - The same can be said for one of these 104/10.5m vehicles, but as our current 50 (1001-1050) ex London buses weren't fitted with a buggy space, you're right in saying we'd lose 4 seats, however we were told recently that all new acquisitions, used or brand new are to have both a buggy space and a wheelchair space.

Since you work in the engineering dept you might know, but why can't Lothian install some fold down seats as Jordan said, within those spaces on the current fleet as is as if no buggy/chair is used, there is a large gap. It is one of the reasons I like the older fleet as they had this but it started to dissapear.

 

[Jordan Adam]

Since you work in the engineering dept you might know, but why can't Lothian install some fold down seats as Jordan said, within those spaces on the current fleet as is as if no buggy/chair is used, there is a large gap. It is one of the reasons I like the older fleet as they had this but it started to dissapear.

I can't comment for sure, however i suspect it's because if they fitted tip up seats the bay wouldn't meet size requirements.

 

[OmniCity999]

Since you work in the engineering dept you might know, but why can't Lothian install some fold down seats as Jordan said, within those spaces on the current fleet as is as if no buggy/chair is used, there is a large gap. It is one of the reasons I like the older fleet as they had this but it started to dissapear.

Theres not enough structure in the vehicle walls to take the weight of three/four, potentially large people.

It's also more beneficial to have standing space rather than that type of seat fitted. Dont get me wrong, you might start seeing them, sure there are some fitted on the XLBs. But these vehicles are designed to have these seats fitted and as such are structurally designed for it.

 

[SpeedbirdA350]

Thanks for that Omni. I guess they need to be planned at planning stage rather than retrofitting them in, which would solve the issue if it was one that Jordan said too.

 

[Jordan Adam]

Theres not enough structure in the vehicle walls to take the weight of three/four, potentially large people.

It's also more beneficial to have standing space rather than that type of seat fitted. Dont get me wrong, you might start seeing them, sure there are some fitted on the XLBs. But these vehicles are designed to have these seats fitted and as such are structurally designed for it.

Geminis were offered with 3 tip ups built in. Aberdeen's B7LAs which are of the same construction (in that area) have 6 tip ups in a row!

Thanks for that Omni. I guess they need to be planned at planning stage rather than retrofitting them in, which would solve the issue if it was one that Jordan said too.

Having checked i've proven my own theory wrong as Geminis were built with 3 tip-ups in the buggy space.

 

[Jordan Adam]

In general reply to above comments regarding the interior on the Ex-London Geminis. Personally something like this would be best.
Even if you were to retain the rear door you'd still get 24 seats on the lower deck (28 without rear door), this is compared to Lothian's recent recent acquisitions which will have just 15 seats seats on the lower deck at best.

This photo also also shows what i was talking about regarding fitting an offside buggy space. This interior layout would be no more work to install than what Lothian have done on these next Gemini's already.

Photo Credit: emdjt42 (PM me if you want this image removed)

 

[ScotRail158725]

Werent these apparently to go to ECB/LCB? Also whats with the odd positioning of the side LED Screens? Tbh would be good if these were same specs as 1001/1002 just with the dual doors

 

[ScotRail158725]

B7 Allocation (10/04/2019)
LS- 702-708, 711-718, 721, 724-725, 738-739, 768, 771, 775, 778, 780-781, 784, 788-789, 793, 801-811, 814, 819-820, 825
CE- 769-770, 773-774, 776-777, 782-783, 785, 792, 812, 823-824
MA- 746-767, 772, 786-787, 790-791, 813, 815-818, 821-822
W- 709, 719, 726-737, 742-745, 779
??- 710, 720-721, 723, 740-741 <- Havent been out in a while but are still in their depot (ive seen all them in their depots in the last week)

 

[OmniCity999]

Geminis were offered with 3 tip ups built in. Aberdeen's B7LAs which are of the same construction (in that area) have 6 tip ups in a row!



Having checked i've proven my own theory wrong as Geminis were built with 3 tip-ups in the buggy space.

Yes. Geminis were and indeed are offered with tip ups, im not disputing that. However, as you say offered, it is an optional extra and as such the structure that holds the seats need to go into place, our lot dont have it installed so as such, no tip ups.

 

[Jordan Adam]

Yes. Geminis were and indeed are offered with tip ups, im not disputing that. However, as you say offered, it is an optional extra and as such the structure that holds the seats need to go into place, our lot dont have it installed so as such, no tip ups.

If they can waste £16K on private plates i'm sure fitting some tip ups won't bother them! Anyway, it will be interesting to see how this new found duel door obsession progresses.

 

[OmniCity999]

If they can waste £16K on private plates i'm sure fitting some tip ups won't bother them! Anyway, it will be interesting to see how this new found duel door obsession progresses.

Do you understand how structures work?

You're suggesting they cut the side off the bus to add tip ups? They are the sort of thing you only add when the bus is first built as that section then becomes integral to the structure. I'm not saying its impossible to do, it just takes a bit of time and would add a bit of money onto an already expensive project. Their already spending £25k per bus on refurbishment.

I wish people would stop getting caught up on the private plates. Their £250 each, which in the grand scheme of things per vehicle thats nothing.

 

[Jordan Adam]

Do you understand how structures work?

You're suggesting they cut the side off the bus to add tip ups? They are the sort of thing you only add when the bus is first built as that section then becomes integral to the structure. I'm not saying its impossible to do, it just takes a bit of time and would add a bit of money onto an already expensive project. Their already spending £25k per bus on refurbishment.

I wish people would stop getting caught up on the private plates. Their £250 each, which in the grand scheme of things per vehicle thats nothing.

Comment was sarcasm... Perhaps i should have put in a laughing emoji.

 

[alchemy]

Ex London 2 door Gemini shown om Lothian Buses Flickr on A1 in full Lothian Livery(madder)

 

[Jordan Adam]

Ex London 2 door Gemini shown om Lothian Buses Flickr on A1 in full Lothian Livery(madder)

I can't see/find the post, could you link it please?

 

[Gingerbus1991]

Do you understand how structures work?

You're suggesting they cut the side off the bus to add tip ups? They are the sort of thing you only add when the bus is first built as that section then becomes integral to the structure. I'm not saying its impossible to do, it just takes a bit of time and would add a bit of money onto an already expensive project. Their already spending £25k per bus on refurbishment.

I wish people would stop getting caught up on the private plates. Their £250 each, which in the grand scheme of things per vehicle thats nothing.

Another Q and S for @OmniCity999, has any of LB euro5 buses been retrofitted with new emission systems yet?
It was touted that the londoners would get this done.

 

[Gingerbus1991]

Ex London 2 door Gemini shown om Lothian Buses Flickr on A1 in full Lothian Livery(madder)

I am always impressed just how well a refurb can be done, they look like new.

 

[Gingerbus1991]

I can't see/find the post, could you link it please?

https://flic.kr/p/2fpAsyb

 

[Jordan Adam]

https://flic.kr/p/2fpAsyb

Yeah i saw that photo earlier, alchemy said there was a photo "on Lothian Buses Flickr". So i assumed it was a new photo on the official LB Flickr account.

 

[OmniCity999]

Another Q and S for @OmniCity999, has any of LB euro5 buses been retrofitted with new emission systems yet?
It was touted that the londoners would get this done.

We're trialling different solutions currently.

Our newer B9 fleets will be seeing this work done, 351-400 / 951-960 / 1001-1050 / 20937-20950.

The older B9 fleet 301-350 / 826-936 will not recieve the work and will stay as Euro 5 Vehicles, having already had work done shortly after delivery (before my time at Lothian).

Theres also a special project with one of the B7's which i'm sure you'll find out about soon.

We're due a large number of deliveries his year, some second hand some brand new, but again you'll find out about them soon.

 

[SpeedbirdA350]

I wonder what Lothian will do with fleet numbers for the new batch of ex londoners. It would look stupid if they started with 1105 and if say 10 come up, then start the next batch of B8Ls at 1115. That said they don't seem to care as much as they once did lol.

Do we know if these will have the larger fuel tank retrofitted? Also, were these done at Wrightbus NI? I know that is where the others came from but I have not seen anythign to suggest this is the case for this lot.

 

[SpeedbirdA350]

B7 Allocation (10/04/2019)
LS- 702-708, 711-718, 721, 724-725, 738-739, 768, 771, 775, 778, 780-781, 784, 788-789, 793, 801-811, 814, 819-820, 825
CE- 769-770, 773-774, 776-777, 782-783, 785, 792, 812, 823-824
MA- 746-767, 772, 786-787, 790-791, 813, 815-818, 821-822
W- 709, 719, 726-737, 742-745, 779
??- 710, 720-721, 723, 740-741 <- Havent been out in a while but are still in their depot (ive seen all them in their depots in the last week)

Thanks for the upate

 

[ScotRail158725]

I wonder what Lothian will do with fleet numbers for the new batch of ex londoners. It would look stupid if they started with 1105 and if say 10 come up, then start the next batch of B8Ls at 1115. That said they don't seem to care as much as they once did lol.

Do we know if these will have the larger fuel tank retrofitted? Also, were these done at Wrightbus NI? I know that is where the others came from but I have not seen anythign to suggest this is the case for this lot.

These were Thorntons

 

[ScotRail158725]

Also for those wondering about the 13 B9s coming up, Vehicles coming up are WVL368 LX60 DWY, WVL36 LX60 DXG, WVL379 LX60 DXK, WVL386 LX11 CVL, WVL387 LX11 CVM, WVL391 LX11 CVR, WVL392 LX11 CVS, WVL396 LX11 CVW, WVL397 LX11 CVY, WVL399 LX11 CWA, WVL409 LX11 CWO, WVL410 LX11 CWP, WVL411 LX11 CWR, WVL412 LX11 CWT

 

[SpeedbirdA350]

We're due a large number of deliveries his year, some second hand some brand new, but again you'll find out about them soon.

I hope some of the deckers are marked for the 1 route. I was on the 1 not long ago and it was like a tin of sardines. I know there is no point putting the whole of service on deckers but the smaller ex londoners would be perfect for this I think.

 

[SpeedbirdA350]

These were Thorntons

Ah thanks! (This forum needs a thanks button!)

 

[ScotRail158725]

Ah thanks! (This forum needs a thanks button!)

Not a problem