London Transfers

[Ivo]

I have just had a look through the list of London terminal connections in the NR timetable, and quite frankly some of the interchanges they suggest are absurd. The obvious example would be Waterloo to Liverpool Street. Even without the Waterloo & City, it is only a matter of a one-stop journey to Embankment and then the Circle, or alternatively up to Tottenham Court Road and then the Central; with it, there is only one intermediate station. Yet this connection has a recommended allowance of 62 minutes! How can they justify such a ridiculous length of time (even a connection between the two Yeovil stations is only advertised as 60)? Is this some kind of stealth evasion of paying out compensation when an inbound journey is disrupted, or something? Even something as simple as Blackfriars to Cannon Street, a very unlikely connection (surely you'd change at London Bridge instead, and then use the Northern to Elephant & Castle if applicable?) which is about 1km, is shown as 23 minutes.

Or do they think everyone walks these connections?

 

[Intermodal]

Because quite often the tube is closed and they need to allow for that.

 

[The Barlow Boy]

King's Cross to St. Pancras.

 

[Hydro]

20 minutes for Waterloo East to Waterloo.

 

[NSE]

40 minutes from Victoria to Kings Cross is my favourite. Whole line takes less than that haha

 

[12CSVT]

40 minutes from Victoria to Kings Cross is my favourite. Whole line takes less than that haha

Until the door sensors on the 2009 stock decide to throw another wobbly !

 

[NSE]

Until the door sensors on the 2009 stock decide to throw another wobbly !

Must say only been on them twice, are they becoming a problem? I went on them during the off peak so it was quiet and they seemed alright.

 

[Welshman]

The actual time travelling on the tube is just the simple bit!
Presumably they also have to factor in time for the slowest passenger who's never made that journey before to get from the country end of the arrival platform with a heavy suitcase, fumble with their ticket through the barriers, spot the entrance to the tube, trudge across the concourse, negotiate the tube barriers, find their way through passageways to the right escalators, go down them and arrive on the platform just as the train doors are closing and wait 10 minutes for the next one! Then repeat the whole process at the other end, ensuring they pass through the barriers at the departing station at least 2 minutes before their next train is due to leave. Then, if travelling standard class, walk half-way up the platform to find their accommodation!
OK - I exaggerate - but its more than just the time the tube takes!

 

[NSE]

The actual time travelling on the tube is just the simple bit!
Presumably they also have to factor in time for the slowest passenger who's never made that journey before to get from the country end of the arrival platform with a heavy suitcase, fumble with their ticket through the barriers, spot the entrance to the tube, trudge across the concourse, negotiate the tube barriers, find their way through passageways to the right escalators, go down them and arrive on the platform just as the train doors are closing and wait 10 minutes for the next one! Then repeat the whole process at the other end, ensuring they pass through the barriers at the departing station at least 2 minutes before their next train is due to leave. Then, if travelling standard class, walk half-way up the platform to find their accommodation!
OK - I exaggerate - but its more than just the time the tube takes!

I have done Victoria to Kings Cross in 13 minutes flat.

 

[Welshman]

I have done Victoria to Kings Cross in 13 minutes flat.

Congratulations!!
But please remember some are not as swift of foot nor familiar with the route.

 

[NSE]

Congratulations!!
But please remember some are not as swift of foot nor familiar with the route.

True true, and thats only while rushing :P But the point does stand it gives ridiculous amounts of time for crossing London.

 

[googolplex]

One of my mates did end up cutting it fine once on a Paddington - Kings Cross transfer as there was a closure for engineering works on the Circle/Hammersmith & City line between the two, so he ended up going via Oxford Circus.

 

[W-on-Sea]

It seems to be the opposite approach that SNCF/Eurostar take for crossing Paris. A couple of times now, I've been allowed only 40 minutes between Montparnasse and Gare du Nord when buying through tickets between London and points south of Paris. The 40 minutes is just about doable...but (unlike in London) given that you have to buy metro tickets (and preferably find a machine/ticket office without a long queue to do so), and that the walk from the main line to the metro line 4 at Montparnasse is...somewhat lengthy...it's quite tight, even if you aren't encumbered with loads of luggage or anything, or anyone, that might slow you down.

Whereas the 60 minutes allowed between, say, even Fenchurch Street and Marylebone....in practice would never ever come close to being required. And would usually take half that time.

A middle way between these two approaches would be rather helpful.

 

[Lampshade]

Kings Cross St Pancras - Waterloo is a funny one, I beat my overall journey ETA by over 40 minutes, including arriving at St Pancras, taking some photos and taking a detour to Kings Cross to see an arriving HT 180, then going via the new ticket hall to the Piccadilly Line and changing at Leicester Square hock:

 

[Ivo]

It just proves my point though. Anyone would think London was on a different planet and had never been visited before. Heck, half of the interchanges mentioned could probably be done on foot in the time they suggest!

Mind you, Liverpool's not much better. Maybe they just think that escalators travel at 0.01 m/s.

 

[jopsuk]

Remember the connection time also factors in potential short delays- yet the arrival times at the terminals are generally well padded, so this is accounted for twice.

 

[Sapphire Blue]

Is it only me then that sees the connection time allowed and thinks:--

TIME FOR A BEER!!

Thankyou NR timetabling.

 

[The Barlow Boy]

What you're all missing is the get-out clause. From personal experience I know that the platform to platform time from King's Cross to Victoria is ten minutes. Allow three minutes to walk off the train to the platform at King's Cross and three minutes to leave the platform to get to, say platform twelve at Victoria, two minutes to wit for the next train at the LUL platform and in theory (what a wonderful place theory is, everything works in theory) you can do it in eighteen minutes.
Now factor in semi-lost northerner surrounded by two whining kids, a big suitcase and the need to buy a tube ticket and that forty minutes is looking decidedly necessary 'cos she ain't never gonna do it in eighteen minutes.

 

[tbtc]

What you're all missing is the get-out clause. From personal experience I know that the platform to platform time from King's Cross to Victoria is ten minutes. Allow three minutes to walk off the train to the platform at King's Cross and three minutes to leave the platform to get to, say platform twelve at Victoria, two minutes to wit for the next train at the LUL platform and in theory (what a wonderful place theory is, everything works in theory) you can do it in eighteen minutes.
Now factor in semi-lost northerner surrounded by two whining kids, a big suitcase and the need to buy a tube ticket and that forty minutes is looking decidedly necessary 'cos she ain't never gonna do it in eighteen minutes.

Also you have to bear in mind that not everyone can get on those Underground escalators. You could half some of the connection times and they'd still be generous to able bodied people, but not everyone is.