London Terminals query

[55003]

What exactly does a ticket labelled as London terminals allow you to do on the Underground? I recently bought a ticket London Kings Cross to Tonbridge but the card ticket actually had London terminals printed on it. I went down to the tube to travel to Charing Cross but the ticket would not give me access and I had to but a tube ticket.The rail ticket did let me through the gate at Charing Cross though.
The prices of the tickets Kings Cross -Tonbridge and London terminals-Tonbridge are identical.

 

[Haywain]

The fares are the same because they are the same ticket. A London Terminals ticket does not include any travel on the Underground (except in certain circumstances unaffected by this ticket). As tickets for all journeys should be sold at all locations, misunderstandings like this can occur. I would have expected that if you bought the ticket from a counter at Kings Cross that the ticket not including underground travel would have been explained to you.

 

[swt_passenger]

Is "Kings Cross" an appropriate London Terminal for Tonbridge?

(Or does HS1 come into play here?)

Is this not one of those fairly regular glitches reported whereby TVMs at London Terminals sell tickets only valid from other London Terminals, without any warning, when what you really need is a fare from London Zone U1?

 

[Haywain]

Is "Kings Cross" an appropriate London Terminal for Tonbridge?

(Or does HS1 come into play here?)

Is this not one of those fairly regular glitches reported whereby TVMs at London Terminals sell tickets only valid from other London Terminals, without any warning, when what you really need is a fare from London Zone U1?

There are tickets routed "Plus High Speed", but without knowing exactly what the OP bought and where it was bought it is difficult to comment further. However, the majority of TVMs at King's Cross do not generally sell tickets for journeys where an additional payment for the underground would be required.

 

[55003]

The ticket was bought in the Leeds travel centre and the route of travel was Kings Cross to Charing Cross by tube and then SET to Tonbridge. I was quite particular to tell the person in Leeds my route of travel..
I was travelling Leeds to Tonbridge and Virgin East Coast had a cheap advance ticket to Kings Cross but wanted an extra £73 over this to buy a single advance ticket to travel on the same train to Tonbridge . I therefore bought a ticket to London Terminals thinking it would get me to Charing Cross but when I printed it out I got Kings Cross instead.I bought a ticket before I left Leeds to cover the journey across London and then to Tonbridge but despite the route being advertiseed on NRE I did not get the ticket I wanted and had to buy a tube ticket as well.

 

[hairyhandedfool]

If I was to make some assumptions, I'd say the clerk put in Kings Cross to Tonbridge and expected the STAR machine to work it out. A clerk with experience of tickets in and around London wouldn't make that mistake, but one in Leeds might.

 

[bkhtele]

Sadly easily done! Cheapest way is often to use contactless card or Oyster. £2.30, single journey between London terminals zone 1.

 

[MarlowDonkey]

I bought a ticket before I left Leeds to cover the journey across London and then to Tonbridge but despite the route being advertiseed on NRE I did not get the ticket I wanted and had to buy a tube ticket as well.

The perils of split ticketing ! A split in London almost always needs one of the tickets to be London U1. So assuming no Advances Leeds to London U1, the second ticket had to be London U1 to Tonbridge. As also suggested, using an Oyster or contactless bank card can be cheaper for the short hop between London terminals on the Underground.

Is there a valid route Kings Cross to Tonbridge by Thameslink?

 

[James Wake]

Is there a valid route Kings Cross to Tonbridge by Thameslink?

The problem is Farringdon is not a London Terminal, the first station with a Terminals to Tonbridge ticket would be City Thameslink, my immediate thought would be the direct TL to Sevenoaks then a train from there, or down to East Croydon, then Redhill then Tonbridge.

 

[Kentish Paul]

Is there a valid route Kings Cross to Tonbridge by Thameslink?

Yes, cross the road to St Pancras (low level). Take a Thameslink train south and change at Herne Hill for an Orpington train changing there for Tonbridge.

 

[hassaanhc]

The perils of split ticketing ! A split in London almost always needs one of the tickets to be London U1. So assuming no Advances Leeds to London U1, the second ticket had to be London U1 to Tonbridge. As also suggested, using an Oyster or contactless bank card can be cheaper for the short hop between London terminals on the Underground.

Is there a valid route Kings Cross to Tonbridge by Thameslink?

St Pancras to either East Croydon or Sevenoaks via Bromley South, not including any peak-only variations.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

The problem is Farringdon is not a London Terminal, the first station with a Terminals to Tonbridge ticket would be City Thameslink, my immediate thought would be the direct TL to Sevenoaks then a train from there, or down to East Croydon, then Redhill then Tonbridge.

Well spotted that one whether it may immediately occur to member of staff is a different matter, and it is probably a route many would think of as perfectly reasonable.

 

[SephenWorceste]

I had a similar but slightly different issue in the other direction. I specifically booked an Advance ticket with Virgin from Birmingham (on a train to Euston) to Victoria through their website. They sent me a to London Terminals ticket with a cross. I queried it with Virgin. Telesales told me it was valid for one journey on the underground (presumably to Waterloo). The ticket offices at New Street said it lost all validity at my first London terminal of Euston. I was a bit cross as it had cost more than a ticket to just Euston. In the end I used it all the way to Victoria. The cross meant it opened the gates and I had no problems.

It is annoying when you ask for something specifically and you don't get it. There does seem to be some confusion around London Terminals. Next time I will try London U1.

 

[bb21]

To use Thameslink for St Pancras - Tonbridge, a ticket specifically to/from St Pancras is required. Tickets to/from London Terminals are not valid for travel through Farringdon.

 

[Kentish Paul]

To use Thameslink for St Pancras - Tonbridge, a ticket specifically to/from St Pancras is required. Tickets to/from London Terminals are not valid for travel through Farringdon.

Agreed. I was only responding to the question of a valid route via Thameslink not requiring the use of the underground. As you say a London Terminals ticket to Tonbridge is not valid from St Pancras via Thameslink.

 

[Bijgc]

To use Thameslink for St Pancras - Tonbridge, a ticket specifically to/from St Pancras is required. Tickets to/from London Terminals are not valid for travel through Farringdon.

Re the above, I contacted Thameslink (who redirected me to Southern) regarding the appropriate season ticket to be purchased for a journey between Croydon and St Pancras, and was informed that a ticket to 'London Terminals' would be appropriate. I replied, pointing out that I thought 'London Terminal' validity from the South ceased at City Thameslink and asking them to clarify whether St Pancras was a indeed a valid London Terminal for journeys from the South - I was assured that it was!

I will be keeping hold of these emails, just in case...

 

[yorkie]

The ticket was bought in the Leeds travel centre and the route of travel was Kings Cross to Charing Cross by tube and then SET to Tonbridge. I was quite particular to tell the person in Leeds my route of travel.. .

Leeds ticket office is operated by Northern, who provide minimal training, so I am not at all surprised you were not sold the correct ticket. I don't blame the clerk as, without the appropriate training, it's an easy mistake to make.

 

[bb21]

Re the above, I contacted Thameslink (who redirected me to Southern) regarding the appropriate season ticket to be purchased for a journey between Croydon and St Pancras, and was informed that a ticket to 'London Terminals' would be appropriate. I replied, pointing out that I thought 'London Terminal' validity from the South ceased at City Thameslink and asking them to clarify whether St Pancras was a indeed a valid London Terminal for journeys from the South - I was assured that it was!

I will be keeping hold of these emails, just in case...

... as long as you don't mind the potential hassle at St Pancras gateline every time you travel.

Given the prices of a season ticket to London Terminals and St Pancras are the same, I see little point of just buying a London Terminals ticket, unless you want validity into Victoria.

 

[hairyhandedfool]

Leeds ticket office is operated by Northern, who provide minimal training, so I am not at all surprised you were not sold the correct ticket. I don't blame the clerk as, without the appropriate training, it's an easy mistake to make.

That's a bit harsh, considering the nearest point of validity for the ticket is 150 or more miles away!

When I worked in London, I was three years into my job before a request came up for a sleeper train ticket, departing Euston, less than three miles away from my office, and, if I'm honest, I knew nothing about selling the tickets, but that doesn't mean I wasn't trained on how to do them, I had just never done one before.

So I wouldn't blame the training department, or the clerk, without any facts to back it up!

 

[yorkie]

That's a bit harsh, considering the nearest point of validity for the ticket is 150 or more miles away!

The ticket office at Leeds is required to sell the correct ticket. This is a franchise commitment and is not optional.

So I wouldn't blame the training department, or the clerk, without any facts to back it up!

I'm aware of numerous occasions of incorrect tickets being sold from Northern ticket offices (yet the same tickets are regularly issued correctly from VTEC ticket offices); the evidence clearly points to poor training.

You have effectively admitted training should be better...

Might be worth mentioning that, AFAIK, customer relations staff get as much ticket training as platform staff (i.e. none), so asking them anything about excess fares procedures is likely to get an incorrect response (in fact most ticket office staff seem to get bugger all training in regard to excess fares!).

And this could be an issue for staff as the manual process was not covered by the Northern training course and is not in any of the simplifiers given out. I happen to know how to do it because I looked it up when I saw how the training dept. wanted 'single to return' excess fares issued.

... and staff should receive better training from the TOCs....

.... so I am surprised you are contesting this. The evidence is plentiful.

 

[maniacmartin]

It is disappointing that the clerk didn't realise that not all London Terminals meet up, even if they didn't know the exact details of the Farringdon gap.

 

[hairyhandedfool]

....I'm aware of numerous occasions of incorrect tickets being sold from Northern ticket offices (yet the same tickets are regularly issued correctly from VTEC ticket offices); the evidence clearly points to poor training....

So you tar every situation with the same brush without looking at it first?

....You have effectively admitted training should be better...

.... so I am surprised you are contesting this. The evidence is plentiful.

Training should be better, but that in itself doesn't mean this is a training issue.

In this case I can see how it can be a very easy mistake to make, even for well trained staff. Yes there is a fair chance of it being a training issue, but equally there is a fair chance of staff error. At this point I wouldn't say evidence is plentiful at all.