London Overground New EMUs shortlisted bidders

[Western Lord]

I'm assuming that the Lea Valley services will operate as 8-car doubled up sets. That being said, the order is for 39 sets. 8 for GOBLIN, 1 for Romford-Upminster leaving 30 for Liverpool Street to Chingford, Enfield Town and Cheshunt via Seven Sisters. I think that Chingford and Enfield Town require 5 trains to run 4tph service (so 20 of the 30 sets if they're running paired up) but to increase Cheshunt to 4tph would require 6 trains. Presumably either Cheshunt will remain half-hourly or something is going to have to run as a single 4-car train.

There's also a site between Turkey Street and Theobolds Grove which I reckon has the letters TMD in its future... https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@51.688876,-0.0420929,947m/data=!3m1!1e3

Can people get their terminology right? The Lee Valley route is (Stratford)-Tottenham Hale-Cheshunt and always has been. The routes being transferred to London Overground are the Chingford branch, the Enfield branch and the line originally known as the Churchbury loop. Lee Valley services remain with the GA franchise.

 

[rwebster]

Can people get their terminology right? The Lee Valley route is (Stratford)-Tottenham Hale-Cheshunt and always has been. The routes being transferred to London Overground are the Chingford branch, the Enfield branch and the line originally known as the Churchbury loop. Lee Valley services remain with the GA franchise.

This doesn't reflect common usage, although I won't pretend to be 100% sure on the correct historical and internal Network Rail names.

The route via Tottenham Hale is the West Anglia Main Line. The entirety of the routes from Liverpool Street to Cheshunt (whether via Waltham Cross or Theobalds Grove), Chingford and Enfield Town - inter-related as they are - are collectively known as the Lee Valley Lines.

As an aside, I'm personally hoping for trains with longitudinal seats. Anecdotally (certainly via Seven Sisters) at least half of passengers are making short journeys to connect with the Victoria Line. The large Edmonton Green to Seven Sisters flow (8 minute journey) being particularly notable.

 

[306024]

Sorry to disagree, but trains are timed 'via Brimsdown' or 'via Southbury'. The Brimsdown route is the Lea Valley, the Southbury route these days is usually simply referred to as the Southbury loop. Although I recall the Churchbury loop terminology, it has fallen into disuse over the years. I have never heard the Southbury route referred to as the Lea Valley, because it isn't.

The Chingford and Enfield lines used to be capable of being worked by 3x3car class 305 EMUs, but at that time the bay at Cheshunt could only accommodate 7 cars. It was lengthened to 8 cars under NXEA. Operating anything longer into Cheshunt bay doesn't work, and operating all trains as 8 cars all day would cost a fortune if it wasn't necessary.

 

[Chris125]

On which: how much additional work would be required to extend platforms to allow 5 car operation on GOBLIN and 10 car (200m) operation on the Lea Valley routes?

The bay platform at Gospel Oak is unlikely to allow anything longer than 4x20m and rebuilding would be a significant expense given it's location. South Tottenham, situated next to an underbridge and between two junctions, is similarly constrained.

Chris

 

[jopsuk]

which means, as there's little chance of the new fleet being extended then, that Aventras may be more likely Bombardier's offer (though 4x20m, so a different version to that of Crossrail).

I'd guess that had TfL been allowed to extend Oyster to Hertford that that branch might have been included. I wonder how many extra units this would have required?

 

[mr_jrt]

One has to wonder if it wouldn't make more sense to retain 4-car 378s and get new build 5 car trains for the existing services.

 

[jopsuk]

There's 57 378s, the new fleet is to be 39 strong. So no, it wouldn't make sense.

 

[Emblematic]

Besides, the 5th car 378 work is already well underway, with at least one unit built and undergoing tests, so it would be difficult to cancel or amend that contract now.

 

[Carlisle]

The Chingford and Enfield lines used to be capable of being worked by 3x3car class 305 EMUs, .

I remember them in the early 80s on that route many seemed to have a small round sticker on the front cabs "The Jazz Train " does anyone know what that meant ?

 

[jopsuk]

The Liverpool Street-Enfield service when it was steam hauled was nicknamed the "Jazz Train", though whether this was something to do with the frequent service or coloured carriages seems unclear...

 

[306024]

Google 'Liverpool Street Jazz Trains'. Lots of fascinating history there. The stickers on the 305s were to promote a more frequent timetable in the 80s, but I guess the meaning was lost on most regular commuters.

 

[Carlisle]

Thanks for both ansewers I'll check it out