London North Eastern Railway (LNER) First Class service

[Blindtraveler]

And indeed still does on XC and VTWC

 

[trainophile]

Apart from anything else, I would have thought it would be cheaper to give passengers a tea or coffee rather than alcohol. Very strange logic going on.

 

[Blindtraveler]

Maybe this is a way of proving complimentary catering on this franchise is unviable and scrapping or majorly changing it yet again?

 

[Chrism20]

I'm still confused on why this change has been made? The old system of a run of hot drinks followed by trolleys of food/cold drinks seemed to work perfectly well.

No doubt there will have been some focus group somewhere and one random individual will have suggested it and some marketing plank will have thought it was a great idea.

Apart from anything else, I would have thought it would be cheaper to give passengers a tea or coffee rather than alcohol. Very strange logic going on.

Miles cheaper without a doubt.

Maybe this is a way of proving complimentary catering on this franchise is unviable and scrapping or majorly changing it yet again?

I can't see it being scrapped however the costs have got to have increased.

For info the hot drinks were served just as the train was sailing through Peterborough so it was an hour after departure. I was sitting at the north end of L. This service is an HST so it's not like I was at the south end of M and it's taken twenty minutes to come through the train.

 

[MrCub]

Had a number of First Class trips on East Coast over the last few days. Disappointed with the new vegetarian breakfast. While the glorified mushrooms and cheese on toast is very nice indeed, I preferred the old veggie grill. No extra toast to be seen. Evening meals have been ok with a risotto and a rather good chocolate and cherry roulade. Clearly Rail Gourmet has a batch of clotted cream to use up because it's appearing on both VTEC and XC menus at the moment.

I'm sure it's been debated before but I'll ask anyway: would you prefer FREE meals even when the quality and portions can be questionable, or a traditional restaurant car where full high quality meals were served but were paid for, Pullman style?

 

[Bungle73]

Had a number of First Class trips on East Coast over the last few days. Disappointed with the new vegetarian breakfast. While the glorified mushrooms and cheese on toast is very nice indeed, I preferred the old veggie grill. No extra toast to be seen. Evening meals have been ok with a risotto and a rather good chocolate and cherry roulade. Clearly Rail Gourmet has a batch of clotted cream to use up because it's appearing on both VTEC and XC menus at the moment.

I'm sure it's been debated before but I'll ask anyway: would you prefer FREE meals even when the quality and portions can be questionable, or a traditional restaurant car where full high quality meals were served but were paid for, Pullman style?

Can I go for the good quality, paid for, meals, but served at your seat, option? As much I like the free grub currently provided, I'm sure the quality, choice, and portion size would be much better if one had to fork out some cash. I'm not sure I could be bothered with faff of a full-on separate restaurant coach.

 

[trainophile]

Depends on the length of the journey. If it was just a couple of hours I'd bring my own food rather than pay for it. If I was on the full Chieftain journey I would be tempted, but only if the price wasn't too pretentious!

 

[Blindtraveler]

Restaurant or at seat paid dining for me I would enjoy a guaranteed good meal rather than a guaranteed hit or miss

 

[Bletchleyite]

Restaurant or at seat paid dining for me I would enjoy a guaranteed good meal rather than a guaranteed hit or miss

Agreed, even better if DB style affordable bistro type food but served on proper plates.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[Blindtraveler]

Have never experienced this but heard many a good thing about it.

From my admittedly limmeted knoledge of train catering logistics I would have thought a nenu featuring the likes of saussage/vedgy saussage and mash, tomato pasta with or without bacon, burger/fish and chips, soup and fresh made sandwitch, curry and rice and filled baked spuds as well as range of ice cream and cakes could be done to order by a sheff. As it is EMT already manage to offer a range of ready meals on demand so this is simply an evolution of this

 

[FQTV]

Have never experienced this but heard many a good thing about it.

From my admittedly limmeted knoledge of train catering logistics I would have thought a nenu featuring the likes of saussage/vedgy saussage and mash, tomato pasta with or without bacon, burger/fish and chips, soup and fresh made sandwitch, curry and rice and filled baked spuds as well as range of ice cream and cakes could be done to order by a sheff. As it is EMT already manage to offer a range of ready meals on demand so this is simply an evolution of this

From memory, this is almost exactly what GNER did with its Bistro service on some non-restaurant trains. It was served on crockery, in the 125 half carriage and first half of K on 225s. A paper placemat was laid, with a cutlery wrap.

I remember having late events in London, and still sitting down to sausage and mash on the 22:00 to Newcastle.

 

[ScotTrains]

I'm sure it's been debated before but I'll ask anyway: would you prefer FREE meals even when the quality and portions can be questionable, or a traditional restaurant car where full high quality meals were served but were paid for, Pullman style?

I would prefer complimentary meals. That way there is no extra charges when you board. Also there is no reason the quality should be compromised. ArrivaTrainsWales have excellent quality complimentary meals. On many quieter routes, eg into/out of Scotland, I don't think there would be a high enough demand to sustain a Pullman style service. Also complimentary onboard meals help to attract passengers who may otherwise travel standard class.

 

[AlterEgo]

I would prefer complimentary meals. That way there is no extra charges when you board. Also there is no reason the quality should be compromised. ArrivaTrainsWales have excellent quality complimentary meals. On many quieter routes, eg into/out of Scotland, I don't think there would be a high enough demand to sustain a Pullman style service. Also complimentary onboard meals help to attract passengers who may otherwise travel standard class.

Don't forget the ATW complimentary offer is on a train which is ruinously expensive to the Welsh taxpayer via subsidy. It doesn't run to a traditional business case.

 

[Starmill]

Don't forget the ATW complimentary offer is on a train which is ruinously expensive to the Welsh taxpayer via subsidy. It doesn't run to a traditional business case.

Indeed. It's also very different in terms of cost, for example the onboard upgrade for Cardiff to Shrewsbury is only £15. You're getting a fantastic quality 3 course meal with hot and soft drinks, and being able to make your journey in First Class style envious (although not branded as such) for £15.

Nowhere on East Coast do you get that kind of value!

(Obviously you require a valid Standard Class ticket too, but an Anytime Day Single for this 107 mile journey is just £42. Again not comparable with the pence per mile you get out of Kings Cross).

 

[Kite159]

Did the 08:00 Kings Cross to Edinburgh service yesterday, so it was the weekend breakfast menu until York (a Raspberry yogurt with seeds/nuts you could mix together, plus a muffin with maple syrup in the middle.

After York it was the "all day" menu offering the choice between Salmon or Egg Mayo for the sandwiches.

If it wasn't that I had to change my trip from a weekday to a Saturday morning I wouldn't have bothered to pay the extra, 3 drink runs isn't worth the extra

 

[30907]

Indeed. It's also very different in terms of cost, for example the onboard upgrade for Cardiff to Shrewsbury is only £15. You're getting a fantastic quality 3 course meal with hot and soft drinks, and being able to make your journey in First Class style envious (although not branded as such) for £15.

Even cheaper with a Railcard. OT and not for further comment - ATW informed me this week that the Business Class upgrade was only available at weekends and bank holidays....

 

[Chrism20]

Had a number of First Class trips on East Coast over the last few days. Disappointed with the new vegetarian breakfast. While the glorified mushrooms and cheese on toast is very nice indeed, I preferred the old veggie grill. No extra toast to be seen. Evening meals have been ok with a risotto and a rather good chocolate and cherry roulade. Clearly Rail Gourmet has a batch of clotted cream to use up because it's appearing on both VTEC and XC menus at the moment.

I'm sure it's been debated before but I'll ask anyway: would you prefer FREE meals even when the quality and portions can be questionable, or a traditional restaurant car where full high quality meals were served but were paid for, Pullman style?

I can't understand the logic in discontinuing the veggie breakfast. The only reason I can think of is that the potato item has been replaced with black pudding.

It's quite poor that a decent offering has been taken away though. Out of interest has anyone asked VTEC why they have done it?

Regarding free/paid for. I'm fairly happy with the free options at the moment. I think the quality has significantly improved.

I do miss the restaurant car though and would happily pay to use it even if a free option were available. In fact an enhanced menu at a supplement would appeal to me but logistically that would be an absolute nightmare for the crew.

 

[trainophile]

If there was a restaurant car, how would you reserve your other seat while you used it? If you are going to be in there over a station call, you might get back to find someone occupying your seat.

 

[Butts]

If there was a restaurant car, how would you reserve your other seat while you used it? If you are going to be in there over a station call, you might get back to find someone occupying your seat.

Perhaps you could have the restaurant seat for the entire journey ?

In the days of Coffee, Cognac, Petit Fours and Cigars a couple of hours would be quite achievable.

 

[boyaloud]

Even cheaper with a Railcard. OT and not for further comment - ATW informed me this week that the Business Class upgrade was only available at weekends and bank holidays....

I'm interested in this and tried searching the forum to no avail (nospam thing swon't work). So if I book an advance single for a train in the week at that time, if I board can I just pay the upgrade and get all the perks of the meal? Sounds brill! Or will it be dependant on the guard?

 

[30907]

When I've done it, I've booked at a station in the morning to make sure of my dinner, but ISTR people boarding and paying. This was before the redesignation to business class but I don't think that matters.
Only had breakfast once and that wasnt pre booked.

 

[Greenback]

Please start a new thread if anyone wishes to discuss ATW catering, and leave this one to VTEC.

 

[MrCub]

If there was a restaurant car, how would you reserve your other seat while you used it? If you are going to be in there over a station call, you might get back to find someone occupying your seat.

Always wondered what happened in those cases, even today on the GWR Pullman. Any offers?

 

[Starmill]

I was on the 1046 from Doncaster to Kings Cross yesterday, no refurbished sets within the +-1 hour time you are now offered with an Advance ticket, and the catering was disappointing.

It was still the breakfast menu, which would have suited me except for the fact that they have gotten rid of the vegetarian breakfast. I asked if they were able to prepare the breakfast as a vegetarian option as I have had this on VT before even though it isn't on the menu, but she looked at me like I was crazy.

I asked what they had that was vegetarian and the only option was porridge. Apparently they didn't have any mushroom rarebit or anything else. It was a little odd having porridge at 1115, but I wouldn't have minded if it had been warm enough. It was very poorly presented and very thick and congealed because it wasn't quite hot enough. It tasted OK, and having bananas and syrup in it is a nice idea, and it's a good thing to have as a breakfast option, but it wouldn't have been my preference (even of the things on the new, worse menu). I was offered toast after Grantham and did at least get two slices when I asked. Only 1 run of juice and 1 hot drink for Doncaster to London I thought was a bit stingy. I overheard some other passengers who boarded at Grantham (dep 1118) complaining that breakfast was the only thing on offer. I can kind of see why too, as the website is very vague and just says 'until 1100'. I tried to get an answer out of them on twitter about the threshold but they didn't seem to know.

Must try harder with that really.

The 2035 from London back to Leeds was quite good, but there was huge disruption so we were around an hour late. I got the tagine which was very tasty and not too small, but not really suitable for an evening meal, even with crisps and cake (I hadn't bought anything else in my distraction about the disruption). On the plus side the red wine was very tasty and I was given a whole bottle of it to take with me when we were arriving at Leeds.

 

[Blindtraveler]

I think the Wine saved it for you after a generally lackluster experience

 

[Starmill]

Yes it was very good. There wasn't much in the way of food going down on that train (it's common to be offered sandwiches and extra fruit, crisps or cake later in the journey after you've had the main, which we were not, but I guess this isn't advertised and is unlikely late at night). I think in part to make up for our late arrival they were happily doling out booze though!

 

[JB1601]

On the subject of the veggie brekkie I did contact Virgin a couple of weeks ago as I couldn't see a good reason for losing it either. This is what they replied with:

-----
Our Product Delivery Team takes great care with and pay the upmost attention to. We want our customers to enjoy the service we provide and the planners work hard to balance the likely demand against the available resources and commercial considerations.

When developing the menu, they felt that the grill did not reflect the quality of food that they wanted to be able to offer our vegetarian customers. They worked closely with James Martin to develop the rarebit and mushroom on toast and the yoghurt and granola dishes, which they felt were dishes our First Class customers would truly enjoy.

In working with James Martin they have invested in their offer and hope that the customers can see this through the quality and provenance of the ingredients. We are sorry that this is not the case in your experience and we will take your feedback on board when developing future offers.

Thank you again for taking the time to contact us, I hope this has helped to explain our position within the matter.
---

So apparently it's an improvement. They did change it a number of times over the years - halloumi swapped out for some weird potato cake, then an omlette, and possibly something else.

I blame James Martin...

 

[Chrism20]

When developing the menu, they felt that the grill did not reflect the quality of food that they wanted to be able to offer our vegetarian customers. They worked closely with James Martin to develop the rarebit and mushroom on toast and the yoghurt and granola dishes, which they felt were dishes our First Class customers would truly enjoy.

In working with James Martin they have invested in their offer and hope that the customers can see this through the quality and provenance of the ingredients. We are sorry that this is not the case in your experience and we will take your feedback on board when developing future offers.

Well they have certainly mastered the art of waffle. I don't know what's more laughable. That they think the majority of customers would swap a cooked breakfast for mushrooms on toast or that they required the assistance of a celebrity chef to "Develop" yoghurt with granola!!!

If that's the case I suggest they get in touch with the breakfast chef at the brand new Hilton London Bankside as her freshly toasted granola blows James Martins attempt completely out the water.

 

[Merthyr Imp]

Travelled on the 1300 from King's Cross through to Edinburgh on 18 July. My first experience of first class travel anywhere other than between Cardiff and Paddington. I didn't make a note of the precise sequence of events and the times, but hot and cold drinks were brought around fairly soon after departure, plus the orange drizzle cake was offered - although not served on a plate. Orders for food were taken and served fairly quickly - I had chicken curry rather than the moussaka which I was expecting, but no complaints as it was quite good and there was just about enough. No drinks were offered when it was served, but I had saved cans of lemonade from earlier. Had to eat the cake which I had also saved from earlier while finishing off the lemonade as no tea was brought round until long afterwards.
While there were further offerings of drinks later on, I was more or less hoping for a sandwich or sausage roll to be offered later on, but while further food orders were taken after Newcastle it was only people joining at that station who were canvassed.
I found it disappointing that the only food of any kind offered was the initial choice from the menu plus cake, with not even biscuits or crisps served with subsequent offerings of hot/cold drinks.
This contrasts with Great Western, when you may only get things like cake, crisps and biscuits offered, but you can at least count on all of these along with hot/cold drinks after every station called at.
We returned from Edinburgh on the West Coast as far as Birmingham today (Friday) and this was a whole lot better on a similar journey time. At a 1051 departure it was the Brunch menu with a bacon roll and chocolate biscuits with tea (although not actually served WITH the bacon roll), with the various drinks servings en route. On departure from Crewe at 1401 it had evidently moved on to the Afternoon menu - with tables re-set - and that was offered to everyone, so I was able to have the chicken sandwich along with crisps.
Despite a bacon roll not being in the same league as the chicken curry I would definitely put the West Coast experience ahead of the East - so the LNWR won after all!

 

[STEVIEBOY1]

I was on the 1046 from Doncaster to Kings Cross yesterday, no refurbished sets within the +-1 hour time you are now offered with an Advance ticket, and the catering was disappointing.

It was still the breakfast menu, which would have suited me except for the fact that they have gotten rid of the vegetarian breakfast. I asked if they were able to prepare the breakfast as a vegetarian option as I have had this on VT before even though it isn't on the menu, but she looked at me like I was crazy.

I asked what they had that was vegetarian and the only option was porridge. Apparently they didn't have any mushroom rarebit or anything else. It was a little odd having porridge at 1115, but I wouldn't have minded if it had been warm enough. It was very poorly presented and very thick and congealed because it wasn't quite hot enough. It tasted OK, and having bananas and syrup in it is a nice idea, and it's a good thing to have as a breakfast option, but it wouldn't have been my preference (even of the things on the new, worse menu). I was offered toast after Grantham and did at least get two slices when I asked. Only 1 run of juice and 1 hot drink for Doncaster to London I thought was a bit stingy. I overheard some other passengers who boarded at Grantham (dep 1118) complaining that breakfast was the only thing on offer. I can kind of see why too, as the website is very vague and just says 'until 1100'. I tried to get an answer out of them on twitter about the threshold but they didn't seem to know.

Must try harder with that really.

The 2035 from London back to Leeds was quite good, but there was huge disruption so we were around an hour late. I got the tagine which was very tasty and not too small, but not really suitable for an evening meal, even with crisps and cake (I hadn't bought anything else in my distraction about the disruption). On the plus side the red wine was very tasty and I was given a whole bottle of it to take with me when we were arriving at Leeds.

I had a couple of similar things like that happen to me a few years ago, one was on Virgin West Coast when they gave you those small wine bottles, I think I got on a Euston bound service at Stoke on Trent and the stewardess gave me three of those bottle straight away. Then on a delayed York to KX Train even in STD Class they were offering free drinks and I was given a half bottle of wine, although soon after they just made the free drinks teas and coffee.