London Midland Ticket Checks

[beeza1]

I have been using London Midland Services in the West Midlands occasionally for the last few years, and have always been impressed by the near 100% record of checking tickets on board, a couple of weeks ago we were using a LM service and much to my surprise on both the outward and return journeys the guard never came round, neither train was very busy, on both services people were knocking on the cab door and paying their fares, obviously not expecting the guard to come round,(had they done this on a Northern service they would probably been told politely, but firmly to return to their seats and wait for the guard to come round).
Is this a case of LM making their own rules?
I am not aware of any ruling that states "you must actively seek out the guard",I think there was a thread about this a while ago.

 

[185143]

If someone does seek out the guard onboard to get it ticket, it could save them from having to queue at the barriers at new street/Moor Street/Snow Hill...

 

[Bungle965]

If someone does seek out the guard onboard to get it ticket, it could save them from having to queue at the barriers at new street/Moor Street/Snow Hill...

And being saved the hassle of being taken to one side, and being asked why you did not buy at the originating station/or on board.
Sam

 

[beeza1]

And being saved the hassle of being taken to one side, and being asked why you did not buy at the originating station/or on board.
Sam

Do all stations served by LM have ticket purchasing facilities?
I am more interested in why the guards made no effort whatsoever to come round checking tickets, we have this problem in Northern land where we have lots of unmanned stations, although it has got better since ticket barriers were introduced.

 

[island]

As LM has a penalty fares scheme it is required to provide methods of purchasing tickets at its penalty fares stations.

 

[CheesyChips]

I've used LM services extensively for the past 10 years and have found sometimes there's a check and sometimes there isn't and neither situation is particularly remarkable.

 

[strawbrick]

In the London area, ticket inspections on the trains are as rare as hens teeth! There are a few Conductors who will always come through and check, but the vast majority stay in the end cab.

As for the gate-line, at my local station this is generally unmanned, even in the morning rush hour, as are the two stations either side of mine. All five stations are generally "open" stations from about 18.00 until the last train, and again from the first train in the morning. Similarly, Euston is typically unmanned when I am late home in the evening; I am told it is alos unmanned in the very early morning (so ticketless travel is quite easy).

It is many months since I last saw a traveling Ticket Inspector.

All of this is because over the last year LM have made many of the staff redundant.

Yet again, as with the "increase" in the number of trains on the St Albans Abbey branch (1 train a day each way), re-instating something which you have taken away is given as a reason for extending a franchise!

 

[the sniper]

I have been using London Midland Services in the West Midlands occasionally for the last few years, and have always been impressed by the near 100% record of checking tickets on board, a couple of weeks ago we were using a LM service and much to my surprise on both the outward and return journeys the guard never came round, neither train was very busy, on both services people were knocking on the cab door and paying their fares, obviously not expecting the guard to come round,(had they done this on a Northern service they would probably been told politely, but firmly to return to their seats and wait for the guard to come round).
Is this a case of LM making their own rules?
I am not aware of any ruling that states "you must actively seek out the guard",I think there was a thread about this a while ago.

The vast majority of LM stations in the West Midlands have ticket purchasing facilities, be it Booking Office, TVM or Permit to Travel machine. As has been said it's a Penalty Fare area. On the Cross City line in particular it's normal for people to come to the back cab to buy a ticket, normally for convenience as it avoids them having to use a TVM, or queuing to buy a ticket, or missing the train while they purchase a ticket, or of course risk getting a Penalty Fare, or because they now don't want to queue at New Street as you can't get out without a ticket and the queue for tickets there is long. Guards don't normally check tickets on the core Cross City and it isn't really encouraged. Plus most West Mids Guards are fairly relaxed about tickets so will sell the cheapest available ticket if someone comes up and asks for a ticket having not taken the opportunity to purchase before boarding.

 

[Tubeboy]

Pretty rare not being ticket checked when travelling from London to Lichfield and return.

 

[martinsh]

Travel regularly Crewe - Stafford / Wolverhampton. Ticket checking less that 50% or the time.

 

[323235]

(had they done this on a Northern service they would probably been told politely, but firmly to return to their seats and wait for the guard to come round)

Never had this situation on Northern of being told to bugger off. Either they say the avantix battery has gone, card machine isn't working and ask if I have cash , sell me a ticket or they apologise for not coming round. I've knocked on the door many times as well.

 

[David57]

I was surprised a couple of months ago when on a Birmingham To Liverpool service, a couple of people were without tickets, and paid the conductor 'as a matter of course'.

No penalty ticket, no 'unpleasantness', just paid and continued their journey, as if thats how they expected things to be...

Listening to them after the conductor had had his money, the two seemed to 'well we didn't get away with it today'...

Both Professionals, with a national Bank company (from their name badges)...

 

[northwichcat]

From my experience ticket checks happen frequently on Liverpool-Birmingham services but not Crewe-Euston services.

 

[BestWestern]

I was surprised a couple of months ago when on a Birmingham To Liverpool service, a couple of people were without tickets, and paid the conductor 'as a matter of course'.

No penalty ticket, no 'unpleasantness', just paid and continued their journey, as if thats how they expected things to be...

Listening to them after the conductor had had his money, the two seemed to 'well we didn't get away with it today'...

Both Professionals, with a national Bank company (from their name badges)...

'Pay when challenged' is not at all uncommon. And, frankly, it's difficult not to see why people do it, really, if there is little incentive to do otherwise. So long as they do indeed pay, most tend not to take issue with it.

 

[strawbrick]

In the London area, ticket inspections on the trains are as rare as hens teeth! There are a few Conductors who will always come through and check, but the vast majority stay in the end cab.

As for the gate-line, at my local station this is generally unmanned, even in the morning rush hour, as are the two stations either side of mine. All five stations are generally "open" stations from about 18.00 until the last train, and again from the first train in the morning. Similarly, Euston is typically unmanned when I am late home in the evening; I am told it is alos unmanned in the very early morning (so ticketless travel is quite easy).

It is many months since I last saw a traveling Ticket Inspector.

All of this is because over the last year LM have made many of the staff redundant.

Yet again, as with the "increase" in the number of trains on the St Albans Abbey branch (1 train a day each way), re-instating something which you have taken away is given as a reason for extending a franchise!

The Power of this Forum / What a co-incidence ...
This morning there was a ticket inspector at the barrier, the first in months, doing a roaring trade in excess fares from arriving passengers.

 

[Islineclear3_1]

In the London area, ticket inspections on the trains are as rare as hens teeth! There are a few Conductors who will always come through and check, but the vast majority stay in the end cab.

I have made numerous journeys from Euston to Leighton Buzzard (mostly on a Saturday) and ticket checks have been carried out shortly after leaving Euston on every journey

 

[plastictaffy]

Unfortunately, a lot of our colleagues will not walk trains, ever. As they see it, they are Guards, not travelling ticket inspectors. Stupid attitude, if you ask me, but there it is. It's also worth mentioning that it isn't actually a contractual requirement for us to walk all (or even any trains) if we don't feel it is safe to do so, or the train is too busy. Our first and foremost job is to ensure the safe operation of the doors and despatch of the train from stations. Although I don't sign the Cross City routes, I have some colleagues from other depots that do, and AIUI it is extremely difficult to get through trains to check and sell tickets, both due to the clientele and the intensive nature of the work there.
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I have made numerous journeys from Euston to Leighton Buzzard (mostly on a Saturday) and ticket checks have been carried out shortly after leaving Euston on every journey

Depnds on the stopping pattern, tbh. If it's booked at WFJ, it's pretty pointless, as a lot of passengers will be on Oyster cards, and we can't check if they've tapped in or not.