London Bridge reconstruction works

[fusionblue]

Yes it would be also the interchange is quicker as well.

The time between arriving train and first tube shrinks to 7 minutes, plus i'll have luggage and those stairs with luggage can be... fun

 

[neilm]

Hmm I am not sure those timings are correct as under the new London bridge you are further from the tube now, but it is step free... I don't think there is any correct answer to your question...

 

[fusionblue]

Hmm I am not sure those timings are correct as under the new London bridge you are further from the tube now, but it is step free... I don't think there is any correct answer to your question...

My question was based around whether is it any faster (or if there is any faster routes) to the tube, but it appears there isn't.

 

[ijmad]

My question was based around whether is it any faster (or if there is any faster routes) to the tube, but it appears there isn't.

From the terminal platforms (Southern) you can still walk out in front of the Shard and either go down through the Shard concourse or use the escalators from the old Cannon Street platforms to Joiner Street, which is now an un-gated area.
From the through platforms there's not much choice. I would feel better about being in the back half of the train, as at least you won't end up turning back on yourself...

 

[SF-02]

But only temporary till August next year, when the down services swap to 6&7 so on the same island. The SE platforms may well be busier until Friday due to serving as substitute for Cannon Street for the next 2 days.

They will be busier until Friday no doubt.

But also after, to a lesser degree, as timetable changes leaves long gaps. 25 mins in the PM rush hour to Deptford, Greenwich etc. One delay/cancellation and the amounts waiting for that line will be high with a 45 minute gap to very busy stations.

 

[Barn]

They will be busier until Friday no doubt.

But also after, to a lesser degree, as timetable changes leaves long gaps. 25 mins in the PM rush hour to Deptford, Greenwich etc. One delay/cancellation and the amounts waiting for that line will be high with a 45 minute gap to very busy stations.

They'll be waiting for a very long time for those two stations at London Bridge though... Until 2018!

 

[ScotGG]

Ah yes of course. I guess a fair few people will walk to London bridge though given the long gaps at Cannon Street, which'll add to the pressure at London Bridge.

Anyway, tonight is again not great at all. Long gaps for SE trains.

 

[MattyH]

It was interesting looking out from my train home at how very narrow most parts of the platforms are. The problem is that whilst the platforms are adequately wide overall, a huge part of the width is taken up with the void for the escalator/stairway space. This leaves much narrower usable spaces.

Indeed - the platforms are wider once you get away from the escalators but doing that is not easy. I imagine people will get used to it to an extent. I don't think people will wait downstairs - people will want to be on the platform at nearer the doors when the train comes in. Am a complete amateur but it looks to me like there's been a bit of architectural and engineering overkill with big voids where bigger platforms would be better.

 

[AM9]

Indeed - the platforms are wider once you get away from the escalators but doing that is not easy. I imagine people will get used to it to an extent. I don't think people will wait downstairs - people will want to be on the platform at nearer the doors when the train comes in. Am a complete amateur but it looks to me like there's been a bit of architectural and engineering overkill with big voids where bigger platforms would be better.

Apart from the problem of the (slightly wider) platform being overloaded whilst the crush to get downstairs spreads to the edges every morning when each train unloads.

The bottom line is that a tradeoff has been made between platform capacity and train capacity. With 'maximum length for the route' trains, the waiting passengers can at least spread out, apart from those who insist on squeezing into end cars.

 

[mr_jrt]

Given the ambition of the bridge decks design I wonder if they considered extending the station width out over the top of Tooley Street, making it a cut through new arches (or just closing it entirely). Still, too late now.

I'm not sure it's too late, and I did wonder if that is why the design has platform 1 as a side platform, rather than an island as present. If required in the future it is quite conceivable to build another rail deck for a platform 0. I doubt Cannon Street will ever need 4 platforms as Charing Cross does (it's getting 3), but Thameslink might warrant an extra tidal one given it will only have 2 as planned.

 

[telstarbox]

Popped in this morning - genuinely impressed with the spacious new concourse and it looks as good as the artist impressions. Didn't actually manage to get a train to Charing Cross but that's another story.

In the evening peak the position of the escalators should help with spreading passengers evenly on the train - passengers at Charing Cross and Cannon Street will still board at the back but then passengers at London Bridge will board towards the middle. Hopefully in due course, morning passengers will work out that they don't need to be at the front if they're alighting at London Bridge.

 

[neilm]

Popped in this morning - genuinely impressed with the spacious new concourse and it looks as good as the artist impressions. Didn't actually manage to get a train to Charing Cross but that's another story.

In the evening peak the position of the escalators should help with spreading passengers evenly on the train - passengers at Charing Cross and Cannon Street will still board at the back but then passengers at London Bridge will board towards the middle. Hopefully in due course, morning passengers will work out that they don't need to be at the front if they're alighting at London Bridge.

That's what passengers want to do, but unless SE run longer trains it won't happen.

 

[Bald Rick]

but Thameslink might warrant an extra tidal one given it will only have 2 as planned.

Tidal in which way in which peak?

 

[infobleep]

Some early impressions. A long walk from the northern line to the platforms for SE London - used to be a quick trip up the escalators. The signage needs improving. Those platforms are very narrow. Minor delays and already congested where the escalators meet the platforms. No incentive to move on and when the first big delay happens, the up escalators will need to be switched off - big wide voids for the escalators but very poor design. Seems that trains for common destinations could leave from platform 7 or platform 8, which don't share an island. Like the old station, of course, but not an improvement.

But I imagine there'll be plenty of shops downstairs.

A bit of a 'mare on the tube even if you know the place.
I've seen tube staff with those big hand things up the stairs pointing to the other exit/entrance and that it is about it.
no signs/posters or announcements telling people where to go.

First impressions travelling from the tube not good. The signs to All Platforms take you to the old passageway which was barred off. Frustratingly there were no signs nor staff advising where to divert. Then having found the entrance on St Thomas Street (which could really do with a sideways facing double arrow sign) the staff were all Southeastern and refused to help as to why every Forest Hill service was cancelled, "not my company" was the response.

Why is it that signage is often found to be lacking? Is it just my unlucky experience or do they really not pay attention to such details?

They had a trail run in advance so you'd think that might have come out of it as something that needed addressing. I don't know of users were asked to feedback any issues.

Sent from my SM-G925F using Tapatalk

 

[MrB]

Both commutes were fun today (not)! 30 odd down on the way home and sat between Waterloo and LBG for about 20 mins at 18:30 if anyone knows why?! Train was 18:06 CHX to ORE

 

[Bald Rick]

Both commutes were fun today (not)! 30 odd down on the way home and sat between Waterloo and LBG for about 20 mins at 18:30 if anyone knows why?! Train was 18:06 CHX to ORE

Points failure at London Bridge this morning (not new points either) combined with a track circuit failure at Lewisham.

This evening was a communication cord pulled on an outbound train at London Bridge. Presumably somebody wanted a longer look at the new work.

 

[ScotGG]

Horrible overcrowding and very poor PPM on both days so far. To be expected really with so few trains and long gaps, which is easily compoumded by any issues.

One problem I did see is that not enough trains are 12 cars. I know the issues, but it didn't seem enough. I can't believe heads weren't banged together 5 years ago to ensure by now that SE Metro is mostly 12 car for the whole rebuilding upheavel and continuing passenger number rises.

The issues have been raises a million times so no point going over again, but the infrastructure can handle some 12 cars. This was a good example to see how many could be put on to help cope. Not too good really based on what I saw. Just how many were 12 cars overall?

 

[NathanPrior]

Both commutes were fun today (not)! 30 odd down on the way home and sat between Waterloo and LBG for about 20 mins at 18:30 if anyone knows why?! Train was 18:06 CHX to ORE

Signal failure between Charing X and London Bridge.

 

[mr_jrt]

Tidal in which way in which peak?

Off the cuff, I would imagine two westbound platforms in the morning peak and two eastbound in the evening peak, but I look forward to being shot down.

Main premise being that you would want to have increased dwell times given the interchange levels at London Bridge.

 

[Bald Rick]

Off the cuff, I would imagine two westbound platforms in the morning peak and two eastbound in the evening peak, but I look forward to being shot down.

Main premise being that you would want to have increased dwell times given the interchange levels at London Bridge.

The signalling for the TL platforms (4&5) is designed to take up to 20tph per platform with 90 second dwell times. Which is 50% longer than the planned dwell times elsewhere in the core. No need for anything longer than that with the class 700s - which can easily disgorge 500 people and board a similar number in well under a minute (as happens at St Pancras every morning currently).

 

[amarshe]

Platform 15 a bit better, but still a bottleneck in the morning as people squeeze through the narrow bit towards the upper concourse. Will this ever be solved?

 

[kentman]

The issues have been raises a million times so no point going over again, but the infrastructure can handle some 12 cars. This was a good example to see how many could be put on to help cope. Not too good really based on what I saw. Just how many were 12 cars overall?

Had a 12 car into Platform 3 of Charing Cross this morning, Sidcup line. Looking at the Sectional Appendix only Platforms 1-3 at Charing Cross are cleared for 12 car 465 networkers, unlike Cannon St where all Platforms are. So it would be a limitation.

 

[FOH]

Platform 15 a bit better, but still a bottleneck in the morning as people squeeze through the narrow bit towards the upper concourse. Will this ever be solved?

I noticed this evening that despite platform 10 being in its final configuration crowd control is still used

 

[IanKR]

Had a 12 car into Platform 3 of Charing Cross this morning, Sidcup line. Looking at the Sectional Appendix only Platforms 1-3 at Charing Cross are cleared for 12 car 465 networkers, unlike Cannon St where all Platforms are. So it would be a limitation.

Never seen a 12-car train on the Bexleyheath line. The longest we get are 10-car Electrostars or 10-car 465/6 combis. Are they due?

 

[neilm]

I noticed this evening that despite platform 10 being in its final configuration crowd control is still used

I assume it will be better on the basis of lots of the current trains will become Thameslink so there will be less trains, and one like the 18:20 that uses platform 10 can use one of the island ones where there is much more room.

 

[ijmad]

I noticed this evening that despite platform 10 being in its final configuration crowd control is still used

Lots of people seemed to be waiting at the bottom of the stairs in the new concourse and popping up out of the escalators/stairs though.
Is it possible they're using crowd control because there are more people to be waiting in the upper concourse until the new route to the tube station is finished, etc.?

 

[FOH]

Possibly, I was surprised however because I was under the impression that once the hoardings were taken down on 10 & 15 we would no longer need crowd control.

 

[Stew998]

Possibly, I was surprised however because I was under the impression that once the hoardings were taken down on 10 & 15 we would no longer need crowd control.

10 does seem problematic, I think that is the one the 0804 arrival from Eastbourne tends to come in on and it is still a crush to get off with queues forming and people walking through the train. Can't remember that ever happening with the old layout. Most people still seem to be heading out though the old concourse and out to Southwark or across London Bridge. The new lower concourse looks nice but if it's not your direct route to where you're going then it's just scenery.

Whether this will change as people get to know the new layout and discover new routes to get where they need to be only time will tell. Possibly most people just want to get to Southwark or across the bridge.

 

[Taunton]

Had a 12 car into Platform 3 of Charing Cross this morning, Sidcup line. Looking at the Sectional Appendix only Platforms 1-3 at Charing Cross are cleared for 12 car 465 networkers, unlike Cannon St where all Platforms are. So it would be a limitation.

This is just a feature of Charing Cross. The west side platforms (1-3) have long been 12 car and were the only ones able to take the 12-CEP etc that ran Kent Coast trains from electrification. The east side platforms (4-6) are JUST 10-car, the country ends out onto Hungerford Bridge are notably narrow. The quite small station concourse is mostly the area in front of 4-6 and could not be eaten into by platform extension, it's bad enough at present during any disruption. It's a real quart into a pint pot, and also why half of the trains there can be no more than 10 car.

 

[SF-02]

Unless SE had metro trains with SDO of course to use 4-6?

London Bridge to Lewisham stretch completely closed from 11:15 to 12:00. What's being fixed?

This week has been a disaster really for SE Metro and the new station.