Loading Gauge - Sunderland Station

[blue sabre]

I have read somewhere that the loading gauge at Sunderland Station since the staiton was adapted for Metro services is unsuitable for MKIV coaches. Apart from the obvious fact a Class 91 would be unable to haul them there, what is it specifically that restricts them from using the station?

 

[The Planner]

Probably out of gauge and would scrape nicely along the platform edge at a guess.

 

[swt_passenger]

Allowed with a restriction according to the online sectional appendix, which states:

Between Park Lane Jn and Greensfield Jn Mk4 + AC Electric locos are permitted diesel hauled for diversionary purposes only with pantographs locked down.

It may be that 'locking the pantographs down' isn't straightforward, I don't know, but the text does imply drags are allowed.

 

[142094]

I have read somewhere that the loading gauge at Sunderland Station since the staiton was adapted for Metro services is unsuitable for MKIV coaches. Apart from the obvious fact a Class 91 would be unable to haul them there, what is it specifically that restricts them from using the station?

As has been mentioned the only reason I can think of why a 91 could not go through is due to the panto. I wouldn't have thought that the platforms would cause a problem since other stock is able to go through alright.

 

[Sir_Clagalot]

might be to do with the tunnels, Ive heard it scrapes the roof if not secured properly...

 

[A60K]

might be to do with the tunnels, Ive heard it scrapes the roof if not secured properly...

Is the pantograph locking requirement not because of the Metro overhead line equipment at 1500V DC and the problems that would result if a Class 91 pantograph was raised onto them?

 

[Ploughman]

I would have thought that locking down the pantograph was a standard requirement when being hauled anyway unless required for hotel load power supply purposes.
If it wasn't locked down the actual height attainable would foul most bridges.

 

[142094]

Is the pantograph locking requirement not because of the Metro overhead line equipment at 1500V DC and the problems that would result if a Class 91 pantograph was raised onto them?

That is what I've always believed. IIRC there was a similar topic on this last year about whether the Durham Coast line could be used for drags when the ECML is shut south of Newcastle, and at the time I'm sure someone had said something similar about mkIVs.

 

[Old Timer]

Thew locking down of the pan is standard procedure when a train is diesel hauled off an electrified route. Its no big deal and dignifies nothing else.

Loading gauge issues could be to do with end-throw, centre-throw, swept kinematic envelope clearances, platform heights, etc. The route will obviously have been modified to suit its normal operation.

 

[142094]

Just wondering are there any major differences between the loading gauge of a mkIII compared to a mkIV?

 

[Old Timer]

Just wondering are there any major differences between the loading gauge of a mkIII compared to a mkIV?

Both the vehicles were constructed to run within the BR standard loading gauge, so carriages do not have a "loading gauge" as such. Indeed no railway vehicle has a loading gauge as such, they are simply constructed to fit within the standard loading gauge.

Contrary to what has become a widespread misunderstanding, the designations C1, C3, and C4 are not relevant to gauging as such, but simply indicate a 21m and 23m length vehicle (C1 & C3) and a vehicle built to tilt (C4).

 

[PinzaC55]

I've heard that when Sunderland station was first used by Grand Central Trains there was a problem with the exhaust fumes setting off the fire alarms.For the same reason I also think steam trains are banned from this route now.

 

[MidnightFlyer]

Mk 4's cant use it. Because of the Goddamn Metro.

 

[ainsworth74]

I've heard that when Sunderland station was first used by Grand Central Trains there was a problem with the exhaust fumes setting off the fire alarms.

Yeah the exhaust from the two HST Valenta's was a bit too much, so these days they only use one power car when in the station. There is some info in a thread somewhere, possibly the GC General Discussion thread but good luck finding it in their the things like 1000 posts long
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Mk 4's cant use it. Because of the Goddamn Metro.

As far as I am aware Mk4's as in the coach's only can, its the 91s that can't unless the pantograph is locked down. There have been some 91+Mk4 drags through Sunderland I think.

 

[142094]

I've heard that when Sunderland station was first used by Grand Central Trains there was a problem with the exhaust fumes setting off the fire alarms.For the same reason I also think steam trains are banned from this route now.

When the 47s and 57s were doing the Sunderland - York shuttles, they had the same problem.

Also welcome to the forums, notice you from your excellent flickr site

 

[Andrew Nelson]

I've heard that when Sunderland station was first used by Grand Central Trains there was a problem with the exhaust fumes setting off the fire alarms.For the same reason I also think steam trains are banned from this route now.

Not with the huge Vacuum system they have now I doubt it.

 

[142094]

Not with the huge Vacuum system they have now I doubt it.

I haven't heard about this, is it one of the new installations put in with the refurb?

 

[Sir_Clagalot]

As far as I know, the extraction system has always been there, and it is on when the Northern come in, just on a lower setting to when GC arrive!!