LNER to Goole?

[Swimbar]

All ECS moves to Hull,by LNER, from Doncaster Carr or occasionally Neville Hill are routed via Goole.
The service train to/from Hull operates via Selby.
Given that the population of Goole is bigger than Selby why dont LNER serve Goole instead of Selby?

 

[bunnahabhain]

Selby was a traditional call on the East Coat Main Line and continues to receive Intercity services to this day on the Hull line from LNER and Hull Trains. Looking at just the station usage figures Selby has double that of Goole. I should imagine if the demand were truly there from Goole that Hull Trains would have capitalised on the market by running one or two a day that way. They don't, so perhaps there's little demand for a through train.

 

[Jorge Da Silva]

All ECS moves to Hull,by LNER, from Doncaster Carr or occasionally Neville Hill are routed via Goole.
The service train to/from Hull operates via Selby.
Given that the population of Goole is bigger than Selby why dont LNER serve Goole instead of Selby?

Correct me if i am wrong but i think they did until the 2000's

Wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hull_Executive

Prior to 2000, it was routed via Goole instead of Selby. Reference: "GNER to revive Selby-London service" The Railway Magazine issue 1187 March 2000 page 12

Don't have access to the magazine at all before anyone asks.

 

[30907]

Correct me if i am wrong but i think they did until the 2000's

Wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hull_Executive



Don't have access to the magazine at all before anyone asks.

You are correct; I can't remember whether HT or GR moved first!
ISTR that the Google swing bridge was a factor - either more vulnerable or simply more shipping to ram it, because it was downstream. Or was it because the platforms at Goole were short? I don't remember!

 

[NoMorePacers]

ISTR that the Google swing bridge was a factor - either more vulnerable or simply more shipping to ram it, because it was downstream. Or was it because the platforms at Goole were short? I don't remember!

Platforms at Goole are only long enough for a 5 car unit off the top of my head - certainly couldn't fit a full length HST (historically relevant) or 9/10 car Azuma on them.

Goole Bridge nearly caused the line east of the station to be shut in the 1980s around the time the Selby diversion opened - the bridge was due for renewal and BR didn't fancy coughing up for it so suggested closure and diverting all services from Hull to Doncaster via Selby instead (in fairness there's little time difference between going via Selby and going via Goole even nowadays despite the route via Selby being nearly 10 miles longer) - thankfully that wasn't carried out however. Thus I'd imagine Goole Bridge is still rather more temperamental than Selby's especially given the latter was fairly recently renewed.

 

[bramling]

Platforms at Goole are only long enough for a 5 car unit off the top of my head - certainly couldn't fit a full length HST (historically relevant) or 9/10 car Azuma on them.

Goole Bridge nearly caused the line east of the station to be shut in the 1980s around the time the Selby diversion opened - the bridge was due for renewal and BR didn't fancy coughing up for it so suggested closure and diverting all services from Hull to Doncaster via Selby instead (in fairness there's little time difference between going via Selby and going via Goole even nowadays despite the route via Selby being nearly 10 miles longer) - thankfully that wasn't carried out however. Thus I'd imagine Goole Bridge is still rather more temperamental than Selby's especially given the latter was fairly recently renewed.

I wonder how many people travel east of Goole. I’d assume Goole leans more heavily towards Doncaster and South Humberside than Hull?

 

[NoMorePacers]

I wonder how many people travel east of Goole. I’d assume Goole leans more heavily towards Doncaster and South Humberside than Hull?

I've certainly noticed that Doncaster-Hull services are busier west of Goole than they are east of it both before and during the pandemic- so I suspect your analysis of the situation is correct.

 

[tbtc]

Looking at just the station usage figures Selby has double that of Goole

That may be more about Leeds commuter traffic being more significant than those working in Doncaster (and, even if as many people in Goole worked in Donny as people of Selby worked in Leeds, Doncaster is a much easier place to drive into and park relatively cheaply in, compared to Leeds), so this may be more about everyday commuters/shoppers doing relatively local journeys than any indication of London demands.

That said, Selby seems a bit "richer" than Goole from my limited visits, so that would indicate to me that there's probably more demand for Selby to have a London service. Howden serves much of the same car driving market that Goole does (both convenient for the M62 and A614).

I can't remember whether HT or GR moved first!

My memory (and, it's going back twenty years) is that HT started going via Selby from day one, so that they were offering something different to the established BR/ GNER service - but GNER amended their service to "fight back" - maybe the fact that HT were providing a "new" town with a London link helped in their bid to enter the market? (I appreciate that Selby used to have London services, but I don't think it did at privatisation (?))

 

[DB]

That said, Selby seems a bit "richer" than Goole from my limited visits,

Neither of them are particularly affluent towns.

 

[HamworthyGoods]

The Goole stops in the Hull Executive were taken out to allow removal of the unsafe wooden platform extensions at Goole during Intercity days.

The service was later diverted In GNER days to serve Selby.