Liverpool council to scrap bus lanes?

[507 001]

Just heard on bbc news that Liverpool council are looking in to scrapping ALL of the cities bus lanes (possibly as early as next month) as they appear to be causing more congestion than they are worth.

What are your thoughts on the matter?

Personally I think this is a good move from t he council. It's going to take more than a few bus lanes to get people onto the busses, which are horrific in most cases.

 

[radamfi]

There's little point running buses if they just get stuck in traffic. In those circumstances, they are only used by people who have no choice. That's why advanced European countries like the Netherlands build elaborate busways to ensure bus punctuality.

 

[83G/84D]

The problem in Truro is that the "bus lanes" are basically just a few re-hashed lane markings on an existing road which was not significantly altered to allow for a proper bus lane. It starts near Truro Park & Ride on the western approach to the City then vanishes after a short distance and then re-appears by Treliske Hospital. From here it carries on towards the City for around half a mile before vanishing again not to re-appear. Therefore the bus driver has to keep going back into the main traffic flow and rely on other motorists letting him out.

There is no bus lane at all going in the opposite direction out of the City and nothing in and out of the east end of the City at the moment.
This may change with the advent of a development and another Park & ride at the east end of the city although I remain to see how a bus lane would work and be accomodated as the existing road seems unsuitable for a bus lane or lanes.

Plymouth is much more suitable for bus lanes as the roads are wider and can accomodate them especially in the City centre such as Royal Parade.

There may well be issues with bus lanes here however as I am not a resident or bus driver I am not aware of any.

It seems though from the Truro situation that bus lanes are only as good as where they are put. In the case of Truro, trying to adapt an existing road to fit in a bus lane hasn't worked all that well.
But the bigger picture is that the City of Truro is having more developments such as housing, supermarkets built around it and in it and the traffic is increasing but there are no significant road building schemes or improvement works meaning delays and queues for most of the day.

There will always be delays to buses entering or leaving the city unless dedicated bus routes are built which I doubt will happen in the present financial climate.

 

[WatcherZero]

Whenever I visit Liverpool its just one big car park, can see why the buses would be suffering because the other lanes it has to cross are at a standstill.

 

[gordonthemoron]

The problem with Liverpool's bus lanes is they are ill thought out

 

[dave4jackie]

The problem with Liverpool's bus lanes is they are ill thought out

where are the bus lanes

 

[Statto]

The problem with Liverpool's bus lanes is they are ill thought out

Exactly, there's so few bus lanes in Liverpool, it's hard to notice them. One bus lane in particular on the A57 heading into Liverpool from Eaton Road to Old Swan has been blocked off for years, despite it looking perfectly usable.

 

[anthony263]

Swansea council have been pretty good putting bus lanes in which are seperate from normal traffic.

One bus lane which I wish they didnt scrap was the one into London along the M4, certainly Megabus and National Express used it often to bypass some of the congestion one of the reasons why the 04:00 Cardiff - London Victoria Megabus used to regulary get into London 20 minutes early. These days it doesnt get into London til at least 07:40

 

[Deerfold]

Swansea council have been pretty good putting bus lanes in which are seperate from normal traffic.

One bus lane which I wish they didnt scrap was the one into London along the M4, certainly Megabus and National Express used it often to bypass some of the congestion one of the reasons why the 04:00 Cardiff - London Victoria Megabus used to regulary get into London 20 minutes early. These days it doesnt get into London til at least 07:40

That was very much a political decision as when the bus lane was in place average traffic speeds (not just for taxis and coaches) were higher.

 

[radamfi]

You don't need a motorway bus lane if you allow buses onto the hard shoulder like in the Netherlands.

If you look at

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3jpwNziKJlo

7 seconds into the video you can see the sign "Bij file lijnbussen op vluchtstrook" which means "If there are queues, service buses are on the hard shoulder"

You can see that sign a lot of the way along the Breda to Utrecht motorway.

 

[WatcherZero]

A lot of hard shoulders in the UK are deliberately rough to wake you up if you wonder into them and discourage people using them to undertake arent they? They would have to be resurfaced or it would be a very poor ride for the bus passengers.

 

[radamfi]

Resurfacing a hard shoulder isn't a big deal. Overnight lane closures happen regularly for resurfacing.

In the Netherlands as well, there are numerous motorway junctions that are for buses only.

 

[Deerfold]

Resurfacing a hard shoulder isn't a big deal. Overnight lane closures happen regularly for resurfacing.

Resurfacing all of them in a short time scale may be - and would make them more attractive for rule-breaking car drivers.

 

[radamfi]

We have already converted many hard shoulders for use at busy times, for example the M42 and M6 in the West Midlands. (Another Dutch invention). So drivers already have the 'opportunity' to break the law by driving on these hard shoulders when they are not in use. Other sections of hard shoulder are currently being converted to full time use.

Presumably illegal driving on hard shoulders could occur in the Netherlands. If only a few people do it then it wouldn't make much difference to bus journey times. If it became an epidemic then cameras would be required, like there were on the M4 bus lane.

 

[WatcherZero]

Should be pointed out where its been done in the UK the M42 and M6 as you note, its been done with 24 hour CCTV and controllers watching the lane cameras for accidents, hardly cheap.

 

[radamfi]

Should be pointed out where its been done in the UK the M42 and M6 as you note, its been done with 24 hour CCTV and controllers watching the lane cameras for accidents, hardly cheap.

Oh yes, hard shoulder running isn't cheap. It is just cheaper than building an extra lane. However, resurfacing the hard shoulder so that buses can use it is presumably not that expensive.

 

[34D]

You don't need a motorway bus lane if you allow buses onto the hard shoulder like in the Netherlands.

If you look at

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3jpwNziKJlo

7 seconds into the video you can see the sign "Bij file lijnbussen op vluchtstrook" which means "If there are queues, service buses are on the hard shoulder"

You can see that sign a lot of the way along the Breda to Utrecht motorway.

There is a bus lane from the Forth Road Bridge a lot of the way to Edinburgh (hard shoulder).
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Let's not forget that Birmingham City Council removed the bus lane on Tyburn Road.

I hope that Liverpool city council reconsider.

 

[radamfi]

There is a bus lane from the Forth Road Bridge a lot of the way to Edinburgh (hard shoulder).

I knew about the long standing Ferrytoll scheme but I didn't know about the new M9/M90 hard shoulder bus lanes.

http://www.docstoc.com/docs/157873833/M9-bus-lane-leaflet---Transport-Scotland

I thought there might be some law preventing buses running on a hard shoulder but Scotland shows it can be done!

 

[8J]

There are bus only entrances for busses such as Lime St to London Road, however, as for bus lanes, well Upper Parliament St and Park Road spring to mind. Also by Liverpool South Parkway station on Woolton Rd