Lines that should be four track

[Zoe]

Which lines should be four tracks? Most of these it will be impossible to build extra tracks though as there is no land available.

The most obvious ones I can think of:

Law Junction to Glasgow Central.

Drem to Edinburgh Waverly.

Rugby to Birmingham New Street.

King's Norton to Birmingham New Street.

Welywn.

Huntingdon to Peterborough.

With the exception of the last one, none of these will likely ever be four tracked as there just isn't the land available.

 

[Darandio]

Darlington to Newcastle, despite being impossible. Although if the Leamside was re-opened, its then only a case for Darlington to Ferryhill, but hey-ho.

 

[IanPooleTrains]

Is Crewe to Manchester or Stoke to Manchester four track?

 

[rail-britain]

The most obvious ones I can think of:
Motherwell to Glasgow Central.
Drem to Edinburgh Waverly.

I would actually go further than that, and start from where the urban lines join the WCML and ECML respectively

This would be extremely useful between Ravensturther (Carstairs) and Polmadie (Glasgow Central)
However, crossing down slow trains at Rutherglen could be fun!
This might also explain the proposal to swap some service from Glasgow Central LL to HL

 

[Zoe]

I would actually go further than that, and start from where the urban lines join the WCML and ECML respectively

I have changed the location my post from Motherwell to Law Junction. This is where the edge of the urban area is.

 

[allticketspls]

Tottenham Hale to Cambridge

 

[OxtedL]

All the way from Three Bridges to Brighton.

 

[swt_passenger]

Basingstoke to Shawford and Eastleigh to St Denys...

 

[O L Leigh]

Tottenham Hale to Cambridge

Just from Coppermill Junction to Broxbourne Junction would do.

O L Leigh

 

[Fincra5]

All the way from Three Bridges to Brighton.

Thats a deffo must.

 

[ChrisCooper]

Particularly as they want to route more Freight from the East onto the WCML at Nuneaton, Syston Junction to Wigston Junction could do with 4 tracking where possible.

 

[50010 Monarch]

Dr Days Junction to Filton.....I know hindsight is a wonderful thing but a very short sighted 1980's de-quadrifying IMO.

 

[jopsuk]

Caring not for practicality:
Waverley to Kings Cross. All the way, plus obviously the additional tracks in London
Liverpool Street to the junction for Stansted Airport via Tottenham Hale
Waverly to Queen Street via Falkirk High

Deploy the bulldozers, tunnel borers and diggers. Break out the dynamite. Let the bridges soar. Objections? PAH! Planning consent? lets not bother. Lets do this!

 

[allticketspls]

Just from Coppermill Junction to Broxbourne Junction would do.

O L Leigh

Sorry dude I'm just greedy. I say that the Southbury Loop should be done as well :P

 

[Bald Rick]

All the way from Three Bridges to Brighton.

Presumably to run more services to/from Brighton in the peak. But where would they go when they got Croydon?

 

[Cherry_Picker]

Stourbridge to Dorridge would be nice. Tyseley to Dorridge should certainly be four tracked again.

 

[The Planner]

Rugby to Birmingham New Street.

Cov to New St yes, Rugby no, doesn't need it and has plenty of capacity left on it.

King's Norton to Birmingham New Street.

I dont think that does either, you could get rid of a lot of problems if you switched the tracks and used the centre platforms at Kings Norton and Northfield. You would need to build an island at Longbridge though. The current Gloucester bound tracks (I can't remember which way is up and down....) become the fast lines and the Brum bound tracks become the slows. Would need reversals at New St but the time saved would mitigate it and you get rid of ECS shunts at Longbridge.

Stourbridge to Dorridge would be nice. Tyseley to Dorridge should certainly be four tracked again.

Stourbridge to Snow Hill doesn't need it at all and you could get away with not four tracking all of it to Dorridge. Solihull to Dorridge would probably do it as a lot of the clashes occur at Bentley Heath Crossing.

 

[route:oxford]

Here's a few...

Oxford to Didcot to help accommodate the variety of slow and fast services.

As much track West of Waverley as physically possible.

Carmuirs junction as far as Queen Street Tunnels.

 

[W-on-Sea]

Shenfield to Colchester (or at a minimum to Witham)
Fenchurch Street to Barking (though only really useful in the rush hour, then it'd be really useful..)

and to second Oxford to Didcot

 

[Zoe]

I dont think that does either, you could get rid of a lot of problems if you switched the tracks and used the centre platforms at Kings Norton and Northfield. You would need to build an island at Longbridge though. The current Gloucester bound tracks (I can't remember which way is up and down....) become the fast lines and the Brum bound tracks become the slows. Would need reversals at New St but the time saved would mitigate it and you get rid of ECS shunts at Longbridge.

But you are still forcing an intensive metro service to share the same tracks with intercity services from King's Norton to New Streeet.

 

[The Planner]

No im not, you send the XC around the Camp Hills.

 

[Zoe]

No im not, you send the XC around the Camp Hills.

I see to remember you or someone saying that there were no paths for this last time I suggested it.

 

[4SRKT]

Dublin Connolly to Howth Junction.

 

[OxtedL]

Presumably to run more services to/from Brighton in the peak. But where would they go when they got Croydon?

It's a bit of a pinch point, and definitely a planning nightmare as things currently stand. It'll be the first bit of the BML that get's redone (after Windmill Bridge) when the massive BML redevlopment that's required when capacity runs out completely in 20 or 30 years time.

A passing place on the Oxted wouldn't go amiss at peak times either (very susceptible to delay from everywhere during the peaks - happened a little today)

 

[43106]

The entire ECML from Kings Cross to Marshgate Junction and the entire WCML from Euston to Weaver Junction. A lot of both are 4 track anyway, buit the lot should be done. To that, you can add Newcastle - Northallerton.

 

[DaveNewcastle]

'Lines that should be four tracks' eh?
There's still hundreds of miles that have never even had the luxury of double tracks even in the boom years! (Most of the Higland Mainline). And several where even just a third bi-di line for freight, locals or ECS would be a real improvement. But I'm sorry, folks, 'cos I know that these thoughts really should be on a separate thread.

Four tracking is often constrained by bottlenecks in tunnels and over bridges or viaducts.
On the ECML there's Stoke and Peasecliff tunnels (either side of Grantham) and the 2 tunnels at Welwyn, plus busy viaducts at Durham, Welwyn, Chester-Street and the Forth Bridge.
On the Western, there's the dual section between Foxhall Jn (Didcot) and Swindon and from there through Box Tunnel and the 3 subsequent tunnels before Bath, with 5 more tunnels before Bristol. (then the single line linking Cornwall with the rest of the planet at the Tamar Bridge).

 

[Ivo]

Only covering areas I actually know...

Another vote for Didcot to Oxford. Oxford may have fairly decent links but they could be better; were Bristol services to resume, that could cause problems.

Another vote for Shenfield to Colchester. This should have been done a long time ago, although Chelmsford would be a serious bottleneck. Clacton should probably have two London trains an hour, with one running slower.

I would like to agree with W-on-Sea with Fenchurch Street to Barking but TfL would have other ideas!

Another vote for Three Bridges to Brighton. I would even suggest consideration is giving to diverting all West Coastway to London services to Brighton from both ends, and giving the Hove tunnel route a peaks-only service.

Another vote for the WCML through Birmingham.

Another vote for the Cross-City Line via Selly Oak.

One of my own would be the North London Line, to allow greater freight access and also the potential for non-Crossrail links across the capital.

Another vote for Welwyn.

Another vote for Dr Days to Filton AW. They can throw in stations at Ashley Hill and Horleaze [I think] while they're at it.

And lastly, another vote for the line through Tottenham Hale to Broxbourne.

 

[OxtedL]

I would even suggest consideration is giving to diverting all West Coastway to London services to Brighton from both ends, and giving the Hove tunnel route a peaks-only service.

I think that could be going a bit too far, at least in an ideal world. London is an important market, although capacity issues may eventually see this the case. Would need more West coastway platforms at Brighton, and wouldn't be politically sound in one of the most politically volatile areas (well, until Clegg) in the South East (outside London)

 

[Welshman]

It's been mentioned on other threads, but the Manchester-Leeds via Standedge line deserved mention here.
There's been talk of opening one of the two remaining single-line bores through Standedge, and there may be room to add extra tracks again between Standedge and Huddersfield, although that may result in a lower speed limit on some of the bends.
I don't know about restoring the Spen Valley and Micklehurst Loops though. Are those now completely built over?

 

[Cherry_Picker]

Stourbridge to Snow Hill doesn't need it at all and you could get away with not four tracking all of it to Dorridge. Solihull to Dorridge would probably do it as a lot of the clashes occur at Bentley Heath Crossing.

Dunno about that. I'll concede the point about Stourbridge, though it would be nice to have the option of running fast between Snow Hill and Worcester, but Dorridge to Tyseley is a bug bear of mine. Yes, Bentley Heath crossing is the major pinch point and having slow lines into Dorridge would certainly help there (the up passenger loop is a half assed fix) but I have lost count of the number of times that I have been delayed by a local service on the down. Even with a decent headway it is possible to catch a stopping service up before it gets to Solihull. The line used to be four track and while there are several places where the old trackbed has been replaced by other things, Widney Manor and Acocks Green car parks being the most visible, it would still be beneficial if the line was four tracked between the end of the four track section at Tyseley and the end of the PTE at Dorridge. I'm not holding my breath, there are a thousand other things that money will probably be spent on before that particular part of the west midlands gets considered for upgrades, but it is a busy corridor through a highly populated area with plenty of express trains and local services and if capacity was greater then I think even more passengers would use it than currently do.