Lincoln to Boston Service?

[DeltaAustralia]

At about 20:45 on evenings, there used to be a train that went from Lincoln to Boston, via Sleaford, but it was almost completely pointless, being at that time of night and only running once per day.

Would it be a good idea to have, say, a two-hourly service from Lincoln to Boston, calling at all stations?

Currently, there is an hourly Lincoln/Doncaster to Peterborough service and an irregular Nottingham to Skegness service at Sleaford.

Why is this service important? Because the Lincolnshire Loop Line, which used to go from Lincoln to Boston, will probably never be reopened, so another direct service on a different route would be a good idea.

This would also tie in with my proposed station reopening at Branston & Heighington (which I've done a lot of work on the campaign for).

The stations are Lincoln, possibly Branston & Heighington in the future, Metheringham, Ruskington, Sleaford, Heckington, Swineshead, Hubberts Bridge and Boston.

 

[class26]

At about 20:45 on evenings, there used to be a train that went from Lincoln to Boston, via Sleaford, but it was almost completely pointless, being at that time of night and only running once per day.

Would it be a good idea to have, say, a two-hourly service from Lincoln to Boston, calling at all stations?

Currently, there is an hourly Lincoln/Doncaster to Peterborough service and an irregular Nottingham to Skegness service at Sleaford.

Why is this service important? Because the Lincolnshire Loop Line, which used to go from Lincoln to Boston, will probably never be reopened, so another direct service on a different route would be a good idea.

This would also tie in with my proposed station reopening at Branston & Heighington (which I've done a lot of work on the campaign for).

The stations are Lincoln, possibly Branston & Heighington in the future, Metheringham, Ruskington, Sleaford, Heckington, Swineshead, Hubberts Bridge and Boston.

The 20.45 from Lincoln to Boston was just a positioning turn to have the unit in Boston ready for the following morning. Living in Heckington I caught it a few times after a few beers in Lincoln, very useful ! On a Saturday night it was reasonably well used but it needs a more regular service between the two towns as the connections at Sleaford are hopeless for much of the day and no one is going to spend 30 - 45 minutes on a draughty station waiting for a connection. I n another thread i suggested a service that would be hourly to Sleaford then alternately to Peterborough or Doncaster, both for connections at the ECML as those at Grantham are totally useless. As you say stops could be at intermediate stations presently omitted then the Grantham service takes in Rauceby and Ancaster. Rauceby has many new houses and passenger figures had been rising nicely pre covid since the introduction of a second morning service. If it was hourly I suspect the figures would go up very well.

 

[GrimsbyPacer]

Lincoln to Boston would be so helpful from a Grimsby perspective, it's so hard to travel between the two towns by rail or bus, not because of the roads or track, but because there's no direct service.

 

[PTR 444]

I think this is a good idea, but could you perhaps start back at Skegness so you have a half-hourly service all the way from there to Sleaford?

 

[class26]

I think this is a good idea, but could you perhaps start back at Skegness so you have a half-hourly service all the way from there to Sleaford?

I guess some might start back in Skegness but my thinking was II haven`t worked it out) to keep the number of units needed to a minimum. Adding Skegness is adding over an hour to a rota and in the winter 2 an hour to Skegness is probably not needed. Maybe a morning and evening service properly timed extension would suffice ?

 

[backontrack]

I like the idea of alternating destinations between the Poacher line and Joint line so that it looks more like this:

0.5 tph Skegness-Wainfleet-Boston-Heckington-Sleaford-Ruskington-Metheringham-Heighington-Lincoln
0.5 tph Skegness-Wainfleet-Boston-Heckington-Sleaford-Ancaster-Grantham-Bottesford-Bingham-Netherfield-Nottingham

0.5 tph Peterborough-Spalding-Donington-Sleaford-Ruskington-Metheringham-Heighington-Lincoln (some continuing to Doncaster)
0.5 tph Peterborough-Spalding-Donington-Sleaford-Rauceby-Grantham-Bottesford-Aslockton-Bingham-Nottingham

Skegness and Boston lose their hourly connection to the ECML, but the new station at Donington helps offsets this by providing a quicker means of accessing Peterborough for motorists changing onto trains (and there's still a through service every two hours). It also means that Boz and Skeggy gain a connection to a key regional centre. Spalding loses half of its Lincoln trains but gains a through service to Nottingham, and also to Grantham which improves northbound connections up the ECML to Doncaster, Hull and Leeds (and might also provide a more convenient connection onto Liverpool-bound EMR services).

If there were any possibility of extending a (Skegness-)Boston-Lincoln service to run through to Doncaster or Newark - providing a connection onto the Edinburgh semi-fast at a decent time in each direction - then, well... (but that's extraordinarily unnecessary)

 

[DeltaAustralia]

0.5 tph Skegness-Wainfleet-Boston-Heckington-Sleaford-Ruskington-Metheringham-Heighington-Lincoln
0.5 tph Skegness-Wainfleet-Boston-Heckington-Sleaford-Ancaster-Grantham-Bottesford-Bingham-Netherfield-Nottingham

0.5 tph Peterborough-Spalding-Donington-Sleaford-Ruskington-Metheringham-Heighington-Lincoln (some continuing to Doncaster)
0.5 tph Peterborough-Spalding-Donington-Sleaford-Rauceby-Grantham-Bottesford-Aslockton-Bingham-Nottingham

I loved how you included Donington as well as Branston & Heighington

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 5 Jan 2022 ==

Lincoln to Boston would be so helpful from a Grimsby perspective, it's so hard to travel between the two towns by rail or bus, not because of the roads or track, but because there's no direct service.

So would it be a good idea for maybe one service in the Peak to reverse at Lincoln and go all the way to Grimsby? (Boston-Hubberts Bridge-Swineshead-Heckington-Sleaford-Ruskington-Metheringham-Branston & Heighington-Lincoln-Market Rasen-Barnetby-any number of stations here-Grimsby Town)

 

[GrimsbyPacer]

So would it be a good idea for maybe one service in the Peak to reverse at Lincoln and go all the way to Grimsby? (Boston-Hubberts Bridge-Swineshead-Heckington-Sleaford-Ruskington-Metheringham-Branston & Heighington-Lincoln-Market Rasen-Barnetby-any number of stations here-Grimsby Town)

The Lincoln to Grimsby service is overly busy anyway, so yes.

 

[David Goddard]

I like the idea of alternating destinations between the Poacher line and Joint line so that it looks more like this:

0.5 tph Skegness-Wainfleet-Boston-Heckington-Sleaford-Ruskington-Metheringham-Heighington-Lincoln
0.5 tph Skegness-Wainfleet-Boston-Heckington-Sleaford-Ancaster-Grantham-Bottesford-Bingham-Netherfield-Nottingham

0.5 tph Peterborough-Spalding-Donington-Sleaford-Ruskington-Metheringham-Heighington-Lincoln (some continuing to Doncaster)
0.5 tph Peterborough-Spalding-Donington-Sleaford-Rauceby-Grantham-Bottesford-Aslockton-Bingham-Nottingham

Skegness and Boston lose their hourly connection to the ECML, but the new station at Donington helps offsets this by providing a quicker means of accessing Peterborough for motorists changing onto trains (and there's still a through service every two hours). It also means that Boz and Skeggy gain a connection to a key regional centre. Spalding loses half of its Lincoln trains but gains a through service to Nottingham, and also to Grantham which improves northbound connections up the ECML to Doncaster, Hull and Leeds (and might also provide a more convenient connection onto Liverpool-bound EMR services).

If there were any possibility of extending a (Skegness-)Boston-Lincoln service to run through to Doncaster or Newark - providing a connection onto the Edinburgh semi-fast at a decent time in each direction - then, well... (but that's extraordinarily unnecessary)

I think it could work well, but only would if services are co-ordinated to connect at Sleaford to allow connections which would, when including these connections, pretty much maintain the current broadly hourly service on each axis as well.

The Spring 2021 timetable saw a significant improvement in services at the south end of the Joint line, and this I understand to be the first stage of a series of improvements, including more trains through to Doncaster. Extension of these and linking the above proposed Skegness - Lincoln services with the Newark stopper (or alternatively by joining with taking over the Northern service to Sheffield) would indeed further this connectivity, along with a full hourly service on the Nottingham to Grimsby route.

There is always a tradeoff between alternating patterns like this and a set of consistent hourly services with strong connections at core passing points- almost like a mini Takt system. I can see positive and negative points to both options, and this applies equally to rail and bus services.

The graphics below attempt to show bi-hourly alternating services against a regularly hourly one.
For clarity I have omitted station names, and I think most people on here can visualise the Lincolnshire area. Which pattern works best?

 

[GrimsbyPacer]

Is there really any need for the Newark Northgate shuttles now that LNER run into Lincoln?
You can still get to Newark Castle from Lincoln, also Peterborough, Retford, and Doncaster for East Coast expresses.

I would think hourly would work best for the passengers. many would have to change if the train only ran every two hours and then hope the other line had the right service, Boston to Lincoln will still need a change half the time, but now Boston to Grantham would as well.
A lot of hassle in a rather simple county in rail terms.
Grimsby to Sheffield, Peterborough to Grantham, would be a duplications.
Doncaster to Nottingham would be busy though, as Nottingham lacks Yorkshire journeys other than Sheffield.

 

[David Goddard]

Is there really any need for the Newark Northgate shuttles now that LNER run into Lincoln?

There is if you want to maintain the NNG link for Collingham, Swinderby and Hykeham. Unless EC want to stop there

 

[GrimsbyPacer]

There is if you want to maintain the NNG link for Collingham, Swinderby and Hykeham. Unless EC want to stop there

Swinderby is an empty field, and Collingham is no busier either, the stations are often deserted when I pass on my way to Newark Castle or Nottingham. Hykeham can be busy though.
Market Rasen's and Grimsby's NNG link loss was no big issue, in fact things are much much better now.

 

[adrock1976]

Regarding the Sheffield - Retford - Lincoln - Grimsby/Cleethorpes bi hourly, that would be a big dog leg as the shortest route between Retford and Grimsby is via Brigg.

I would prefer a simple 60 minute frequency for each arm (and providing a 30 minute frequency over common sections of route e.g. Gainsborough Lea Road - Lincoln Central every 30 minutes with the Sheffield and Doncaster trains) with good connections at Sleaford.

 

[30907]

Regarding the Sheffield - Retford - Lincoln - Grimsby/Cleethorpes bi hourly, that would be a big dog leg as the shortest route between Retford and Grimsby is via Brigg.

And for Sheffield there is also an hourly service via Scunthorpe.

Similar applies to the (post #9) Peterborough-Sleaford-Grantham-Nottingham suggestion.

Neither Retford-Grimsby nor Spalding-Nottingham is a significant flow.

The simplest ecnomical solution is to retime the Peterborough-Lincoln to connect out of the Skegness-Nottingham. A slightly more expensive one because of the longer turnround at Skegness would be to have the Skeggy trains cross at Boston.
That gives Sleaford approximately xx25 to Notts, xx35 to Skeggy, xx25 or xx30 to Peterborough and xx30 or 35 to Lincoln.

Of course, if resources permit you could overlay a Boston-Lincoln direct 2-hourly.

 

[adrock1976]

And for Sheffield there is also an hourly service via Scunthorpe.

Similar applies to the (post #9) Peterborough-Sleaford-Grantham-Nottingham suggestion.

Neither Retford-Grimsby nor Spalding-Nottingham is a significant flow.

Retford - Grimsby can only be done with a choice of three journeys on one day of the week, which explains how not a significant flow.

Although more for the Brigg Line thread, I would support extending the Sheffield - Gainsborough Central (when it runs) to Barton on Humber every 2 hours as per the Restoring Your Railway proposal, with ideally good connections at Barnetby (Barnetby has island platforms in both directions, so could wait a few minutes there if need be for connections into and out of the TPE Cleethorpes there).

 

[DeltaAustralia]

Although more for the Brigg Line thread, I would support extending the Sheffield - Gainsborough Central (when it runs) to Barton on Humber every 2 hours as per the Restoring Your Railway proposal

I actually support the Brigg Line generally. They should have regular weekday services there, rather than just 6 services per week.

 

[30907]

Retford - Grimsby can only be done with a choice of three journeys on one day of the week, which explains how not a significant flow.

It wasn't a significant flow when there was a weekday service either. Not that it wouldn't be lovely to have it back, but it's a bit OT.

 

[GrimsbyPacer]

I actually support the Brigg Line generally. They should have regular weekday services there, rather than just 6 services per week.

I have been told that all Brigg line trains have been suspended at weekends until further notice

 

[DeltaAustralia]

I have been told that all Brigg line trains have been suspended at weekends until further notice

That's true, unfortunately.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 13 Jan 2022 ==

View attachment 108283

Actually, that's brilliant! That would work well, and provide a variety of choice destinations. If that was well-advertised, that would probably attract quite a few new passengers!