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Lib Dems announce they would legalise cannabis

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backontrack

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(What a way to make my 4000th post!)

The Liberal Democrats have announced that they support the legalisation of cannabis.
https://www.buzzfeed.com/jimwaterso...ely-legalise?utm_term=.qgd1NPDLeM#.auGLwQy8q2
BuzzFeed [I](but I think it's legit)[/I] said:
The Liberal Democrats Will Pledge To Completely Legalise Cannabis

Exclusive: The party has told BuzzFeed News its manifesto will include a commitment to having a fully regulated UK cannabis market, including sale and production, which could raise up to £1 billion in extra taxes.

by Jim Waterson, UK BuzzFeed Political Editor

The Liberal Democrats have told BuzzFeed News they will pledge to legalise cannabis, allow it to be sold from high street shops, and spend the tax raised from sales on public health efforts in one of the most radical drugs policy manifesto commitments ever made by a British political party.

Tim Farron's party will campaign in the general election with a pledge to completely upend the existing system of selling weed, making it the first time a major political party has fought an election on a platform of legalising the drug.

Under the Lib Dem proposals the production and sale of marijuana would be fully legalised, with the quality strictly regulated to reduce harmful chemicals and sales restricted to over-18s. Purchases would be allowed only through licensed cannabis shops, similar to the system used in several US states.

The party predicts the decision could raise up to £1 billion a year in tax from cannabis sales while saving costs elsewhere by reducing the burden on the police, prisons, and the health service. The Lib Dems believe organised criminal gangs would suffer a hit to their income and dealers would be forced off the streets, while it would easy for people to access cannabis for medicinal purposes.

"What we currently do is bad for health and mental health," said Julian Huppert of the Liberal Democrats, confirming the manifesto commitment. "The market is run by criminal gangs and they have no interest in public health – the system is causing huge amounts of harm.

"The prohibitionist approach costs a huge amount of money, means we criminalise a large amount of people, and increases the harm. We spend a lot of money making people’s lives worse. That cannot be correct."

Huppert was MP for Cambridge from 2010 to 2015 and is now standing for the constituency again at this general election. He said the Liberal Democrats would appoint an independent regulator for the cannabis market and reduce the harm of the drug by requiring it to include lower levels of the active component THC and more of the harm-reducing CBD element.

“There are two components in cannabis," he explained. "One is the potent active form. And one is protective and prevents harm. Criminal gangs have bred strains which don’t have the protective element, so skunk causes much more harm than marijuana used to do. In the same way we regulate the alcohol content of a drink, you can regulate the strength."

During the coalition government years a Lib Dem junior minister at the Home Office commissioned research from civil servants on the potential financial benefits of taxing the cannabis industry. It concluded that existing drugs laws are not reducing drug usage.

However, the report was dismissed by the then Conservative home secretary, who was alleged to have removed several policy recommendations that suggested existing drug laws were failing. That home secretary is now prime minister Theresa May.

Other research, commissioned by the Cabinet Office for the Lib Dems in the final months of the coalition government, estimated that full legalisation of the UK cannabis market could produce between £500 million and £1 billion of revenue in tax.

The Lib Dem proposals would see local councils given control over the licensing of cannabis shops, with substantial extra funding made available in the future.

Liberal Democrat aides acknowledged that the policy could later develop into a pledge to legalise and regulate the use of recreational drugs such as MDMA but made clear that this would not be party policy at this election.

The party is also committed to repealing the recent Psychoactive Substances Act, which automatically criminalises all new drugs and banned the sale of most of the so-called "legal highs" such as the cannabis substitute spice. Previously available legally through shops, spice is now sold by criminals and has been blamed for a crisis of drug use in cities such as Manchester.

The approach is very different to other political parties'. The Conservatives have always strongly supported existing drug prohibition policy. A Labour spokesperson confirmed Jeremy Corbyn's party remains strongly opposed to legalisation of cannabis. Instead, Labour will focus on providing funds in an attempt to reduce drug usage and mitigate harm.

Leading Lib Dem figures will not be benefit from any change in the law. Tim Farron's spokesperson said his drug use was limited to smoking cannabis as a teenager.

When asked when he had last smoked a joint, Huppert replied: “I’m really boring. I’ve never had one. You can believe that or not. I am that dull. For me it’s a public health issue.”

Paddy Hash-down anyone? :lol:
 
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Howardh

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I don't mind, except for the sickly stench. Is there any way of avoiding the smell?
 

SS4

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...a law that prohibits smoking it in public?

Wouldn't work. I can smell when the neighbours are smoking it in the back garden and it's also a smell that lingers unlike cigarette smoke or a BBQ.

A low prohibiting smoking full stop would be fine with me - aren't the effects of second hand smoking still largely unknown?


As for the lib dems promising legalisation they can promise whatever they like - the whole world and his dog know they're more than happy to break them
 

AlterEgo

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Fully support the legalisation and regulation of cannabis. A shame it won't be policy in government for a long time.
 

Howardh

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...a law that prohibits smoking it in public?

In Amsterdam don't they have cafes where the stuff has to be consumed inside and can't be taken away? If that's the case, fair enough, but I certainly don't want it wafting around the garden. Next door's hubby has to smoke his cigars outside/in his shed. Manure smells sweeter....and means I can't sit outside until he goes back inside! Win for his missus, epic fail for the rest of humanity :cry:
 

Cowley

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In Amsterdam don't they have cafes where the stuff has to be consumed inside and can't be taken away? If that's the case, fair enough, but I certainly don't want it wafting around the garden. Next door's hubby has to smoke his cigars outside/in his shed. Manure smells sweeter....and means I can't sit outside until he goes back inside! Win for his missus, epic fail for the rest of humanity :cry:

You don't see many cigar smokers around these days, or pipe smokers actually.
There may be a reason for that I suppose.
 

Cowley

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It's hard to argue with the logic of the Lib Dem statement. There's a couple of problems with it on the recreational side of things in that it's slightly flying in the face of the general effort to stop people from putting smoke into their lungs (I realise you can vaporise it or eat it instead though).
Obviously also with smoking laws you wouldn't be able to sit in a cafe smoking it.

I think the main two parties will still feel that it's political suicide to legalise recreational drugs for a while yet though.
 

Howardh

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It's hard to argue with the logic of the Lib Dem statement. There's a couple of problems with it on the recreational side of things in that it's slightly flying in the face of the general effort to stop people from putting smoke into their lungs (I realise you can vaporise it or eat it instead though).
Obviously also with smoking laws you wouldn't be able to sit in a cafe smoking it.

I think the main two parties will still feel that it's political suicide to legalise recreational drugs for a while yet though.

You could if you had specialist ones. Trouble is, that would possibly take folk away from a pub - or do we go back to allowing smoking (and add drugs as well) in pubs?

On that discussion, I'd be OK with those pubs that have two or more separate and air-cleaned rooms having one aside for the coughers and wheezers, but aren't they slowly dying out (pun half-intended)?
 

SS4

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On that discussion, I'd be OK with those pubs that have two or more separate and air-cleaned rooms having one aside for the coughers and wheezers, but aren't they slowly dying out (pun half-intended)?

What about staff though? There's also the expense of course
 

richw

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Never used it but, if it was legalised would it make it controllable with its strength as well as ensuring purity?
Same with other drugs, if it was legal and controlled, it would impure street sales, reducing side effects and strange added ingredients which cause more harm?
 

yorksrob

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I have no problem with what is called "dad pot" I.e. traditional strains of 1960's cannabis being legalised. I do worry about this "skunk" that seems to be strong enough to engender long term mental illness. I feel the two are separate entities.

As for arguments about ventilated rooms in pubs etc, I remember having the same discussions about tobacco around fifteen years ago, so I'm enjoying the nostalgia !
 

richw

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I have no problem with what is called "dad pot" I.e. traditional strains of 1960's cannabis being legalised. I do worry about this "skunk" that seems to be strong enough to engender long term mental illness. I feel the two are separate entities.

As for arguments about ventilated rooms in pubs etc, I remember having the same discussions about tobacco around fifteen years ago, so I'm enjoying the nostalgia !

If it was legal it could be controlled, and only appropriate strains sold?
 

yorksrob

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If it was legal it could be controlled, and only appropriate strains sold?

Well that would be a bonus. One would know what one was getting ! Perhaps the Dutch cafe system would be worth emulating in that respect.
 

SS4

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Staff? Probably the users themselves. Might get a few off the dole queue.

I was thinking of the staff who have to collect glasses etc from the smoking areas. There has to be some H&S concern with second hand smoke from both tobacco and cannabis

There's also the expense of segregating the areas so the non-smoking sentence is not taking place.
 

DynamicSpirit

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I was thinking of the staff who have to collect glasses etc from the smoking areas. There has to be some H&S concern with second hand smoke from both tobacco and cannabis

There's also the expense of segregating the areas so the non-smoking sentence is not taking place.

Add to that the problem of people who don't smoke but whose friends do feeling socially obliged to go into the smoking areas with their friends (and as a result inhaling unwanted smoke).
 

yorksrob

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Add to that the problem of people who don't smoke but whose friends do feeling socially obliged to go into the smoking areas with their friends (and as a result inhaling unwanted smoke).

I never worried about that aspect in tobacco days. It was free choice. No one forced me to go into the smokey pub. For staff it's a bit different and there's justification for having the smoking room separated from the bar.

is someone having to enter a smokey room regularly to collect glasses, likely to be any worse off from someone walking our city streets regularly and enduring the byproducts of motor transportation ?
 
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SS4

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is someone having to enter a smokey room regularly to collect glasses, likely to be any worse off from someone walking our city streets regularly and enduring the byproducts of motor transportation ?

Yes, because there is a good chance they'll be doing both, this isn't an either/or. Plus the byproducts of motor transportation are currently a necessary evil for the economy and society to function as highly as they do now.

If someone wants to spend more time than necessary walking our city streets then that's entirely voluntary unlike having to enter a smokey room to collect glasses which is only an illusion of voluntary - one needs money to live and I don't see the sanction centre approving your benefit claim because your workplace was unhealthy.

That said I would be interested in knowing how many ppm of particles associated with smoking were in the air during the time smoking was allowed in pubs. I have anecdotal evidence of the smell sticking to clothes to the point where you had to wash them afterwards.
 

DynamicSpirit

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That said I would be interested in knowing how many ppm of particles associated with smoking were in the air during the time smoking was allowed in pubs. I have anecdotal evidence of the smell sticking to clothes to the point where you had to wash them afterwards.

Oh that was definitely the case. Back in the days when smoking in pubs was allowed, if I went out for an evening, I always then had to wash all the clothes I'd worn.

To my mind, going out to pubs etc. is much more pleasant now that I can do it without all the cigarette smoke.
 

ChiefPlanner

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Great idea - and it could if properly managed , regulated and taxed bring in some welcome life to a few struggling places - someone reckoned Wales could support about a 100 "coffee shops" , as well as creating jobs in retail and growing.

Another way to break this criminal supply system ,with Vietnamese slaves , appropriation of property (from disused banks , MOD bunkers and so on) , not to mention theft of electricity and so on.

The Spanish "social club" model is another way round it -

I am retired by the way , and not involved in any safety critical work or similar.
 
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