• Our new ticketing site is now live! Using either this or the original site (both powered by TrainSplit) helps support the running of the forum with every ticket purchase! Find out more and ask any questions/give us feedback in this thread!

Level Crossing Name north of Carnoustie

Status
Not open for further replies.

MariaJ

New Member
Joined
21 Mar 2023
Messages
4
Location
Montrose
Hi, this is a long shot and I'm not sure I'm posting in the right place.
Here goes - just outside Carnoustie going north before Easthaven there is a level crossing called Buckiehillock. Has anyone any idea where I could look to find the origin of the name?
Thanks in advance.
 
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R

RailUK Forums

Gloster

Veteran Member
Joined
4 Sep 2020
Messages
13,043
Location
Up the creek
Having had a look at various maps on the National Library of Scotland‘s website, I am unable to add anything other than that crossing appears to be down near Westhaven, which you probably already knew. None of the properties in the surrounding area seem to have had any similar name in the mid-nineteenth century. I can only suggest that it was a local name for a hillock or feature nearby: it was quite common for the railway to use such a name, so long as it distinguished the railway installation from others. The name then sticks and, for example, a bridge, cutting or crossing will still be named after a farmer who died over 150 years ago.
 

matchmaker

Established Member
Joined
8 Mar 2009
Messages
1,890
Location
Central Scotland
I believe it's the name of a farm. In the interwar years there was a community of huts there, similar to those that still exist at Carbeth.
 

GusB

Established Member
Joined
9 Jul 2016
Messages
8,173
Location
Elginshire
This is just a guess, but "buckie" is a name used for small shellfish like whelks.


buckie​

1 of 3

noun (1)​

buck·ie
ˈbəkē

plural-s
chiefly Scottish
: a spiral-shelled marine gastropod or its shell
especially : RED WHELK
buckie
2 of 3

noun (2)​

"
plural-s
Scottish
: a perverse intractable person

I must admit that I wasn't aware of the second definition!

There's another link here:

buckie n. the shell of a mollusc, an edible whelk
One of the earliest examples of buckie in the Dictionary of the Scots Language (www.dsl.ac.uk) comes from The Historie of Scotland written first in Latin by Johne Leslie and translated in Scottish by Father James Dalrymple (1596): “In fresh water buckies … na lesse than in salt water buckies growis the margarite [an archiac term for a pearl]”.



It possibly derives from the Latin ‘buccinum, a whelk’ which was used in dyeing to obtain the colour purple.



The edible little crustacean is remembered fondly by this Edinburgh native in the Edinburgh Evening News of 23rd February 2008: “We would spend it [pocket money] on mussels and buckies which looked like snails. The Newhaven fishwives would sell them on plates outside the pubs.” The Newhaven fishwives selling the buckies were also known as buckie wives as in this extract from Close Encounters in the Royal Mile by Alastair M R Hardie: “Several other characters seen in the city streets … and a Newhaven fishwife – ‘The Buckie Wife’ - who sat in the Lawnmarket in traditional dress beside a heavy wicker basket selling ‘portions of boiled whulks & buckies’.”



However, it is also used figuratively to indicate shyness or lack of confidence so to encourage someone to be a bit more assertive one can urge then to ‘come oot o their buckie’ that is to come out of their shell. This following is from a 1936 Aberdeen source: “He’s a quate auld stock, bit he’s fairly come oot o’s buckie the nicht.”



On an even more up-to-date note people can be encouraged to go into their shells but possibly not in the following example from the Aberdeen Evening Express of 19th September 2014: “What happens now to those so desperate for independence? Do they simply disappear into their buckies and keep their heidies doon for another 50 years? I think not.”
 

Gloster

Veteran Member
Joined
4 Sep 2020
Messages
13,043
Location
Up the creek
Googling buckiehillock will produce twenty results, of which three might help a tiny bit. One from 1940 refers to some hutments, a second from 2001 refers to it as Buckiehilliock Farm and the third (the penultimate) from 1866 refers to a will for someone living at Buckiehillock.
 

MariaJ

New Member
Joined
21 Mar 2023
Messages
4
Location
Montrose
Having had a look at various maps on the National Library of Scotland‘s website, I am unable to add anything other than that crossing appears to be down near Westhaven, which you probably already knew. None of the properties in the surrounding area seem to have had any similar name in the mid-nineteenth century. I can only suggest that it was a local name for a hillock or feature nearby: it was quite common for the railway to use such a name, so long as it distinguished the railway installation from others. The name then sticks and, for example, a bridge, cutting or crossing will still be named after a farmer who died over 150 years ago.
Thank you so much. It was only recently that I saw the name written down for the first time - on google maps of the name of the level crossing. We had a hut on the site between the railway line/ level crossing and the shore in the 60's and always wondered how it came to be called Buckiehillock (s) as we called it. Very fond memories of time spent there.
Having had a look at various maps on the National Library of Scotland‘s website, I am unable to add anything other than that crossing appears to be down near Westhaven, which you probably already knew. None of the properties in the surrounding area seem to have had any similar name in the mid-nineteenth century. I can only suggest that it was a local name for a hillock or feature nearby: it was quite common for the railway to use such a name, so long as it distinguished the railway installation from others. The name then sticks and, for example, a bridge, cutting or crossing will still be named after a farmer who died over 150 years ago.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

I believe it's the name of a farm. In the interwar years there was a community of huts there, similar to those that still exist at Carbeth.
Thank you, the name of a farm would make sense as there was a house on the site. We had a hut there in the late 50's early 60's and always wondered how it came by it's name. I only discovered recently the name of the level crossing and was so delighted as it's the first time I have seen the name written down apart from being talked about within my family.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

This is just a guess, but "buckie" is a name used for small shellfish like whelks.




I must admit that I wasn't aware of the second definition!

There's another link here:
We picked lots of buckies as children, waiting patiently with our pin for them to cool down . We had a hut there late 50's early 60's till the site was closed in 1964 and was always intrigued by the name - thank you

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

Googling buckiehillock will produce twenty results, of which three might help a tiny bit. One from 1940 refers to some hutments, a second from 2001 refers to it as Buckiehilliock Farm and the third (the penultimate) from 1866 refers to a will for someone living at Buckiehillock.
Thank you, there was a farm nearby but we never knew it's name. Great times!
 
Last edited:

stuving

Member
Joined
26 Jan 2017
Messages
741
The name appears on this OS map at NLS (1:2500 Revised: 1964 Published: 1966), but the level crossing is on the next sheet to the north. That building was on earlier 25" maps back to 1857, unnamed, but has vanished now. The crossing was a footpath, then later a road.

The building itself might have been a house, but if it was more functional it would look much the same (but would almost certainly have been labelled). The OS name books are to be found on Scotlands Places, and the relevant one (Forfarshire, Panbride parish) is from around the same date (1857-1861). It does not contain Buckiehillock.
 

Gloster

Veteran Member
Joined
4 Sep 2020
Messages
13,043
Location
Up the creek
Thank you, there was a farm nearby but we never knew it's name. Great times!

Just to clarify. The 2001 item was a BBC report about the railway being closed as a gas cylinder was found near to some burning tyres. It was the crossing that was referred to as Buckiehillock Farm level crossing.
 

Mcr Warrior

Veteran Member
Joined
8 Jan 2009
Messages
17,306
Right at the top edge, to the right of the railway line. It's "Buckie Hillocks", but that's close enough for a level crossing name.
Thanks. So, which came first, the railway crossing, or the building?

The crossing was certainly there in July 1936, as newspaper reports of the time mention the 'miraculous escape' of the driver of a car ran into by a train at the location, which was described as Buckiehillock, Westhaven.

However, the stretch of railway along the coast was built almost a hundred years earlier.

But was there always a level crossing there, or was that a later addition?

And so, was the building maybe named / re-named after the crossing, or vice-versa?
 

stuving

Member
Joined
26 Jan 2017
Messages
741
99.9% certain that the crossing was put in to serve the house that was there already. It's only a short stretch of coast from Bleachfield to West Haven, so hardly needed road access in the middle.

What was the building? The land valuation tax records for 1940 have an entry for:

ERIC B DOUGLAS, Tenant, HOUSE AND LAND PANBRIDE AND BUCKYHILLOCK
ESTATE OF PANMURE BY CARNOUSTIE, parish of PANBRIDE

That sounds more like a croft or smallholding than a farm, and the map suggests the same thing.

The earliest land tax records, from 1850 on, list a lot of "land and buildings" holdings on that estate without names.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

Perhaps it's worth adding that the earliest OS maps - e.g. this one from 1859 - show that crossing as just two gates in the fences for access on foot. The road was not built until later.
 
Last edited:

MariaJ

New Member
Joined
21 Mar 2023
Messages
4
Location
Montrose
The name appears on this OS map at NLS (1:2500 Revised: 1964 Published: 1966), but the level crossing is on the next sheet to the north. That building was on earlier 25" maps back to 1857, unnamed, but has vanished now. The crossing was a footpath, then later a road.

The building itself might have been a house, but if it was more functional it would look much the same (but would almost certainly have been labelled). The OS name books are to be found on Scotlands Places, and the relevant one (Forfarshire, Panbride parish) is from around the same date (1857-1861). It does not contain Buckiehillock.
Thank you for all the information. The house was still occupied at least till the mid 60's when we had to leave as the site for the huts was closed, as we were there all through the summer mail could be picked up from the house, family name was Douglas. I'll look all this up. Thank you again.
 

MariaJ

New Member
Joined
21 Mar 2023
Messages
4
Location
Montrose
Just to clarify. The 2001 item was a BBC report about the railway being closed as a gas cylinder was found near to some burning tyres. It was the crossing that was referred to as Buckiehillock Farm level crossing.
Many thanks for your reply.
I believe it's the name of a farm. In the interwar years there was a community of huts there, similar to those that still exist at Carbeth.
I also think it's a farm name. My brother tells me the community of huts started in 1936, most of the huts belonging to Dundonians. They were requisitioned during the war for accommodation for those serving at HMS Peewit/RNAS Easthaven.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

99.9% certain that the crossing was put in to serve the house that was there already. It's only a short stretch of coast from Bleachfield to West Haven, so hardly needed road access in the middle.

What was the building? The land valuation tax records for 1940 have an entry for:

ERIC B DOUGLAS, Tenant, HOUSE AND LAND PANBRIDE AND BUCKYHILLOCK
ESTATE OF PANMURE BY CARNOUSTIE, parish of PANBRIDE

That sounds more like a croft or smallholding than a farm, and the map suggests the same thing.

The earliest land tax records, from 1850 on, list a lot of "land and buildings" holdings on that estate without names.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

Perhaps it's worth adding that the earliest OS maps - e.g. this one from 1859 - show that crossing as just two gates in the fences for access on foot. The road was not built until later.
The family Douglas was still living in the house in the mid 60's. Thank you so much for all this information

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

I believe it's the name of a farm. In the interwar years there was a community of huts there, similar to those that still exist at Carbeth.
Hi, this is a long shot and I'm not sure I'm posting in the right place.
Here goes - just outside Carnoustie going north before Easthaven there is a level crossing called Buckiehillock. Has anyone any idea where I could look to find the origin of the name?
Thanks in advance.
Thank you all for the information and sites to look at regarding my query. I have learnt so much and it's been fun.:smile:
Hi, this is a long shot and I'm not sure I'm posting in the right place.
Here goes - just outside Carnoustie going north before Easthaven there is a level crossing called Buckiehillock. Has anyone any idea where I could look to find the origin of the name?
Thanks in advance.
 
Last edited:
Status
Not open for further replies.

Top