Leeds to Morecambe: Bikes on trains

[roystinho]

A friend of mine wants to go with 3 friends, all with their bikes, from Leeds to Morecambe and then cycle home.

I have something in my mind saying that only 2 cycles are allowed per train, especially on the Northern train that they will be on.

1. Is this correct?
and
2. If so how could they resolve the problem without taking separate trains etc...

Thanks

 

[bonelorry]

It is ultimately at the discretion of the Guard who in charge of the train, The rule of thumb is 2 x bikes on a 2 x car set BUT as said that is the ultimate decision of the Guard.

If it is a Peak time service and the train is already full and standing like the 6.28 Sheff-Leeds service I worked this morning then I turned away quite a few commuters wanting to board with bikes.

I already had 3 on who had boarded when the train was quiet plus a wheelchair user so I felt I was being fair....I also had to leave quite a few commuters on platforms without bikes it was that busy!

On the flip-side , Once rush hour/hours are out of the way generally the trains are much quieter and I have no problem allowing more than 2 bikes on. I had a group of about 5 teenagers who all rode BMX's on a few weeks back and I allowed them all on BUT I did state to them that if I got a wheelchair user at a later stop I might have to ask them to move their bikes and worse case scenario they would have to get off and get the next service.

So in a nutshell avoid peak times and if possible approach the Guard beforehand and just ask the question. Can't see an issue myself.

 

[EssexGonzo]

I've done quite a bit of this with two mates and our bikes on AGA. We'll normally ride somewhere for a day and get the train home.

On the one hand, its normally the weekend when I do it so no commuter crush. On the other hand, the trains are normally shorter.

We've always used common sense and avoided obvious crowded routes (e.g. Stratford on a Saturday is busy because of Westfield, Southend on a hot summer's afternoon), have always approached either the station staff or train guard before trying to get on and have occasionally waited for the next train when one has looked a bit too busy for three bikes.

It normally works out OK with a bit of courtesy and give-and-take. AGA has a relaxed policy off-peak - you might need to check the TOC's bike policy, though.

 

[bonelorry]

Forgot to mention, I work for Northern.

 

[brianthegiant]

So that's 4 bikes in total?
Don't know what stock serves this route, most 15x stock seems to fit 3/4 bikes with no problem if they're well 'stacked' (top to tail) and there's no other luggage in the bike area.
bikes with drop bars fit slightly more than straight bars.
Depends a bit on the guard, most are common sense & allow more than 2 if there's space.
Be prepared to negotiate nicely with anyone who's put a suitcase etc in the bike area.

The CTC & local cycle campaigns continue to lobby for more bike space on trains, but it's a difficult fight, more progress on secure station storage & cycle hire in some areas. www.ctc.org.uk

 

[HarleyDavidson]

http://www.nationalrail.co.uk/stations_destinations/cyclists.aspx

 

[BurtonM]

I've never seen a guard refuse a cyclist - the only times I've seen cyclists fail to board a train is when there is no sufficient space anywhere on board.
156s are good - they actually have a space designed for 4 bikes.
It's pot luck with 150s - in my experience /1s are better than /2s, and the ex-London Midland units are the worst. I don't think most adult size bikes actually fit in the bike area properly on them...
Pacers are so-so. You'd just have 3 bikes stacked against each other against the wall under the luggage rack at one end.
I don't know about 158s but I can't imagine it being fun.
Never been on 153/155.

And if it was TPE (ugh, hate their approach to cycle storage), there'd be space for 2 at best in the designated area - any more and you start to block the aisle.
But, usually either there would already be several bikes on the train, or someone sitting on the folding seat that probably won't move despite the sign on the wall telling them they have to. Personally, on 185s, if it's quiet I just go to the end of the train between First Class and the disabled toilet. That area is much better suited than the actual bike storage area, and I've only been asked to move to the actual storage area once, when a man in a wheelchair got on.

 

[yorkie]

The only way to 'guarantee' carriage is to obtain reservations on two different reserveable TPE trains to Manchester/Warrington and then on to Lancaster (and cycle the last bit).

And if it was TPE (ugh, hate their approach to cycle storage), there'd be space for 2 at best in the designated area - any more and you start to block the aisle.

3 is easy, 4 is fine depending on dimensions.

 

[rmt4ever]

It is ultimately at the discretion of the Guard who in charge of the train, The rule of thumb is 2 x bikes on a 2 x car set BUT as said that is the ultimate decision of the Guard.

If it is a Peak time service and the train is already full and standing like the 6.28 Sheff-Leeds service I worked this morning then I turned away quite a few commuters wanting to board with bikes.

I already had 3 on who had boarded when the train was quiet plus a wheelchair user so I felt I was being fair....I also had to leave quite a few commuters on platforms without bikes it was that busy!

On the flip-side , Once rush hour/hours are out of the way generally the trains are much quieter and I have no problem allowing more than 2 bikes on. I had a group of about 5 teenagers who all rode BMX's on a few weeks back and I allowed them all on BUT I did state to them that if I got a wheelchair user at a later stop I might have to ask them to move their bikes and worse case scenario they would have to get off and get the next service.

So in a nutshell avoid peak times and if possible approach the Guard beforehand and just ask the question. Can't see an issue myself.

I didn't think pushbikes were allowed on peak time commuter trains. I certainly wouldn't dream of being stupid enough to try and board with mine. And anyone trying to get on my train with one will find they are going nowhere fast

 

[yorkie]

I didn't think pushbikes were allowed on peak time commuter trains.

Here's their policy: http://www.northernrail.org/travel/cycling/bikes-on-trains

There is no 'peak time' ban as such on Northern (or, for the record, any of the other relevant operators ie, Trans Pennine Express & Virgin Trains)
http://www.northernrail.org/travel/cycling/bikes-on-trains

 

[HarleyDavidson]

I didn't think pushbikes were allowed on peak time commuter trains. I certainly wouldn't dream of being stupid enough to try and board with mine. And anyone trying to get on my train with one will find they are going nowhere fast

Bike policy on SWT.

In the area bounded by London Waterloo, Reading, Hook, Alton, Guildford and Dorking, cycles may not join or leave trains due to arrive at London Waterloo between 0715 and 1000 inclusive, or which leave London Waterloo between 1645 and 1900 inclusive.

At stations between Clapham Junction, Feltham/Strawberry Hill and the Hounslow loop, cycles may also not join or leave trains which are due to leave Clapham Junction between 0745 and 0900.

If you are travelling on our London Waterloo to Salisbury/Exeter/Bristol services you will need to reserve a space for your cycle.

It's surprising how many try it on with some of the commuter services, especially between Clapham & Woking. If I get the chance I sling them off.

 

[pdeaves]

2. If so how could they resolve the problem without taking separate trains etc...

Buy folding bikes... (they count as hand luggage when folded).

 

[yorkie]

Buy folding bikes... (they count as hand luggage when folded).

Cycling from Morecambe to Leeds on folding bikes? You have to be kidding

It's about 74 miles. I don't know if this is in a day or not, but my maximum will be one of the Peak District rides we did a few years ago; something like 46 in a day. Spreading it over 2 days is much more realistic, but either way you'd not want to do it on anything other than a decent bike.

roystinho - what time do your friends want to be in Morecambe by? and is this a weekday or a weekend (if the latter, we might need to know the date, to be sure of engineering work alterations)

 

[30907]

Would have thought there would only be problems with the 16 xx departure from Leeds, other trains aren't particularly busy and even a Pacer has space for bikes....

 

[Iskra]

Would have thought there would only be problems with the 16 xx departure from Leeds, other trains aren't particularly busy and even a Pacer has space for bikes....

There can be issues when a single 153 turns up, which does happen. The route can be busy on weekends especially Leeds-Skipton and Lancaster-Morecambe- I used to live on it and use it frequently. I've even had to stand Carnforth-Skipton before!

 

[roystinho]

Thanks folks. They want to set off on an early train on Saturday morning, probably about 7am. Looks like it shouldn't be a problem

 

[Emyr]

Most bikes I've witnessed on a 3-car 185 was 6, on a morning Airport train calling at Bolton. Luckily, enough of us knew what we were doing so you could still walk past without squeezing.

TM was unimpressed but didn't comment.

Correction: 7, there was a Brompton in the adjacent luggage rack.

 

[pdeaves]

Cycling from Morecambe to Leeds on folding bikes? You have to be kidding

It's about 74 miles.

Well, mainly but not totally kidding. It depends on what kind of folding bike you have. Mine is designed for speed and can cope with 74 miles in a day easily but only on roads. I speak of one who cycles 'stupid miles'...

Admittedly many folders are 'shopper'-type and would struggle. It's horses for courses.

 

[yorkie]

Thanks folks. They want to set off on an early train on Saturday morning, probably about 7am. Looks like it shouldn't be a problem

Taking a random Saturday, so let's say 4th April.

The direct train is at 0819 (arr 1031). The single fare is £21.10, and if other cyclists have the same idea and the train is full, you could be required instead to travel via Manchester, arriving into Morecambe at 1131 and being charged an excess fare of £6.90.

So it might be better to book an Advance from Leeds to Lancaster via Manchester?

Departing Leeds 0735 arriving Lancaster 0947 is £11.30 or Departing Leeds 0835, arriving Lancaster 1100 £8.20. Either itinerary will have 2 reservable bike spaces (book early to get them), and the third person could catch the direct train or take a slightly earlier/later train to Lancaster, and you'd all end up on the same train to Morecambe.

The fare from Lancaster to Morecambe is £3.10. Admittedly the trains into Morecambe are non-reserveable, but it's better to be rejected at Lancaster (from where you can cycle it) , than Leeds.

 

[BurtonM]

Most bikes I've witnessed on a 3-car 185 was 6, on a morning Airport train calling at Bolton. Luckily, enough of us knew what we were doing so you could still walk past without squeezing.

TM was unimpressed but didn't comment.

Correction: 7, there was a Brompton in the adjacent luggage rack.

I've seen more than that - I had five in one vestibule once! Couldn't move. I think there were 2-3 in another vestibule too - that's at least 7 in one carriage of a 185.

 

[LowLevel]

It's a pain to referee. On one hand, I never allow bikes to obstruct the doors and vestibules on a 15x. On the other, 156s will take at least 6, 153s 3 tops (they block the fire extinguisher in otherwise) and 158s 3 or 4 depending on the size. If anything our 158s are the worst because excess bikes block the way into the next coach which is a fire hazard.

Irritatingly though we have a group of regular cyclists who make a fairly reasonable length journey from a station with 2 trains each way per day or so which isn't the origin station. There's 3 of them, one of them is a folder, and while I'm aware of them so proactively try to save room, one day they're going to luck out and get stranded.