Leeds station improvement updates

[northernchris]

Noticed on the entrance doors today that the southern entrance is now open until 2345 which is a significant improvement

 

[Iskra]

Noticed on the entrance doors today that the southern entrance is now open until 2345 which is a significant improvement

That is great news. So many times after the walk back from Elland Road on a night game, I have to trudge right round to get to P17, made even worse by the current improvement works. Now I’ll be straight in, which allows more time in the pub

 

[Bungle965]

Noticed on the entrance doors today that the southern entrance is now open until 2345 which is a significant improvement

Have they increased the staffing hours of the ticket gates also?
If would be an open goal if they still retained the same hours.

 

[northernchris]

Have they increased the staffing hours of the ticket gates also?
If would be an open goal if they still retained the same hours.

I did wonder that as assumed the 2200 closure was connected to staffing of the gateline.

 

[YorksLad12]

I did wonder that as assumed the 2200 closure was connected to staffing of the gateline.

As I recall it was (also) to not disturb the neighbours at Waterman's Reach and the Blue Apartments.

 

[yorksrob]

As I recall it was (also) to not disturb the neighbours at Waterman's Reach and the Blue Apartments.

That's was never going to achieve much unless they closed all the bars and restaurants in the area as well.

 

[YorksLad12]

Leeds Station Platform 17 Extension

This engagement has now closed, thank you for taking part. We have analysed your responses: Read the full outcome report here We are working in partnership with Network Rail to improve access to platforms 16 and 17 at Leeds Rail Station. These proposals

www.yourvoice.westyorks-ca.gov.uk

WYCA has started a consultation on extending P17 to six-car length, including moving the lift and stairs further back into P16. There are two drop-in dates (at the Southern Entrance, not sure how that works with the gate line), and the consultation closes on 31 March.

The cost of this work? £40m...

 

[Iskra]

Leeds Station Platform 17 Extension

This engagement has now closed, thank you for taking part. We have analysed your responses: Read the full outcome report here We are working in partnership with Network Rail to improve access to platforms 16 and 17 at Leeds Rail Station. These proposals

www.yourvoice.westyorks-ca.gov.uk

WYCA has started a consultation on extending P17 to six-car length, including moving the lift and stairs further back into P16. There are two drop-in dates (at the Southern Entrance, not sure how that works with the gate line), and the consultation closes on 31 March.

The cost of this work? £40m...

Hallelujah!

And although it seems expensive, it is presumably the cheapest (or best value) option.

 

[quantinghome]

And although it seems expensive, it is presumably the cheapest (or best value) option.

It's a very complex piece of work.

 

[reecestrains]

Leeds Station Platform 17 Extension

This engagement has now closed, thank you for taking part. We have analysed your responses: Read the full outcome report here We are working in partnership with Network Rail to improve access to platforms 16 and 17 at Leeds Rail Station. These proposals

www.yourvoice.westyorks-ca.gov.uk

WYCA has started a consultation on extending P17 to six-car length, including moving the lift and stairs further back into P16. There are two drop-in dates (at the Southern Entrance, not sure how that works with the gate line), and the consultation closes on 31 March.

The cost of this work? £40m...

And what services could possibly operate on there?

The only ones that use 17 are the Sheffield, Nottingham, Lincoln Central and Knottingley services.

 

[quantinghome]

And what services could possibly operate on there?

The only ones that use 17 are the Sheffield, Nottingham, Lincoln Central and Knottingley services.

Yes. And?

 

[reecestrains]

Yes. And?

and those services are only operated with 2 car trains. Unless they're planning to extend it for more capacity or use different services on it.

 

[quantinghome]

and those services are only operated with 2 car trains. Unless they're planning to extend it for more capacity or use different services on it.

Yes, that's precisely the idea.

 

[duffield]

It is a shame they can't extend it to take 8 (4+4) coaches. I think the Nottingham to Leeds services could use 4 coaches at times.

And yes, I realise 6 is probably the best that can be done in a constrained area without massive expenditure, and it will be a considerable improvement. I wonder if it will be used only for 3+3 coaches or if 4+2 will be used at times? I'd expect it to be just 3+3 because of the interworking between the services and because 4+2 only works if the units are in the right order for departure, whereas 3+3 makes it nice and simple.

 

[skyhigh]

and those services are only operated with 2 car trains.

Yes, because otherwise they don't fit on 17. That's the whole idea, to allow longer trains.

 

[driverd]

and those services are only operated with 2 car trains. Unless they're planning to extend it for more capacity or use different services on it.

The lack of capacity is a huge problem and has been for many years. 3/4 car sets are desperately needed on the Nottingham runs and the main restriction on that being achieved is the lack of available platforms at Leeds. This work is precisely to enable lengthening of trains.

 

[YorksLad12]

It is a shame they can't extend it to take 8 (4+4) coaches. I think the Nottingham to Leeds services could use 4 coaches at times.

And yes, I realise 6 is probably the best that can be done in a constrained area without massive expenditure, and it will be a considerable improvement. I wonder if it will be used only for 3+3 coaches or if 4+2 will be used at times? I'd expect it to be just 3+3 because of the interworking between the services and because 4+2 only works if the units are in the right order for departure, whereas 3+3 makes it nice and simple.

4+2 would work the same as the present 2+2 timetabling arrangement, but it’s more likely to be 3+2 if Northern’s new stock hasn’t arrived by 2027 when the changes should be completed. The semi-fasts and the stoppers are separate, they don’t intermingle.

 

[Peregrine 4903]

The Leeds to Nottingham and Lincoln Central services are suffering from horrendoues overcrowding and need longer trains running on them. That's why Platform 17 is being extended so Northern can run longer trains on the Leeds to Nottingham/Lincoln Central services.

 

[Killingworth]

It is a shame they can't extend it to take 8 (4+4) coaches. I think the Nottingham to Leeds services could use 4 coaches at times.

And yes, I realise 6 is probably the best that can be done in a constrained area without massive expenditure, and it will be a considerable improvement. I wonder if it will be used only for 3+3 coaches or if 4+2 will be used at times? I'd expect it to be just 3+3 because of the interworking between the services and because 4+2 only works if the units are in the right order for departure, whereas 3+3 makes it nice and simple.

They do operate 4 cars on Nottinghams, on Sundays.

And what services could possibly operate on there?

The only ones that use 17 are the Sheffield, Nottingham, Lincoln Central and Knottingley services.

Only!! Sounds like they're unimportant - well they are to us!! But that feeling is possibly why Leeds is only the 3rd most popular destination from Sheffield.

Top 4 journeys from Sheffield during 2023/2024:
•Manchester Piccadilly (443,018 journeys)
•London St Pancras International (383,253 journeys)
•Leeds (320,722 journeys)
•Doncaster (276,460 journeys)

South Yorkshire services are stuck round the back at the end of Platform 16. 17 is a bleak platform with minimal facilities and is a very poor introduction to Leeds.

We just missed our connection onto a 2 car 195 Nottingham train yesterday due to congestion around the stairs so took the next to depart for Sheffield, a 2 car 158 via Wakefield Kirkgate and Castleford. That train was also well filled. (We could have taken the later but quicker 2 car 195 Lincoln service but would have had longer to wait in Sheffield for our next connection onto the Hope Valley line.)

(There's also the 2 car 150 service from Platform 11 running via Wakefield Westgate and Moorthorpe plus the hourly fast Cross Country service - 4 different routes, take your pick.)

 

[duffield]

4+2 would work the same as the present 2+2 timetabling arrangement, but it’s more likely to be 3+2 if Northern’s new stock hasn’t arrived by 2027 when the changes should be completed. The semi-fasts and the stoppers are separate, they don’t intermingle.

Yes, I see, I've looked at the timings properly and understand how the platform is used now, with the Knottingley services coming quickly in and out at the far end of the platform while the alternating Nottingham/Lincoln services lay over. So 4+2 would work fine as you say, assuming the Knottingley services don't get lengthened.

I actually got a four coach service from Nottingham on 27th February (the 0817), it was very civilised for a change, but somewhat surprising until I remembered it was temporarily covering the Sheffield->Rotherham Central->Wakefield Westgate->Leeds route while Barnsley to Leeds via Kirkgate was closed. These services were using all sorts of platforms at Leeds for the duration.

 

[Mugby]

I'm struggling to visualise how the lift, stairs and escalators to Platform 16 could be moved to a 'more central position' Would that involve creating a sort of landing along the back wall of 16? And where are the escalators to 16, I've used 16 and 17 many times and don't remember seeing any.

 

[johntea]

I've always thought they should come up with an idea at the Southern entrance so the gate line is at the same level as P17, then P17 (and P16) passengers could easily enter and exit from that approach rather than having to trail all the way through the station

 

[takno]

I've always thought they should come up with an idea at the Southern entrance so the gate line is at the same level as P17, then P17 (and P16) passengers could easily enter and exit from that approach rather than having to trail all the way through the station

It certainly seems logical to move the stairs and lift so they aren't over the platforms. The route to 17 seems really uncomfortably narrow at the minute

 

[Freemo]

A couple of hundred people off the 08.14 arrival from Nottingham squeezing past the lift shaft on a bit wide enough for two people standing abreast, as the 08.16 TPE departure from 16 accelerates past, perhaps including wheelchair or pushchair users and with passengers trying to get onto 17 coming the other way, has always felt horrendous.

It also makes a complete joke of the zealous policing of the yellow line going on a few yards up the same platform at the same time.

 

[YorksLad12]

I'm struggling to visualise how the lift, stairs and escalators to Platform 16 could be moved to a 'more central position' Would that involve creating a sort of landing along the back wall of 16? And where are the escalators to 16, I've used 16 and 17 many times and don't remember seeing any.

At a guess; the steps at the moment are quite long, with landings. If the footbridge was extended out over the stairs, the lift access could go there; the steps down would then be similar to the others, with no landing. That removes the tight bit off P17 where the lift is now.

I've always thought they should come up with an idea at the Southern entrance so the gate line is at the same level as P17, then P17 (and P16) passengers could easily enter and exit from that approach rather than having to trail all the way through the station

But then you'd be putting more people onto the crowded area around P17 behind the lift. There is the emergency exit there - it was in use last year when the lift wasn't working and one of the lifts in the Southern Entrance had to be used instead to reach the footbridge. It can't be used as an entrance/exit because you'd need at least two gates, plus a member of staff, and there's no room inside

A couple of hundred people off the 08.14 arrival from Nottingham squeezing past the lift shaft on a bit wide enough for two people standing abreast, as the 08.16 TPE departure from 16 accelerates past, perhaps including wheelchair or pushchair users and with passengers trying to get onto 17 coming the other way, has always felt horrendous.

It also makes a complete joke of the zealous policing of the yellow line going on a few yards up the same platform at the same time.

Yes. I mean, after 25 years not so much as a safety rail on that corner. God help you if you're swimming in the opposite direction too.

 

[yorksrob]

This is good news. And we'll be getting rid of the slowest lift in the world as well. Bargain !

 

[Meerkat]

Isn’t a bid weird to have a consultation without any plans or even a conceptual diagram?
Kind of reduced to “Do you want it to be better or not?”. They must have fairly solid plans if they have a budget and plan to start construction this year.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

I'm struggling to visualise how the lift, stairs and escalators to Platform 16 could be moved to a 'more central position' Would that involve creating a sort of landing along the back wall of 16? And where are the escalators to 16, I've used 16 and 17 many times and don't remember seeing any.

It's just the one (up) escalator, as per all groups of platforms at Leeds apart from 0-8 by the main entrance.

 

[YorksLad12]

Isn’t a bid weird to have a consultation without any plans or even a conceptual diagram?
Kind of reduced to “Do you want it to be better or not?”. They must have fairly solid plans if they have a budget and plan to start construction this year.

I would say that it's unusual, especially with there being drop-in sessions (I'm going to try and visit the one on the 20th as I have to be in the area). Perhaps the images aren't ready yet? The two photos they have on the website are of P16, not P17.

I'm interested in the remarks about platform *width* as well as length. It does sound as if they're going to nibble a bit of P16 away as well as extending closer to the Candle building. But 2.8m is quite deep... hanging the platform off the viaduct, perhaps?

 

[duffield]

This is one case where the consultation really seems like a waste of time and money. It seems like it's pretty much the only plan on offer with the relevant constraints, and I can't see any reason for anyone to oppose it. Maybe I'm missing something; is there some effect on properties off the railway? It doesn't seem possible to tell if there would be. Anyhow I hope it will be as swift and inexpensive as possible.