Latest NW crossing campaign

[fsmr]

New hard hitting advert aimed at pedestrians and cyclists

Network Rail advert warns rail crossings 'like busy roads'

A Network Rail advert is aiming to persuade people that they need to be as careful crossing railway tracks as they would be on a busy road.

The operator, which has spent £130m to improve safety, says 46 people have been killed on railway crossings in the past five years.

Theo Leggett reports.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-19867795

As I have posted before, i regularly use the bridle crossings at Gunthorpe (manton box) and Eggelton (Oakham box) with dog and bike on evening 8 miles cross country forrays and often with my youngster and always take the time to phone first.

He is 13 but he is also used to politely asking for permission and phoning back on the other side to confirm safely over
Only takes a few seconds to check in and out on the other side. Also wakes the Manton box up, especially at half ten on a winters evening
Appreciate there are plenty of other crosssings devoid of phones

 

[Tomnick]

Although I will concede that it's certainly a good thing to educate youngsters of the potential dangers of the railway, and would encourage anyone to use the telephones provided if in any doubt, there is usually no requirement for pedestrians to ask for permission to cross. If every pedestrian did it, some boxes would be inundated by calls (bearing in mind, in this specific case, the large route mileage controlled by Manton) - the unnecessary distraction possibly leading to a serious error being made elsewhere!

 

[fsmr]

Although I will concede that it's certainly a good thing to educate youngsters of the potential dangers of the railway, and would encourage anyone to use the telephones provided if in any doubt, there is usually no requirement for pedestrians to ask for permission to cross. If every pedestrian did it, some boxes would be inundated by calls (bearing in mind, in this specific case, the large route mileage controlled by Manton) - the unnecessary distraction possibly leading to a serious error being made elsewhere!

While crossing on foot alone perhaps but with bikes and a dog at night I would always phone on those crossings and certainly encourage children under 14 to do that at all times when crossing without an adult.
While it could be argued as a distraction, the signaller is trained to handle such a situation which is the reason the phone is there in the first place and not miniature lights such as on urban foot crossings. the consequence of an incident through not phoning is far outweighed not to mention potential damage a colllion with something as innocuous as a push bike could cause to a DMU.

You will see that todays campaign focuses on such an incident.
There has already been one RAIB report released blaming lack of use of the provided crossing phone albeit at an AHB in Wales by an LGV, the consequence of all the publicity in the haulage industry is that many more hauliers and farmers falling within the potential length and 5 mph speed requirements to stop will be now looking at stopping and doing just that before crossing and that is on normal road LCs.

 

[Tomnick]

While crossing on foot alone perhaps but with bikes and a dog at night I would always phone on those crossings and certainly encourage children under 14 to do that at all times when crossing without an adult.

Fair enough - as I say, it's certainly a good example to set, and I can particularly understand your concern when it's dark or you're trying to get bikes and a dog across! I've copied the text from the relevant part of the Signalling Regulations below though, which shows that there's no requirement to phone back once safely across (as signal protection won't be provided, unlike for vehicles or animals crossing).

While it could be argued as a distraction, the signaller is trained to handle such a situation which is the reason the phone is there in the first place and not miniature lights such as on urban foot crossings.

The phone is there primarily for anyone crossing with vehicles and animals (who are required to phone first). The Signalman is indeed trained to handle such situations; no matter how much training you've received though, it's still all too easy to make an error in communications when you're being overloaded with phone calls (see the recent report into the collision at a UWC near Kings Lynn - White House LC? - where the Signalman was dealing with an unusually high number of crossing requests and ended up giving permission to cross with a train approaching), and I wanted to emphasise that in response to your (light-hearted, I accept!) comment about waking the chap at Manton up at 2230!

the consequence of an incident through not phoning is far outweighed not to mention potential damage a colllion with something as innocuous as a push bike could cause to a DMU.

I take your point regarding bikes above - however, there should be sufficient sighting distance to let a pedestrian get across safely without phoning.

You will see that todays campaign focuses on such an incident.

The focus seemed to be on taking care in crossing (i.e. stop, look and listen) - with no mention of using telephones?

There has already been one RAIB report released blaming lack of use of the provided crossing phone albeit at an AHB in Wales by an LGV, the consequence of all the publicity in the haulage industry is that many more hauliers and farmers falling within the potential length and 5 mph speed requirements to stop will be now looking at stopping and doing just that before crossing and that is on normal road LCs.

The report in question refers to abnormal loads (long, low or slow) at AHBs, who should always stop and phone before crossing an AHB (but anyone otherwise crossing with a vehicle obviously doesn't need to, unlike a UWC).

As promised above, an extract from TS9 (Regulations relating to level crossings) follows:

2.1 Telephone calls from users of level crossings

2.1.1 Receiving a telephone call

When you receive a telephone call from the crossing, you must find out:
• which crossing the user wants to use
• what is required to pass over the crossing
• how long it will take.
If there is enough time for the crossing to be used before the next train passes over it, you must, except as shown in regulation 2.1.2, tell the user to use the crossing immediately.

If there is not enough time, you must tell the user to wait and telephone again.

2.1.2 Animals or large, low or slow-moving vehicles or a trolley with small wheels]/b]

Before you authorise anyone to use the crossing with animals or a large, low or slow-moving road vehicle, or anything with small that may get caught in a flangeway, you must:

• find out from the crossing user how long the movement will take
• make sure there is enough time between trains to prevent delay
• make sure that the protecting signals are placed or kept at danger
• make sure that any approaching train has passed clear of the crossing
• tell the user to report back when the movement has passed over the crossing.

After you have authorised the movement, you must not resume normal working until the crossing user has reported that the movement has passed clear of the crossing.

You must also carry out the above regulations if a user at a crossing with red and green warning lights reports that the lights have failed and wants to cross with a vehicle or animals.

You must also carry out the above regulations, with the help of the crossing keeper, at a crossing worked by a crossing keeper that is not protected by signals.

If the crossing user does not report back that the movement has cleared the crossing, you must make sure that the driver each train is told to:

• approach the crossing at caution
• not pass over it until the driver has made sure it is safe to do so
• tell you whether the crossing is safe for the passage of trains.

You must do this until you are told that the crossing is safe for the passage of trains.

2.1.3 Not able to hear or understand a caller

If you are not able to hear or understand what the caller is saying, you must caution the driver of each train until you are sure the crossing is safe for the passage of trains.

 

[fsmr]

Dont want to get into a spat on this thread but to clarify, both boxes without exeption always ask for confirmation on the other side of the bridleway crossing and indeed call the phone on the other side if there has been issue getting over. which has happened on occassion as can be appreciated when i had 2 dogs and an autistic son and 2 bikes to get across and will always advise of time available before train due

Anyway off on my ride now, best time of the day now offroading in the dark and cold:roll:

 

[jp347]

Dont want to get into a spat on this thread but to clarify, both boxes without exeption always ask for confirmation on the other side of the bridleway crossing and indeed call the phone on the other side if there has been issue getting over. which has happened on occassion as can be appreciated when i had 2 dogs and an autistic son and 2 bikes to get across and will always advise of time available before train due

Anyway off on my ride now, best time of the day now offroading in the dark and cold:roll:

In my experience Manton do not ask for a call back when pedestrians only are crossing (and I wouldn't expect them to). The crossing I have used many times just north of Wing has a sign to specifically say that pedestrians may use the telephone to check if it is safe to cross.

 

[Tomnick]

Dont want to get into a spat on this thread but to clarify, both boxes without exeption always ask for confirmation on the other side of the bridleway crossing and indeed call the phone on the other side if there has been issue getting over. which has happened on occassion as can be appreciated when i had 2 dogs and an autistic son and 2 bikes to get across and will always advise of time available before train due

Anyway off on my ride now, best time of the day now offroading in the dark and cold:roll:

No spat necessary - I'm quite happy to discuss things like this in a sensible and civilised manner! Nothing wrong with a bit of discussion. As above, the chaps at Oakham and Manton do, I'm sure, appreciate you phoning if you're in any doubt, especially if you're a regular; they'd probably be less happy if everyone started doing it on a busy summer Saturday! Likewise there's no requirement to phone back, but I fan understand them asking you to, for reassurance, if they're not too busy. I'd certainly suggest continuing the use the crossings in the responsible manner that you do, but just wanted to make everyone aware that there's no requirement to phone unless crossing with a vehicle or animals (with exceptions such as the crossing at Wing, which presumably has limited sighting along the line?).