Last steam service on a long distance route

[The DJ]

There was obviously a day when the final long distance service hauled by a steam locomotive ran. What date was this please.
What date was the very first long distance service operated with a diesel locomotive?
Could I humbly suggest to the Admin that a table of notable railway dates be created and maybe pinned in the Railway History category?

 

[WesternLancer]

There was obviously a day when the final long distance service hauled by a steam locomotive ran. What date was this please.
What date was the very first long distance service operated with a diesel locomotive?
Could I humbly suggest to the Admin that a table of notable railway dates be created and maybe pinned in the Railway History category?

You may need to refine the questions a bit
There was obviously a day when the final long distance service hauled by a steam locomotive ran. What date was this please.
Passenger or freight?
Scheduled in passenger timetable or special train?
BR or private sector (steam charters running in current era are I guess 'long distance services hauled by steam' after all, BR Inter City Special Trains Unit ran steam hauled services certainly in the 1980s I think, maybe into the early 1990s)

What date was the very first long distance service operated with a diesel locomotive?
I'm guessing the earliest runs of LMS 10000 in late 1947, but there were regular diesel multiple unit services from 1930s (eg GWR railcars most notably)

 

[S&CLER]

Wasn't the Bournemouth main line the last steam-worked "long distance" route, in 1967 if memory serves? There were later steam worked services in the North West that were just trains and not specials or "long distance". If I recollect rightly, it was one of these, a Preston-Liverpool via Ormskirk, that had the honour of being the last ordinary steam passenger train. To my shame I didn't stroll round to Maghull station to watch it, though if I was home from university I could easily have done so. That would have been in the first week of August 1968.

 

[Journeyman]

Wasn't the Bournemouth main line the last steam-worked "long distance" route, in 1967 if memory serves?

Yes, they were the final steam services out of London as well.

If I recollect rightly, it was one of these, a Preston-Liverpool via Ormskirk, that had the honour of being the last ordinary steam passenger train.

It was indeed. I don't know if you'd count that as "long distance" or not, although at the time the route via Ormskirk was a double track main line, with presumably a number of limited stop services. Was that final train a Class 1 or Class 2 service?

 

[Taunton]

I believe the first diesel service was 10000 on St Pancras to Manchester, via Derby where the locomotive was built, in the first days of nationalisation in January 1948. It had been delivered to the LMS board shortly before, as one of their last tasks.

The GWR railcars were also "long distance" from their introduction in the mid-1930s, on Birmingham Snow Hill to Cardiff. It was only much later that they were put on short branch lines. They ran as single cars, so didn't offer a lot of capacity, and the first ones didn't even have buffers/drawgear. The one of these that later broke down on Taunton to Yeovil at Martock (I think) with a jammed transmission, a notable challenge for the Taunton shed foreman to clear the line and recover!

The final BR scheduled steam service of all was indeed a long distance one, it was the Glasgow-Liverpool service, Class 40 Glasgow to Preston, and the Black 5 onward to Liverpool.

 

[Journeyman]

Indeed, a lot of early diesel development was aimed at high speed, long distance services - the Flying Hamburger units in Germany being a classic example. The LNER considered swiping the design for London to Edinburgh services, but the trains weren't considered luxurious enough, so the A4 was developed instead.

 

[steamybrian]

Without giving away my age but I travelled behind the Bullied Pacifics between Waterloo and Bournemouth until their end in July 1967. Steam continued in the North West until August 1968 where there were some long distance services on the West Coast Main Line north of Crewe towards Glasgow but unsure what or where.?

 

[Journeyman]

Without giving away my age but I travelled behind the Bullied Pacifics between Waterloo and Bournemouth until their end in July 1967. Steam continued in the North West until August 1968 where there were some long distance services on the West Coast Main Line north of Crewe towards Glasgow but unsure what or where.?

I've seen people say that in the final few years in the north west, steam passenger workings got pretty rare, and towards the end virtually all steam workings were freight, so the Bournemouth line was the final intensively worked steam express route.

I'm also not sure how reliable diagrams were at the end of steam. How often did steam vice diesel and diesel vice steam happen? I suspect it was pretty frequent, so if you showed up at Preston in the hope of getting in some miles behind a Black Five or a Brit, how often would you have been disappointed?

 

[Taunton]

Indeed, a lot of early diesel development was aimed at high speed, long distance services - the Flying Hamburger units in Germany being a classic example. The LNER considered swiping the design for London to Edinburgh services, but the trains weren't considered luxurious enough, so the A4 was developed instead.

I don't think the LNER consideration amounted to much. Gresley (and a small top LNER team) certainly travelled to Germany and rode on it, and would have needed the directors' authorisation for the expenses to do so, but I think it was more interest than anything. I wonder if Gresley managed to get a visit to the streamlined Class 05 4-6-4s hauling conventional stock as well, something a lot closer to the A4 Silver Jubilee concept.

At a time when Continental rail services had three classes, first second and third (UK just had first and third apart from Continental boat trains), the key expresses were first class only, or first and second. The diesel units set an egalitarian style by being second class only, probably as much to get 4-across seating into the limited formation, which was just 2 coaches and 100 seats. The journey was a bit over 2 hours (it's not far), so there was only minimal buffet provision. If used for London-Edinburgh it would have needed 5-6 hours and proper catering. Notably when the TEE came along in the 1950s with some not dissimilar diesel units they were back to first class only and a full kitchen.

 

[Mcr Warrior]

The final regular timetabled steam train operated from Preston to Liverpool on 3rd August 1968.

On 11th August 1968, a train known as the "Fifteen Guinea Special", due to the somewhat expensive tickets, ran from Liverpool Lime Street via Manchester Victoria to Carlisle and back. That's a reasonable distance.

Not saying that that the latter was the definitive last ever long distance steam service, but it might just be up there, especially since BR introduced a mainline steam ban the following day.

 

[Sir Felix Pole]

I guess the last true steam-hauled long-distance regular express (rather than a shortish portion working) was the 'Belfast Boat Express' (Manchester Vic - Heysham) which lasted to May 1968.

 

[Bevan Price]

The final regular timetabled steam train operated from Preston to Liverpool on 3rd August 1968.

On 11th August 1968, a train known as the "Fifteen Guinea Special", due to the somewhat expensive tickets, ran from Liverpool Lime Street via Manchester Victoria to Carlisle and back. That's a reasonable distance.

Not saying that that the latter was the definitive last ever long distance steam service, but it might just be up there, especially since BR introduced a mainline steam ban the following day.

With one exception, until steam workings were allowed to resume in the early 1970s. the 15 Guinea Special on 11 August 1968 was the last steam passenger working on BR. The exception was Flying Scotsman, for which Alan Pegler had a contract with BR to allow steam passengers excursions for several years, and there were several steam hauled tours into at least 1969 or 1970. Those ceased when Scotsman made its ill-fated (financially) trip to America.

As for steam working regular, daily service trains, the last workings covering 100+ miles were the Southern Region Waterloo - Bournemouth / Wemouth services that finished in July 1967.

Other steam "pockets" had ceased in March 1967 (Shrewsbury to Chester / Birkenhead, and the few residual workings between Shrewsbury & Aberystwyth). Summer (mainly) steam workings such as Preston - Carlisle, Leeds - Carlisle & Leeds - Blackpool had mostly ceased during 1966.

Some Bradford to Leeds or Wakefield portions retained steam power until late 1967.

After that, there were shorter workings in the Preston area (to Manchester Victoria, Blackpool South & Liverpool Exchange ) during 1968, until that final working to Liverpool Exchange on 3 August 1968. There were also a few steam replacements for failed diesels during early 1968, including at least one from Preston to Crewe.

The only "longish" steam workings in late 1967, and in 1968 were railtours, which (apart from the 15 Guinea Special) continued until 6 "final" specials on 4 August 1968.

 

[S&CLER]

The final regular timetabled steam train operated from Preston to Liverpool on 3rd August 1968.

On 11th August 1968, a train known as the "Fifteen Guinea Special", due to the somewhat expensive tickets, ran from Liverpool Lime Street via Manchester Victoria to Carlisle and back. That's a reasonable distance.

Not saying that that the latter was the definitive last ever long distance steam service, but it might just be up there, especially since BR introduced a mainline steam ban the following day.

It's roughly 315 miles, so the fare of 15 guineas was a shilling a mile for first class seating with at seat service and a meal included. Not sure how that compared with average mileage rates at the time, but I felt it was definitely well worth it, and so did everyone else I spoke to on it. In perspective, in 1968 many people earned around £20 a week.

 

[Lloyds siding]

Were there any steam hauled freight or irregular working after August 1968?

 

[oldman]

Steam continued in the North West until August 1968 where there were some long distance services on the West Coast Main Line north of Crewe towards Glasgow but unsure what or where.?

Some time in the English school holidays of 1967, I was on the morning Liverpool-Glasgow when a Britannia replaced a failed 47. I think from Carlisle, certainly into Glasgow. My last regular steam ride.

 

[Bevan Price]

Were there any steam hauled freight or irregular working after August 1968?

None that I know of. There were a handful of freights on 3 August, and an engineers' train at Rose Grove on 4 August.
After that, I think there were a handful of light engine movements of withdrawn locos. going to preservation sites - I believe 73050 going to Peterborough (for Nene Valley line) was one such move.
A Black 5 (44888 - not in steam) was at the Derby Works open day in late August 1968, but sadly failed to get preserved.

 

[steamybrian]

Were there any steam hauled freight or irregular working after August 1968?

If one word - NO. There was a total ban except....
For several years afterwards the only steam hauled specials were with 4472 Flying Scotsman who Alan Pegler had a contract with BR.

I agree with Bevan Rice - see comment no.12 above

 

[47296lastduff]

Slightly bending the question terms, on 30/07/1966 I sampled the last class 1 passenger train to be booked for steam and electric and diesel haulage . The 0117 Manchester Picc to Cleethorpes started from a platform on the ac side, where a roadway allowed newspaper vans to pull alongside for easy loading. We had 42644 to Guide Bridge, then 27001 (class 77) to Penistone, then D6811 to Cleethorpes.

 

[WesternLancer]

It's great the way this thread has stimulated contribs from people who saw or rode on these last services. Superb. Many congrats to the OP for that!

For those of us too young to have been able to be there this is excellent.

 

[46223]

It's great the way this thread has stimulated contribs from people who saw or rode on these last services. Superb. Many congrats to the OP for that!

For those of us too young to have been able to be there this is excellent.

Well, I was there! A regular on the 'Belfast Boat Express' from Manchester Victoria to Heysham until the end of steam on that service in May 1968. The 12-44 and 20-50 Preston - Blackpool South, both steam jobs that summer, and was on the last service steam job of all, the 21-25 Preston to Liverpool Exchange behind 45318 on August 3rd 1968. Happy days!

 

[tbwbear]

Just about my first memory is seeing a steam locomotive running light engine through St Annes on Sea, on the Blackpool South branch.

I don’t know when it was, but I was born in 1964 and I think memories start around 4 don’t they?

That was the only time I saw one: just made it !

 

[Beebman]

I can thoroughly recommend a book published in 2018 by OPC/Crecy called "British Railways Steam 1968: The Final Chapters" by Stephen Leyland which is a diary of his chasing of steam in Lancashire as workings wound down during the final months. Most of his travelling was between Manchester Victoria, Preston, Liverpool Exchange, Heysham and Blackpool South and he goes into a lot of detail about the final scheduled passenger workings as well as railtours, parcels and freight. He did try to find any unusual steam-hauled passenger workings but with little success, however on Easter Monday that year he chanced a visit to Blackpool North and he managed to find and travel behind 45268 on a relief service to Accrington. A very interesting book with many photos!

 

[Taunton]

Tebay shed provided steam bankers, including the occasional heavy passenger train with nothing more than a struggling Class 40, until shortly before the end of steam in 1968, and even after closure Carnforth continued to supply locos for this. It seems there were never diesel bankers provided, the end of steam coinciding with the decision to end unfitted freight services over Shap, they were diverted either by Barrow or by Hellifield.

 

[The DJ]

Apologies for the confusion. I was referring to scheduled passenger services. I confess I have no interest in freight or freight workings.

 

[WesternLancer]

Well, I was there! A regular on the 'Belfast Boat Express' from Manchester Victoria to Heysham until the end of steam on that service in May 1968. The 12-44 and 20-50 Preston - Blackpool South, both steam jobs that summer, and was on the last service steam job of all, the 21-25 Preston to Liverpool Exchange behind 45318 on August 3rd 1968. Happy days!

Great stuff! What route did the Heysham service take? Also - in those final days were there lots of enthusiasts on board those services or just a few more than you would expect? I imagine in some ways the mood must have been rather sombre / sad?

 

[Cowley]

Great stuff! What route did the Heysham service take? Also - in those final days were there lots of enthusiasts on board those services or just a few more than you would expect? I imagine in some ways the mood must have been rather sombre / sad?

I think there were a couple of people on here that enjoyed some of those last steam workings including @70014IronDuke possibly?

 

[randyrippley]

Tebay shed provided steam bankers, including the occasional heavy passenger train with nothing more than a struggling Class 40, until shortly before the end of steam in 1968, and even after closure Carnforth continued to supply locos for this. It seems there were never diesel bankers provided, the end of steam coinciding with the decision to end unfitted freight services over Shap, they were diverted either by Barrow or by Hellifield.

I KNEW there was a hidden reason for keeping the S&C open....

 

[edwin_m]

The only "longish" steam workings in late 1967, and in 1968 were railtours, which (apart from the 15 Guinea Special) continued until 6 "final" specials on 4 August 1968.

For those of us too young to have been able to be there this is excellent.

I guess I could say I'm just on the cusp of that. One of my earliest memories is being taken to Saddleworth Viaduct to see what my mother said was "the last steam train" but was actually one of the railtours just preceding the 15 Guinea Special (it's identifiable on Six Bells Junction if anyone's interested). We have an 8mm film of it somewhere.

I don’t know when it was, but I was born in 1964 and I think memories start around 4 don’t they?

That was the only time I saw one: just made it !

Me too... although I may have seen one before and not remember, as I think I was taken on trains quite often as a toddler.

My own earliest memory was moving house just before my second birthday. So it's possible to remember from younger than 4, although I'm probably unusual in having an event to recall that was both memorable and dateable.

 

[randyrippley]

Were there any steam hauled freight or irregular working after August 1968?

I thought there were some cases where steam locos were involved in track removals on closed lines?

 

[Clarence Yard]

None with BR locos.