Landslip at Barnehurst

[rd749249]

According to Southeastern, a land slip at Barnehurst has completely shut the Bexleyheath line today. I've always wondered why there aren't more 'strategic' reversal facilities (is that the right word?) in place to at least run partial services to/from stations not affected, when a line is blocked.

More details on their website https://www.southeasternrailway.co.uk

 

[jopsuk]

crossovers allowing reversal are extra points and signals to maintain that could fail of their own accord. Identifying locations for "strategic" turn-backs would be quite a mammoth task.

 

[Antman]

According to Southeastern, a land slip at Barnehurst has completely shut the Bexleyheath line today. I've always wondered why there aren't more 'strategic' reversal facilities (is that the right word?) in place to at least run partial services to/from stations not affected, when a line is blocked.

More details on their website https://www.southeasternrailway.co.uk

Yes I thought the same thing, you would think it would be possible to run a service from London as far as Bexleyheath?

 

[theageofthetra]

Looks a right mess from these pictures. Just a few metres from when embankment stabilisation works were only finished last year. Mods can you rejig the link as posting on a mobile, thanks.
http://m.newsshopper.co.uk/news/141...elled_ALL_DAY_after__landslip__at_Barnehurst/

 

[kentman]

From https://twitter.com/Se_Railway

More images (larger): https://t.co/65khK9QTfO

 

[ComUtoR]

Not sure what the point would be to run a service into Bexleyheath. You could still have a situation where the landslip was before the point of reversal.

That part of Kent is still served by the other two routes that converge at Dartford as well as being able to loop back on it self. The bus network is also quite extensive.

As to the landslip. Is it the same place as usual ? There was one a wile back and a load of remedial work was done to shore up the bank.

Cheers Kentman. You can see the new banking slightly further down.

 

[Antman]

Not sure what the point would be to run a service into Bexleyheath. You could still have a situation where the landslip was before the point of reversal.

That part of Kent is still served by the other two routes that converge at Dartford as well as being able to loop back on it self. The bus network is also quite extensive.

As to the landslip. Is it the same place as usual ? There was one a wile back and a load of remedial work was done to shore up the bank.

Cheers Kentman. You can see the new banking slightly further down.

Quite obviously the point would be maintaining a service between Bexleyheath and London.

Not surprisingly the other routes into London, and indeed local buses, have been totally swamped with demand!

 

[ComUtoR]

Why Bexleyheath ? What happens when there is a problem between London and Bexleyheath ?

It's very easy to go back from Dartford to Bexleyheath and Local buses come in from all directions. I find it hard to justify a turnback at Bexleyheath when the area is well served by other routes and local transport.

 

[kentman]

There are two turn back sidings on the 3 lines, at Sidcup and Plumstead. These have walkways to change ends. The other trailing crossovers (? Charlton,Kidbrooke, Barnehurst, Crayford), given their direction and location before the up platforms look more about extricating trains in a pickle back to the country direction as the driver can change ends on the platform and they have a protecting signal for the move.

I've seen them rarely used for a shuttle service during engineering works in the London direction, I assume due to issues changing ends mid line. Also not sure if it can be done in service either, as a ground position light move.

 

[bicbasher]

The Bexleyheath line will be closed all day Wednesday as well.

 

[frodshamfella]

I used to commute from Bexleyheath in the 80s to Charing Cross then Cannon Street...from recollection there was crossovers at Kidbrook Falconwood and Barnehurst. I happened to go down the line from Falconwood to London via Slade Green recently, I think the Falconwood crossover has been removed.

 

[kentman]

http://www.networkrailmediacentre.co.uk/news/barnehurst-landslip-railway-to-reopen-on-thursday-morning

More than 200 tonnes of trees, soil and debris slid onto the railway tracks near the station at around 10pm . Nobody was hurt and trains were stopped from running after a Southeastern train driver alerted staff.

 

[island]

Southeastern have tweeted that there will be no trains on the line until at least Friday.
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In the interest of maintaining capacity, is it achievable (in theory at least) to run a train on the down line as far as Welling or Bexleyheath, and then wrong way up the down line, crossing over to the up at Kidbrooke? Might have to go pilotman for the wrong way working.

 

[Llanigraham]

Unlikely if there is working involving mechanical diggers on the other line.
And it is also possible that they are using that line to load the "muck" into wagons.

 

[Antman]

Apparently a second landslip has occurred today

 

[ScotGG]

Yep no running tomorrow now. The closure of a very busy line is causing huge amounts of problems across SE London but the press have pretty much ignored. Roads are clogged (even more than normal) and other lines packed (again even more than normal). The press are focusing instead on nonsense about sun on a visor delaying a train for 5 mins. If it was in north or east London where the journos live...

 

[Antman]

Yep no running tomorrow now. The closure of a very busy line is causing huge amounts of problems across SE London but the press have pretty much ignored. Roads are clogged (even more than normal) and other lines packed (again even more than normal). The press are focusing instead on nonsense about sun on a visor delaying a train for 5 mins. If it was in north or east London where the journos live...

In fairness the press have just reported what Southeastern (perhaps unwisely?) posted on twitter. And yes serious problems on the roads and the local bus network is swamped
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Southeastern have tweeted that there will be no trains on the line until at least Friday.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
In the interest of maintaining capacity, is it achievable (in theory at least) to run a train on the down line as far as Welling or Bexleyheath, and then wrong way up the down line, crossing over to the up at Kidbrooke? Might have to go pilotman for the wrong way working.

A service as far as Kidbrooke would be better than nothing, any reason why that can't be done?

 

[MikeWh]

In fairness the press have just reported what Southeastern (perhaps unwisely?) posted on twitter. And yes serious problems on the roads and the local bus network is swamped
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A service as far as Kidbrooke would be better than nothing, any reason why that can't be done?

As there are already services to Blackheath, would one extra stop with an unusual movement afterwards really be cost effective.

 

[DynamicSpirit]

I was somewhat amused by this tweet yesterday from David Evenett, MP for Bexleyheath and Crayford, in response to the landslip - clearly the kind of event that no one could have anticipated, but it looks like he's sensed an opportunity to bash the train company over it:

Concerned to hear about another landslip, causing trains to be cancelled all day. Shall be taking this up with Network Rail & Southeastern

My immediate reaction was, like, what's he going to tell them? "Please magically make sure that there will never ever be any more landslips"? "Please fit snow-ploughs to your trains so they can go through any landslips that happen in the future"?

(Later tweets clarify that he'll be raising issues like, why didn't they put on more replacement buses, which seems a little more sensible, although the practical difficulties in bringing in sufficient buses to replace a busy commuter line at rush hour at such short notice should be obvious).

 

[DarloRich]

I was somewhat amused by this tweet yesterday from David Evenett, MP for Bexleyheath and Crayford, in response to the landslip - clearly the kind of event that no one could have anticipated, but it looks like he's sensed an opportunity to bash the train company over it

Hopefully just seeking to understand the situation, whats being done to fix it, what the options for travel are, timescales, opportunity to visit the site and have a picture taken looking concerned etc.

The wording makes the MP look like they are in charge and doing something when really they are not. They are basically asking for a briefing!

 

[Antman]

As there are already services to Blackheath, would one extra stop with an unusual movement afterwards really be cost effective.

There is a very limited peak hour service at Blackheath. Given the chaos on the road network, and local buses, whatever service can be run should be run.
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I was somewhat amused by this tweet yesterday from David Evenett, MP for Bexleyheath and Crayford, in response to the landslip - clearly the kind of event that no one could have anticipated, but it looks like he's sensed an opportunity to bash the train company over it:



My immediate reaction was, like, what's he going to tell them? "Please magically make sure that there will never ever be any more landslips"? "Please fit snow-ploughs to your trains so they can go through any landslips that happen in the future"?

(Later tweets clarify that he'll be raising issues like, why didn't they put on more replacement buses, which seems a little more sensible, although the practical difficulties in bringing in sufficient buses to replace a busy commuter line at rush hour at such short notice should be obvious).

Playing devils advocate I don't think his comments are unreasonable

I'm not sure about replacement buses, people prefer to use service buses that they are familiar with. Maybe any RRB's should just run as extras on the 89 route which really has been rammed.

 

[ComUtoR]

I was somewhat amused by this tweet yesterday from David Evenett, MP for Bexleyheath and Crayford, in response to the landslip - clearly the kind of event that no one could have anticipated, but it looks like he's sensed an opportunity to bash the train company over it:

Not sure he was bashing anyone over it but I was also concerned. That section slipped last year and they did do some remedial work. I would be asking questions as to was the rest of that bank inspected and why such a small section was shored up and not the entire bank. It wouldn't surprise me if it slips again.

 

[island]

Unlikely if there is working involving mechanical diggers on the other line.
And it is also possible that they are using that line to load the "muck" into wagons.

I was suggesting running as far as the stop before the landslip.

However as it's DOO there will be no monitors at the "wrong" end of the platforms so you'd need dispatchers at each station and it would only support 2tph at best, so not worth it. Assuming SET even has spare dispatchers to begin with.

 

[Antman]

I was suggesting running as far as the stop before the landslip.

However as it's DOO there will be no monitors at the "wrong" end of the platforms so you'd need dispatchers at each station and it would only support 2tph at best, so not worth it. Assuming SET even has spare dispatchers to begin with.

I don't think the not worth it argument is acceptable given the disruption this has caused and every effort should be made to provide whatever service is possible.

 

[kentman]

Looking at the latest picture : https://twitter.com/Se_Railway/status/687575395223388160

Looks like quite some stabilization work is required on the embankment.

 

[Antman]

The line reopens tomorrow morning!

 

[ScotGG]

Already looking horrible on other lines. Big crowding and delays.

One thing I noticed was that trains on other lines have had extra stops added in yet no change to timetables as they can easily slot them in. Shows how much padding is in the semi-fasts which normally sit at each station for a couple of minutes.

 

[ComUtoR]

Shows how much padding is in the semi-fasts which normally sit at each station for a couple of minutes.

Considering I drive those semi-fasts I really don't see that they sit as each station for a couple of minutes. Some of those semi fasts are quite packed and station dwell times are usually down to the volume of passengers alighting.

 

[ScotGG]

Considering I drive those semi-fasts I really don't see that they sit as each station for a couple of minutes. Some of those semi fasts are quite packed and station dwell times are usually down to the volume of passengers alighting.

You'd know more than me but it often seems the ones I sometimes take in the morning into London can make up time pretty easily up to Dartford from Medway if any delays, then it normally gets to Abbey Wood 2 minutes early, then Woolwich 1-2 mins early, Charlton is normally not early and a usual dwell time as seen on all stoppers, then Greenwich often has 2 mins sitting.

On the return the trip from L bridge to Greenwich the train is almost always a bit early with a minute or 90s seconds more dwell there than an all stopper, and similar happens at most stations heading back.

 

[IanKR]

Maybe any RRB's should just run as extras on the 89 route which really has been rammed.

And the 132.
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Looking at the latest picture : https://twitter.com/Se_Railway/status/687575395223388160

Looks like quite some stabilization work is required on the embankment.

And fixing/testing damaged lineside signalling equipment. Some of those tweeters are pretty ignorant.
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The line reopens tomorrow morning!

Is that official? I've seen this update which says it will be open tomorrow but it was posted yesterday:
http://www.networkrail.co.uk/news/2016/jan/railway-Barnehurst-reopen-Thursday-landslip/?cd=1
... could be premature?