Lancashire Bus Tenders - March 2025

[peterblue]

Indeed, but then why not run straight from Farington Moss to Seven Stars? Leyland town centre isn't really much of a destination.

Indeed, which is useful, but it still won't get much usage because of the fare system I think.

The town centre isn't, but the Tesco is, and gets a reasonable draw from some of the villages south.

 

[preston85]

Can I ask why?
There will still be a service between Wigan, Leyland and Preston, all that changes apart from the operator will be the route between Preston and Leyland. Lancashire County Council's day and weekly tickets will be available which will also allow travel on other tendered routes.

The issue with Lancashire County Council’s tickets is that nobody really knows about them - even drivers. Most drivers can’t sell them as they’ve never heard of them. Other companies refuse to accept them if they’ve been issued on another operator’s bus (all on LCC routes). In theory the tickets are good value, but there’s very little uptake because they’re not promoted and people don’t know. Not being valid on commercial services is a huge barrier. There needs to be a sensibly priced ticket you can use on any service in Lancashire.

Have a go at trying to use a Lancashire day or weekly from another operator on Stagecoach (say, the P1 or Chorley 2 or something). I guarantee you’ll have hassle. And try asking to it one. I bet they won’t be able to. Let alone advise a customer to buy one.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 14 Feb 2025 ==

The loss of fares that allow more through connectivity will significantly limit the appeal of the bus. The LCC tickets are more expensive than operator only tickets and they only work on the subsided sections, so much less useful.

I don't doubt their ability to supply reliable bus services at all, just ones that people will use (especially at £3!)

The problem with Holmeswood is their buses - not the reliability. Their buses are generally very poor quality compared to those of others - badly presented, often not clean internally and overall not a professional image (no livery, drivers not in uniform - etc). For a similar cost to the council, other operators are far better and will encourage much stronger usage. Stagecoach running the 110 would likely be 25-50% busier than Holmeswood on the same timetable as many people don’t see Holmeswood as a credible option. So a false economy as less fares revenue than going with a slightly more expensive bid.

 

[AlastairFraser]

The issue with Lancashire County Council’s tickets is that nobody really knows about them - even drivers. Most drivers can’t sell them as they’ve never heard of them. Other companies refuse to accept them if they’ve been issued on another operator’s bus (all on LCC routes). In theory the tickets are good value, but there’s very little uptake because they’re not promoted and people don’t know. Not being valid on commercial services is a huge barrier. There needs to be a sensibly priced ticket you can use on any service in Lancashire.

Have a go at trying to use a Lancashire day or weekly from another operator on Stagecoach (say, the P1 or Chorley 2 or something). I guarantee you’ll have hassle. And try asking to it one. I bet they won’t be able to. Let alone advise a customer to buy one.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 14 Feb 2025 ==


The problem with Holmeswood is their buses - not the reliability. Their buses are generally very poor quality compared to those of others - badly presented, often not clean internally and overall not a professional image (no livery, drivers not in uniform - etc). For a similar cost to the council, other operators are far better and will encourage much stronger usage. Stagecoach running the 110 would likely be 25-50% busier than Holmeswood on the same timetable as many people don’t see Holmeswood as a credible option. So a false economy as less fares revenue than going with a slightly more expensive bid.

I concur. It's a strange operator to award it to, maybe Stagecoach weren't interested.

 

[markymark2000]

The issue with Lancashire County Council’s tickets is that nobody really knows about them - even drivers. Most drivers can’t sell them as they’ve never heard of them. Other companies refuse to accept them if they’ve been issued on another operator’s bus (all on LCC routes). In theory the tickets are good value, but there’s very little uptake because they’re not promoted and people don’t know. Not being valid on commercial services is a huge barrier. There needs to be a sensibly priced ticket you can use on any service in Lancashire.

Have a go at trying to use a Lancashire day or weekly from another operator on Stagecoach (say, the P1 or Chorley 2 or something). I guarantee you’ll have hassle. And try asking to it one. I bet they won’t be able to. Let alone advise a customer to buy one.

The worst thing is, ticket acceptance could be easily resolved by making operators print the Lancashire County Council logo on top of the ticket rather than the normal operator name/logo. Same as most Merseyside operators do with Solo tickets.
It also doesn't help that the ticket is the wrong price on some operators ticket machines. Stagecoach on the 319 has the price as £8 but LCC advertise the ticket as costing £6.

You have got some great points though and I agree that it should be valid on commercial services.

I concur. It's a strange operator to award it to, maybe Stagecoach weren't interested.

Everything about these changes is strange though. Routes are as messy as a toddler with spaghetti. Awarded the contracts then doing a consultation on the changes (but the contracts are already awarded.....), then the actual awards have gone to seemingly odd firms. I can't see how Vision have bidded lower than other ops on so much, such as Pilkingtons losing work

 

[AlastairFraser]

Everything about these changes is strange though. Routes are as messy as a toddler with spaghetti. Awarded the contracts then doing a consultation on the changes (but the contracts are already awarded.....), then the actual awards have gone to seemingly odd firms. I can't see how Vision have bidded lower than other ops on so much, such as Pilkingtons losing work

Vision had less work after GM franchising and needed a big chunk to keep them going, I'd say.
Agree with you on the tender route design being poor

 

[DaveTaylor2112]

A few things to bear in mind. Firstly, particularly around Preston, Stagecoach do not communicate and have just been leaving passengers with no bus and no information, and Preston Bus are nearly as bad. Also, the new network is designed around the idea of increasing connectivity between different parts of South Ribble and West Lancashire, which is what locals are asking for. As for ticketing, getting anybody to work together in Lancashire seems to be almost impossible.

 

[markymark2000]

Also, the new network is designed around the idea of increasing connectivity between different parts of South Ribble and West Lancashire, which is what locals are asking for.

I can't think of anyone who in their right mind, would ask for buses to go here, there and everywhere and serve half of the county to get to where they want to go. I'm half expecting a new Geoff Marshall series, 'All the Preston to Chorley routes'. With so many routes, less confident travellers have a good chance of ending up on the wrong bus and claiming 7 routes between the two towns is confusing. Sometimes it has to be accepted that every village does not need a link to every town and sometimes having people change buses is in their for a simpler network and improved punctuality.
Perhaps changing buses wouldn't be so bad if some Leyland interchange was improved. If shelters were upgraded and everyone stopped in Tesco, people may be more willing to change buses, but people don't want to faff around walking between bus stops to change buses and wait at low quality stops.

It's also a shame that this 'increasing connectivity' never managed to stretch as far as improving links to Runshaw College. They have an abundance of college buses which are literally just there because the core bus network fails to provide links to the college and this is further not helped by this new network.

As for ticketing, getting anybody to work together in Lancashire seems to be almost impossible.

There are already 2 schemes so not sure how impossible it is. Fylde Coast and Preston have the 'Anybus' tickets The issue is that the council and/or operators have made it deliberately difficult to access the tickets. They insist that you sign up for a smartcard to get the ticket which is an absolute joke, and no wonder that people aren't aware of the tickets. At a time when smartcards are being phased out by operators (GoAhead Group) and more people want to buy tickets on apps or on the bus, deliberately making tickets smartcard only is baffling and people (whoever it is who decided it should be this way), needs to give their heads a wobble.

Vision had less work after GM franchising and needed a big chunk to keep them going, I'd say.

Maybe wouldn't be so bad if Vision decided they wanted to comply with Bus Open Data laws.

 

[AlastairFraser]

Maybe wouldn't be so bad if Vision decided they wanted to comply with Bus Open Data laws.

I can't comment on that personally, but franchising was always going to be difficult for smaller operators.

 

[Andyh82]

Is there anywhere in Preston or Chorley where printed bus timetables can be picked up

I believe they are kept behind the counter in the bus stations, but the one in Preston is only manned something stupid like one hour a day on weekdays only and the one in Chorley isn’t particularly manned at all? Is this still the case and is there anywhere else?

 

[peterblue]

Is there anywhere in Preston or Chorley where printed bus timetables can be picked up

I believe they are kept behind the counter in the bus stations, but the one in Preston is only manned something stupid like one hour a day on weekdays only and the one in Chorley isn’t particularly manned at all? Is this still the case and is there anywhere else?

You'll be able to find them on the buses also, drivers normally keep a handful on standby. You will also definitely be able to get a copy at Chorley bus station also.

 

[class17]

Andyh82 said:
Is there anywhere in Preston or Chorley where printed bus timetables can be picked up

I believe they are kept behind the counter in the bus stations, but the one in Preston is only manned something stupid like one hour a day on weekdays only and the one in Chorley isn’t particularly manned at all? Is this still the case and is there anywhere else?
You'll be able to find them on the buses also, drivers normally keep a handful on standby. You will also definitely be able to get a copy at Chorley bus station also.

You'll be able to find them on the buses also, drivers normally keep a handful on standby. You will also definitely be able to get a copy at Chorley bus station also.

Chorley bus station will have them, apart from when they have all gone which does happen. They are normally on display to be taken. The libraries are stocking them and perhaps less chance of them running out.
Not sure bus drivers have them they rarely have have any information on the tendered services.
The printed bus timetable is very good and has a handy map inside. I wonder if Lancashire County Council transport team would send you a PDF if you asked for one?

 

[Mollman]

Is there anywhere in Preston or Chorley where printed bus timetables can be picked up

I believe they are kept behind the counter in the bus stations, but the one in Preston is only manned something stupid like one hour a day on weekdays only and the one in Chorley isn’t particularly manned at all? Is this still the case and is there anywhere else?

I'll DM you a copy.

 

[52290]

I'll DM you a copy.

The information counter at Chorley bus station was manned at 17.45 tonight and was handing the new LCC timetables out on request.

 

[Andyh82]

I don’t think it’s been mentioned yet, but it seems the Blackburn Outer Circle is coming back next month for the first time since 2016

Operated by Vision Bus, every 75 minutes off peak as services 5A/5C, with an additional service on the same frequency being overlaid on top at peak times 55A/55C meaning a combined every 30-45 minutes frequency

New Blackburn Services commencing soon | Vision Bus

www.visionbus.co.uk

All aboard another reinstated bus route!

Following its departure in 2016, Blackburn’s Outer Circle bus route is back in action from May. Thanks to the Bus Service Improvement Plan, which saw the council secure around £3.7 million of gover…

theshuttle.org.uk

 

[AlastairFraser]

I don’t think it’s been mentioned yet, but it seems the Blackburn Outer Circle is coming back next month for the first time since 2016

Operated by Vision Bus, every 75 minutes off peak as services 5A/5C, with an additional service on the same frequency being overlaid on top at peak times 55A/55C meaning a combined every 30-45 minutes frequency

New Blackburn Services commencing soon | Vision Bus

www.visionbus.co.uk

All aboard another reinstated bus route!

Following its departure in 2016, Blackburn’s Outer Circle bus route is back in action from May. Thanks to the Bus Service Improvement Plan, which saw the council secure around £3.7 million of gover…

theshuttle.org.uk

Great news. This will make getting from the northern/western suburbs to Royal Blackburn Hospital and the Peel Centre so much easier.